WCHA Florida Meetings

[Goon]

I don't think people on here are advocating that the defense become handicapped in that they are not allowed to be physical or play the game. What seems to be the focal point is the hooks, slashes, and holds that aren't consistently called. I understand some of the ticky-tack stuff that the NHL ref calls are weak calls, but the way that the rules are written for that league, that's a penalty. Especially the calls with the little hooks from behind where it doesn't benefit either player. All we(college hockey) would have to do is modify the verbage to satisfy everyone.

We've talked about this on this site on numerous threads. If you allow that stuff to continue, you are in essence handicapping the offensive players. And that's not fair either.

The referee's are on the ice to make it a level ice surface for everyone: Offense, Defense, and Goalie. Follow the rules set forth and I think you would here a lot less complaining.

LeftyZL I think people don't understand that Hooking, Holding, Slashing and obstruction does not equate to good defense. When the NHL enacted their new enforcement the league coaches found a way to play defense without the extra B.S. now teams just colaspe around their goalie. You can play defense without the obstruction.

I think the refs and the league office need to get it into their mind that it is not OK for a defender to be draped all over the opposition. It is not OK to slash T.J. Oshie or _________ (name your star player), that does not equate to fair play and is not acceptable in the NHL why should it be in the WCHA or NCAA?

Think of it this way; you're playing golf your ball is in a divot so move your ball to improve your lie. Because of your better lie you are able to get home in two so you get a birdie on the score card. However, you didn't get a birdie you cheat and should put down a Bogey on the score card. Watching team (insert random team) skate up and down the ice hooking, slashing, obstructing, tackling, holding and mugging your team is cheating.

[redwing77]

HA!

Enforce the rulebook and things will change? Maybe in an ideal world!

1. McLeod brags about WCHA's parity. Well, if the rule book was enforced, I doubt we'd see such parity. Top teams would flat out blow out bottom tier teams a majority of the time.

2. How do you enforce a rulebook in which everyone has a different interpretation of it? And worse, the interpretation changes by opponents, situation, time of year, perceived weight of the game, regular vs. post season, regulation vs. OT, and so on?

Since there is no standard interpretation, refs have to guess for themselves. Some are good at it (Zelkin) some are bad at it (Adam). Since Shepherd cannot enforce accountability when even he cannot get his own interpretation standardized (not to mention the "buddy buddy" system he has in place) officiating cannot improve.

The NHL isn't perfect. However, they put on games that are, at times, much more evenly called than the WCHA.

[The Sicatoka]

Handcuff the defense? No.

But they are being given too many liberties in the WCHA.

My two simplest examples (from the NCAA 2006-2008 rulebook):

Holding

SECTION 24. A player shall not hold or grab an opponent in any manner (stick, hand, etc.).

PENALTY

[Goon]

HA!

Enforce the rulebook and things will change? Maybe in an ideal world!

1. McLeod brags about WCHA's parity. Well, if the rule book was enforced, I doubt we'd see such parity. Top teams would flat out blow out bottom tier teams a majority of the time.

2. How do you enforce a rulebook in which everyone has a different interpretation of it? And worse, the interpretation changes by opponents, situation, time of year, perceived weight of the game, regular vs. post season, regulation vs. OT, and so on?

Since there is no standard interpretation, refs have to guess for themselves. Some are good at it (Zelkin) some are bad at it (Adam). Since Shepherd cannot enforce accountability when even he cannot get his own interpretation standardized (not to mention the "buddy buddy" system he has in place) officiating cannot improve.

The NHL isn't perfect. However, they put on games that are, at times, much more evenly called than the WCHA.

You know I can see the genius in your post. The buddy system is so true, Zelkin was the best official in my opinion but when the league needed to send refs to the Final Five and the NCAA tourney Shepturd sends his son and Anderson. To me that is a huge joke.

Zelkin has officiated in many venues including the WJC. No sane person can figure it out.

[siouxweet]

somebody stated it earlier, be careful what you wish for. I am for changing the rules but look what happened in Denver when there was a wide open style allowed to a degree. we got ran over. and last year and the year before.

[ScottM]

somebody stated it earlier, be careful what you wish for. I am for changing the rules but look what happened in Denver when there was a wide open style allowed to a degree. we got ran over. and last year and the year before.

I blame that more on the team itself than on the rules. I'd rather see a more open game that allows the best team to win, rather than allowing less talented teams to sit on the blue lines all night.

[The Sicatoka]

What should we do, call every ticky tacky little thing and play the entire game 3 on 3?

For a while, yes, thus ....

[DamStrait]

Who says the rules aren't already being enforced?

I am, along with many, many others (including at least a few WCHA head coaches).

[Goon]

For a while, yes, thus ....

[dagies]

For a while, yes, thus ....

[sprig]

McLeod "senses a movement .....

The sense is "smell', and the movement that he smells comes from him, Shepherd, and crew.

