UND vs Mayville (11/15 7 PM)

[darell1976]

Just now, jdub27 said:

A lot of women's team can make as much traveling for guarantees as playing at home. The same isn't the case for men's teams. 

You also can't force teams to sign a home and home, especially when they have closer options. There isn't a single person who doesn't wish there wasn't at least another D1 game or two.  

Like Northernraider said 346 DI teams and all we can get at home is because of an agreed home/home. If it wasn't for the Bison agreeing to this we would have ZERO DI non conference games at home. That's pathetic. And doesn't the basketball scheduling fall on the coach instead of the AD?

[darell1976]

3 minutes ago, the green team said:

Do you know what is considered a money game in Women's College Basketball?  About 20k.  A money game in Men's college basketball like UND going to Wisconsin 90 to 110K.  Now lets reverse it what if UND wants to bring into a mid to low major for just a one off game how much would that mid to low major need to consider it? My understanding is 40 to 60K. 40 if you're beatable and closer ro 60 if that isnt a given from what I hear.  I gaurantee you that Iowa isn't getting anything like that or requesting that to come play here tomorrow night.  Why?  Because it's womens basketball and the fiscal dynamics are completely different than that of Men's basketball.   Sadly, UND's Athletics budget is such right now that there is no way to pony up to bring in a team...and it would have taken some ponying too, at least this year, because the word is out that we may actually be decent, and nobody is going to come and risk a loss without some definite coin in the pocket.   Bottom line, we need coin or to have our school in a different part of the country where there are many D1's like a Weber State-  they can arrange a Utah State(Logan), BYU (Provo) Utah(SLC) or Utah Valley(Orem)-all are just down the road.  It's an entirely different game for Men's basketball scheduling than it is for women.

UND can't pony up USD, SDSU, Omaha, Denver, any DI Wisconsin teams not named Badgers. We can't be that hurt for money because Bincitysioux says we are fine, that's why we should stay in the Big Sky. We should have tons of Summmit League opponents at the Betty every year by staying in the Big Sky and scheduling closer opponents. 

[jdub27]

2 minutes ago, darell1976 said:

UND can't pony up USD, SDSU, Omaha, Denver, any DI Wisconsin teams not named Badgers. We can't be that hurt for money because Bincitysioux says we are fine, that's why we should stay in the Big Sky. We should have tons of Summmit League opponents at the Betty every year by staying in the Big Sky and scheduling closer opponents. 

Get a clue instead of cluelessly bitching.

[darell1976]

9 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Get a clue instead of cluelessly bitching.

I have a clue, look at our very pathetic non-conference home games since entering the DI era and it sucks. Brian Jones (I know your hero) does a crappy job of scheduling opponents not named Crown, presentation or a city in North Dakota not located in Fargo. I have a right to complain along with Northernraider does, or are you saying his thought doesn't matter either. Don't like it don't comment on it.

[UNDBIZ]

Just now, darell1976 said:

I have a clue, look at our very pathetic non-conference home games securing our DI era and it sucks. Brian Jones (I know your hero) does a crappy job of scheduling opponents not named Crown, presentation or a city in North Dakota not located in Fargo. I have a right to complain along with Northernraider does or are ou saying his thought doesn't matter either. Don't like it don't comment on it.

1. I don't recall jdub defending Jones as a coach.

2. You aren't going to attend the games anyway. 

[darell1976]

1 hour ago, northernraider said:

3 minutes ago, UNDBIZ said:

1. I don't recall jdub defending Jones as a coach.

2. You aren't going to attend the games anyway. 

 

He has defended jones as a coach for a long time "see fire jones thread". 

What does my attendance have to do with scheduling DI non conference opponents at home. Games don't count unless I am there. That's a new one. 

[UNDBIZ]

1 minute ago, darell1976 said:

He has defended jones as a coach for a long time "see fire jones thread". 

What does my attendance have to do with scheduling DI non conference opponents at home. Games don't count unless I am there. That's a new one. 

You complain about UND not spending money more than anyone and you contribute nothing. It gets old. 

[jdub27]

5 minutes ago, darell1976 said:

He has defended jones as a coach for a long time "see fire jones thread". 

What does my attendance have to do with scheduling DI non conference opponents at home. Games don't count unless I am there. That's a new one. 

No, I've explained why he still has a job. Big difference even though you apparently can't figure it out. 

If you don't get how people not attending games effects a team's scheduling, then you are more clueless than I thought. You are being singled out because you complain the loudest. People have laid out multiple, correct explanations in the last few posts and you gloss right over them. 