[sprig]

When you say "best team", I think what you really mean is "best offensive team". Again, the hate for a defensive style of play just never ceases to amaze me. Baseball seems to be the only sport where fans can appreciate good defense. Every other sport there tends to be a bias in favor of offense.

Good defense can be played without resorting to holding and tackling. The way the WCHA calls games now, the better open ice tackling team usually wins.

[ScottM]

When you say "best team", I think what you really mean is "best offensive team". Again, the hate for a defensive style of play just never ceases to amaze me. Baseball seems to be the only sport where fans can appreciate good defense. Every other sport there tends to be a bias in favor of offense.

Because it's just so damn exciting to watch guys like Joe Finley move a puck on a breakaway rather than Oshie or Duncan.

[DamStrait]

Okay then, I think we've reached the point of agreeing to disagree. Nevermind the fact that so many penalties are being called in virtually every game.

Do you have any statistical evidence showing that power plays are significantly up?

[dead_rabbit]

Okay then, I think we've reached the point of agreeing to disagree. Nevermind the fact that so many penalties are being called in virtually every game.

I don't think the average number of penalties per game will go up. Players will just have to start playing by the rules (assuming the refs are willing to blow their whistles).

IMO, the CCHA is less tolerant of the obstructions/holding, and without even looking at stats , I'm willing to bet the number of penalties called are comparable to that of the WCHA.

I don't mind the 1-0 games, I do mind seeing the best players (both sides of the puck) not being able to play their game.

[siouxweet]

Do you have any statistical evidence showing that power plays are significantly up?

only when the gophers are playing

[dagies]

From this Herald story.

Hakstol said he doesn

[siouxweet]

From this Herald story.

is und a minor league team or a 4-year university sometimes I wonder with remarks I hear from the coaches in that they even tell some players to leave for the nhl. I thought they(coaches) were to have the best interests of the program and university in mind.

[mikejm]

The sense is "smell', and the movement that he smells comes from him, Shepherd, and crew.

I probably could've gone all month without thinking about Shepher's smelly movement.

Heck, maybe all year!

[happy]

Call me crazy, but I have a great appreciation for a defenseman chasing down a guy on breakaway and denying the shot opportunity. That to me is every bit as exciting as seeing the puck in the back of the net.

I just saw the other day just that sort of play in a NHL playoff game. The defensemen did an amazing job robbing the other player from behind. and, he managed to do it without a single slash. But, I can see over, and over, a great offensive player making a wcha breakout, and getting slashed about 8 or 10 times in an average wcha game. clearly, the NHL defenseman could have slashed as much as you see in the wcha, but he chose not to, since he knew he would be called.

since I see great defense plays all the time in the NHL without slashing, mugging and holding, it could also be done in the wcha. Why would you rather see holding, and slashing by the defense, instead of doing it the right way?

[Goon]

I just saw the other day just that sort of play in a NHL playoff game. The defensemen did an amazing job robbing the other player from behind. and, he managed to do it without a single slash. But, I can see over, and over, a great offensive player making a wcha breakout, and getting slashed about 8 or 10 times in an average wcha game. clearly, the NHL defenseman could have slashed as much as you see in the wcha, but he chose not to, since he knew he would be called.

since I see great defense plays all the time in the NHL without slashing, mugging and holding, it could also be done in the wcha. Why would you rather see holding, and slashing by the defense, instead of doing it the right way?

That is a good illustration of what the WCHA could be like, slashing, mugging and holding is not good hockey and is cheating.

[Sioux]

is und a minor league team or a 4-year university sometimes I wonder with remarks I hear from the coaches in that they even tell some players to leave for the nhl. I thought they(coaches) were to have the best interests of the program and university in mind.

the program is built by the players too. coaches need to not be selfish. sometimes a player should leave, so they dont plateau in their development.

[82SiouxGuy]

No I don't. Just from memory it seems like we didn't see as many power plays per game back in the 80's as we see now. Am I (to steal a word from Roger Clemens) "misremembering"?

Yes you are. Here are a few penalty totals from past seasons. 1984-85 season with Jim Archibald 780 penalty minutes. 1986-87 season 888 penalty minutes. 1996-97 season 719 penalty minutes. 2001-2002 season 592 penalty minutes. This past year 783 penalty minutes. I just spot checked some seasons from 1982 on and it looks like most seasons are from the mid 600s to the upper 700s. The 592 and the 888 are outside the normal range, but this year was probably in or close to the normal range.

The penalty minute numbers all come from hockeydb.com.

[Siouxman]

We don't need rule changes; we simply need to enforce the rules that we have. We also don't need to make them up as we go, to softly paraphrase one of our WCHA zebra "elite."

[dagies]

is und a minor league team or a 4-year university sometimes I wonder with remarks I hear from the coaches in that they even tell some players to leave for the nhl. I thought they(coaches) were to have the best interests of the program and university in mind.

You attract more high end players by having a reputation for honestly dealing with them, and telling them when they are and are not ready to move along, than you do if you are consistenly commenting publicly on how they aren't ready and would be better off staying another year. Players know who has their long term development interests in mind.