[darell1976]

1 minute ago, UNDBIZ said:

You complain about UND not spending money more than anyone and you contribute nothing. It gets old. 

I contribute nothing? I am a die hard fan who was going to games since I was 8 years old. I have attended 2 football games this season, plus i actively partake in this non affiliated message board about the school I love. Don't you dare tell me I contribute nothing. As a moderator you should be ashamed by making a statement like that about an active member. Maybe Jim Dahl needs to revolk your moderator privledge. 

[darell1976]

4 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

No, I've explained why he still has a job. Big difference even though you apparently can't figure it out. 

If you don't get how people not attending games effects how a team's scheduling, then you are more clueless than I thought. You are being singled out because you complain the loudest. 

So it's attendance that causes people not to show up against Crown College or Dickinson State. Think about that. 

[Cratter]

If UND is going to schedule non D1 home games, can we at least spend a tiny amount of money and get say a St Cloud State at least.

[sioux24/7]

1 minute ago, Cratter said:

If UND is going to schedule non D1 home games, can we at least spend a tiny amount of money and get say a St Cloud State at least.

Agreed. SCSU, Augie, Concordia, Northern this year would have been cool with Mack Arvidson there. 

[UNDBIZ]

7 minutes ago, Cratter said:

If UND is going to schedule non D1 home games, can we at least spend a tiny amount of money and get say a St Cloud State at least.

We might lose then. 

[jdub27]

34 minutes ago, darell1976 said:

So it's attendance that causes people not to show up against Crown College or Dickinson State. Think about that. 

I would but it honestly doesn't make sense and I'm not going to try to decipher what you mean. There was 100 less people at the Crown game on a Friday afternoon then there were at the UNI game. Think about that. 

Do you want to venture to guess how much money UND would have lost on the UNI game last year due to low attendance if they would have paid them to come to Grand Forks instead of agreeing to a 3 for 1 (and even at that, it was still a favor). I'm guessing they probably came out behind by getting a return game instead of taking 3 paid games because attendance was poor.

[darell1976]

Since 2012 our first season in the Big Sky here is the DI home non-conference teams we have played:

2012-13: UMKC (lost), Bowling Green (won)

2013-14: NDSU (won), South Dakota St (lost)

2014-15: Omaha (lost)

2015-16: UNI (lost), NDSU (lost) 

2015-16 NDSU (to be played)

Combined record 2-5

Our last year in the GWC (2011-12) we had 5 home DI non-conference games (UND went 4-1 with wins over Montana, NDSU, SDSU, Idaho State, loss to WIU).

Maybe its more about the record than money. 

[82SiouxGuy]

1 hour ago, darell1976 said:

I contribute nothing? I am a die hard fan who was going to games since I was 8 years old. I have attended 2 football games this season, plus i actively partake in this non affiliated message board about the school I love. Don't you dare tell me I contribute nothing. As a moderator you should be ashamed by making a statement like that about an active member. Maybe Jim Dahl needs to revolk your moderator privledge. 

How does you posting on this board help UND financially? That is the contribution that counts for UND. They really don't care if you post here. So your contribution to UND is the cost of tickets for 2 football games.

As has been posted in other threads, scheduling in Division I men's basketball is different from all other sports. Schools and entire conferences are broken up into levels, your ability to schedule depends a great deal on your level. For instance you have the Power 5 conferences. Even these schools actually have 2 levels. The upper level schools play a majority of their non-conference games at home. Most of the home games are Power 5 schools, some mid-majors, occasionally a low level DI, but they sometimes play DII schools. They will travel to other upper level Power 5 conference schools, rarely to any others. Most of the traveling are home and homes or for tournaments.

Lower level Power 5 schools also play a majority of their non-conference games at home. Some are equal level, some mid-majors, some low level DI and a few DII. They play tournaments on the road and play home and home series with similar programs. They may do a home and home with a top end mid-major, but rarely anyone at a lower level.

Mid-majors play as many home games as they can. Home games are usually other mid-majors, low level DI schools and even some DIIs. They will take pay games at Power 5 conference schools. They play tournaments. They schedule home and homes with other mid-majors. Very rarely do they travel to low level DI schools.

Low level DI are single bid conferences like the Summit and Big Sky. They play very few home non-conference games. They play tournaments to make a few bucks. They play pay games at upper levels, the higher the level the more they can make. They play a few home games against DII schools. There are 2 major factors that can help some low level DI schools schedule more home games than others. One is location. If they are located reasonably close to other low level or mid-major schools that are in a different conference, the schools can schedule home and homes to get cheap games and possibly draw better than average crowds because of local awareness. A few schools have a large enough attendance to be able to pay a decent amount for a pay game. If you can regularly attract 5-8,000 for games, you can afford to pay another low level DI school or even some mid-majors a large enough sum to show up. Very few low level schools have this luxury. And has been noted before, your ability to compete will also be a factor. Schools would rather play teams they think they can beat rather than lose to a lower level school.

UND has the "best" of all worlds for DI basketball scheduling. They belong to a low level conference. They have had enough talent most of the last few years to be dangerous. The only DI that is really close is NDSU. The next couple are the South Dakota schools, that have plenty of other options, or U of Minnesota which is Power 5 and not traveling to Grand Forks. UND is the furthest out of the way for teams to travel. And the attendance for basketball at UND is not high enough to pay a big payout for a game. UND will have trouble scheduling home non-conference games until the dynamic changes.

You keep comparing to NDSU. They more than likely lost money paying Arkansas State to play in a special game, the re-opening of the facility. That would be bad business on a regular basis. They have UND. And they have what appears to be the back end of a home and home with Davis. Throw out the Ark State game, since that type event probably isn't normal, and they would have 2 DI games. Last year they had 3 including Montana, Montana State and North Carolina A&T. UND had a 2nd DI game scheduled this year, but the team backed out. You can't force schools to travel to Grand Forks. SDSU is another example. This year they have 3 home DI non-conference games. Last year they had 2. South Dakota has 4 this year (3 Big Sky plus Bowling Green), but last year they had 2. The Dakota schools are normally going to have 2 or 3 home DI non-conference games most years. Grand Forks is at the end of the line and the furthest from everyone else, so they are going to have the most trouble scheduling.

[darell1976]

13 minutes ago, 82SiouxGuy said:

How does you posting on this board help UND financially? That is the contribution that counts for UND. They really don't care if you post here. So your contribution to UND is the cost of tickets for 2 football games.

As has been posted in other threads, scheduling in Division I men's basketball is different from all other sports. Schools and entire conferences are broken up into levels, your ability to schedule depends a great deal on your level. For instance you have the Power 5 conferences. Even these schools actually have 2 levels. The upper level schools play a majority of their non-conference games at home. Most of the home games are Power 5 schools, some mid-majors, occasionally a low level DI, but they sometimes play DII schools. They will travel to other upper level Power 5 conference schools, rarely to any others. Most of the traveling are home and homes or for tournaments.

Lower level Power 5 schools also play a majority of their non-conference games at home. Some are equal level, some mid-majors, some low level DI and a few DII. They play tournaments on the road and play home and home series with similar programs. They may do a home and home with a top end mid-major, but rarely anyone at a lower level.

Mid-majors play as many home games as they can. Home games are usually other mid-majors, low level DI schools and even some DIIs. They will take pay games at Power 5 conference schools. They play tournaments. They schedule home and homes with other mid-majors. Very rarely do they travel to low level DI schools.

Low level DI are single bid conferences like the Summit and Big Sky. They play very few home non-conference games. They play tournaments to make a few bucks. They play pay games at upper levels, the higher the level the more they can make. They play a few home games against DII schools. There are 2 major factors that can help some low level DI schools schedule more home games than others. One is location. If they are located reasonably close to other low level or mid-major schools that are in a different conference, the schools can schedule home and homes to get cheap games and possibly draw better than average crowds because of local awareness. A few schools have a large enough attendance to be able to pay a decent amount for a pay game. If you can regularly attract 5-8,000 for games, you can afford to pay another low level DI school or even some mid-majors a large enough sum to show up. Very few low level schools have this luxury. And has been noted before, your ability to compete will also be a factor. Schools would rather play teams they think they can beat rather than lose to a lower level school.

UND has the "best" of all worlds for DI basketball scheduling. They belong to a low level conference. They have had enough talent most of the last few years to be dangerous. The only DI that is really close is NDSU. The next couple are the South Dakota schools, that have plenty of other options, or U of Minnesota which is Power 5 and not traveling to Grand Forks. UND is the furthest out of the way for teams to travel. And the attendance for basketball at UND is not high enough to pay a big payout for a game. UND will have trouble scheduling home non-conference games until the dynamic changes.

You keep comparing to NDSU. They more than likely lost money paying Arkansas State to play in a special game, the re-opening of the facility. That would be bad business on a regular basis. They have UND. And they have what appears to be the back end of a home and home with Davis. Throw out the Ark State game, since that type event probably isn't normal, and they would have 2 DI games. Last year they had 3 including Montana, Montana State and North Carolina A&T. UND had a 2nd DI game scheduled this year, but the team backed out. You can't force schools to travel to Grand Forks. SDSU is another example. This year they have 3 home DI non-conference games. Last year they had 2. South Dakota has 4 this year (3 Big Sky plus Bowling Green), but last year they had 2. The Dakota schools are normally going to have 2 or 3 home DI non-conference games most years. Grand Forks is at the end of the line and the furthest from everyone else, so they are going to have the most trouble scheduling.

I guess we will see what happens next year when the new schedule comes out. 

[jimdahl]

9 hours ago, darell1976 said:

I contribute nothing? I am a die hard fan who was going to games since I was 8 years old. I have attended 2 football games this season, plus i actively partake in this non affiliated message board about the school I love. Don't you dare tell me I contribute nothing. As a moderator you should be ashamed by making a statement like that about an active member. Maybe Jim Dahl needs to revolk your moderator privledge. 

Yep, let's all keep the discussions about the topic and not personal details of other posters. Thanks!

[jdub27]

7 hours ago, darell1976 said:

I guess we will see what happens next year when the new schedule comes out. 

Serious question: If you don't attend the home games anyway, why does it even matter to you? When's the last game you attended at the Betty and how many have you been to in the last 5 years?

[darell1976]

24 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Serious question: If you don't attend the home games anyway, why does it even matter to you? When's the last game you attended at the Betty and how many have you been to in the last 5 years?

Let me ask you this when someone besides me says why don't they schedule the other 346 DI teams do you get online and ask them the last home game they attended and how many have they been to in five years. Cause I don't see that towards the other people that have commented about the lack of DI teams at home. 

[darell1976]

27 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Serious question: If you don't attend the home games anyway, why does it even matter to you? When's the last game you attended at the Betty and how many have you been to in the last 5 years?

Since your first question is the only fair one I will directly answer that with this: I want to see UND play teams of equal caliper all the time. We did the rollercoaster of upper level teams, level teams and then lower level teams during transition in all sports. Now it seems we only see the Bison with an occasional one other team. Seeing us playing Crown or Mayville does nothing for the excitement level. They might as well be exhibition games. I do agree with someone that said if they play non DI's play St.Cloud or Augie or even Moorhead State. 

[jdub27]

10 minutes ago, darell1976 said:

Let me ask you this when someone besides me says why don't they schedule the other 346 DI teams do you get online and ask them the last home game they attended and how many have they been to in five years. Cause I don't see that towards the other people that have commented about the lack of DI teams at home. 

Because you complain about it the most and have admitted how you support the teams.

 

3 minutes ago, darell1976 said:

Since your first question is the only fair one I will directly answer that with this: I want to see UND play teams of equal caliper all the time. We did the rollercoaster of upper level teams, level teams and then lower level teams during transition in all sports. Now it seems we only see the Bison with an occasional one other team. Seeing us playing Crown or Mayville does nothing for the excitement level. They might as well be exhibition games. I do agree with someone that said if they play non DI's play St.Cloud or Augie or even Moorhead State. 

Please point out to me where anyone is excited about the schedule. Understanding the reality of it doesn't mean you support it. I've accepted it because I know the AD and staff tried what they could to get better games. Pretty much every school in the nation plays a handful of games against lower level competition, it is better than nothing. Again, attendance for Crown College was 100 less than against a UNI team that had just beat #1 North Carolina. So I'm not sure exactly what will cause the "excitement level" to go up.

[darell1976]

3 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Because you complain about it the most and have admitted how you support the teams.

 

Please point out to me where anyone is excited about the schedule. Understanding the reality of it doesn't mean you support it. I've accepted it because I know the AD and staff tried what they could to get better games. Pretty much every school in the nation plays a handful of games against lower level competition, it is better than nothing. Again, attendance for Crown College was 100 less than against a UNI team that had just beat #1 North Carolina. So I'm not sure exactly what will cause the "excitement level" to go up.

Someone said we had another team lined up but backed out, do you know who that was?

[jdub27]

Just now, darell1976 said:

Someone said we had another team lined up but backed out, do you know who that was?

The exact team? Pretty sure but not positive enough to state it. I believe it was a former NCC team that is now in the Summit.

[nodak651]

I still blame Jones for the schedule.  How much did that Italy trip cost?  They claimed that they raised the cash for it by playing money games.  I don't see why they can't play more money games to get some cash to bring teams to the Betty.  I mean, it's not like Jones does well in non conference games anyway...  It would also help our RPI if we made it to the dance.

IMO the Italy trip was a huge waste of money.  The "team chemistry" that was built certainly didn't transfer into wins.