Teeder11

Good points. Very well thought out and presented as usual. Where we separate is on the point where you say that "their editorial practice has made them a partisan in the fight -- and that is a serious breech of their journalistic integrity and ethics." Let me back up by saying that you are very correct about Jacobs and Dennis in the first part of your statement about being partisans, and they would fully admit it. But it's the latter part where I specifically take issue. Jacobs and Dennis are not the beat writers when it comes to the nickname on the news side of the newspaper. They never have been and they never will be. They are the opinion makers on the opinion side of the newspaper, and this includes their incessant rants against the nickname. They always have been and they always will be, I am confident enough to wager. They will never write a nickname news story. And we, who study their every move and who are students of American journalism, no the reason why. The wall between the editorial side of a newspaper and the news side is very high and has few doors. The reporters are the ones tasked with bringing you the news, with, in theory, no opinion. The editorialists are the ones charged with entertaining you or repulsing you with their opinions. If, and this will never happen, Jacobs or Dennis ever writes a straight nickname news story -- not an editorial, not a column -- but an honest to goodness news story that appears in the news section, then, your claims of lack of journalistic integrity and ethics would ring true. As long as their opinion, no matter how many times it is states and restated, appears in the opinion section they are fully in their right as individuals in America to express an opinion. Just because they work for a newspaper does not mean they check their 1st Amendment hat at the door. I know you are not suggesting that. Sorry about the hyperbole. Maybe it's clearer for me to say it this way: I view a newspaper's opinion makers to be just like any other individual or group in America, with the same rights and privileges as everyone else. Now just like anyone else in America, newspapers are fair game to criticism, but in the same light, just like anyone else they are not unethical for stating an opinion over and over and over again. I mean, based on your argument, the vast majority of individual posters here on Siouxsports.com would be considered unethical because day after day after day we present pro-nickname arguments, counter arguments and opinions. I am curious to learn the difference between a newspaper repeatedly stating an opinion and an individual person doing the same thing. Or maybe you are saying that the Herald is making a bad business decision by keeping up the constant drumbeat against the name. This, I can agree with you on, but again, ethics has nothing to do with it.

Ditto!

That's exactly what I said. They are getting paid by the Herald to give THEIR opinion, not to be a megaphone for or a reflection of the opinions of their readership or nonreadership, in your case. Yours is a different beef than mine, however. You don't like liberalism being expressed without a balance of conservatism added in. There is nothing wrong with that stance. And there is also nothing wrong with the fact that you have voted with your pocketbook not to support what you perceive has unchecked liberalism in the newspaper. Here's the rub, though, every newspaper has its biases, the NYT, Washington Post, Grand Forks Herald, etc. are liberal, while the New York Post, the Wall Street Journal, the Washington Times, et.al are right of center. They have made a decision to favor one ideology over the other. That is their right. You will be hard pressed to find a utopian publication of unbiased opinion. If you like a publication's posture, then fine, if you hate it, then take your dollars elsewhere, as you have so rightly done. BUT to suggest (not you) that they are being "unethical" by giving their opinion in an opinion section is what I take issue with. Personally, I still hold my subscription to the Herald, not because I agree with its editorial ideology, but rather because I love its UND hockey coverage and I want to support Schlossman. He's the man! I totally respect your opinion. Have a great day!

Firstly, Jacobs and Dennis are paid to give their opinions. They are not the news writers. They give their personal opinions on the news of the day and they have not been at all cryptic about where they stand on the nickname issue. And they sign their name under their opinion and stand by it. I for one think that's admirable, regardless of how asinine the opinion. I may not agree with their opinion but I at least am savvy enough about journalism to know who is an opinion writer and who is a news writer. Secondly, Omdahl does not work for the Herald. He is not a journalist, either. He, like Jacobs and Dennis, is a man with an opinion in a country where we value the right to express such. If they wrote their usual drivel, and Chewey's favorite word, pablum, on the news pages, then, I would say your point is spot on. But, it's not... it's just their opinion and it appears where it belongs -- on the opinion pages -- so they are fully within their right, IMHO. I find it refreshing to read opposing view points than what we get for the most part on this message board. Always nice to know what the other side is thinking, I say. What a boring world it would be if the Herald and Forum only wrote exactly what we think and what we believe... I mean, what would we gripe about. LOL! Hey, even Chuck Haga threw a curve ball the other day with his piece about Former Gov. Allen Olson and his negative view of the NCAA. I thought it was a great article that portrayed the NC$$ exactly as it is: a money-grubbing, monopolistic, small-school bullying, big-school kowtowing, hypocritical organization. The article went against the grain as far as the popularly believed narrative about the Herald that is oft repeated on this message board. It may have confused you and many others. Thus, I am not surprised that you did not recall that the Herald did exactly what you say it did/does not -- in your own words: "take a moment to consider the absurdity of the NCAA's position." You must have missed that article as I did not see you leading the cheer line, dishing out compliments for the local rag. That said, I did see a few positive comments from others about the story on here. I know, I know.. one story does not make up for the mountain of anti-nickname venom they've eschewed over the years. My point, however, for the sake of consistency, is that we should applaud an effort well done as much as we complain about perceived hatchet jobs that injure our pro-nickname cause and our fellow friends of the nickname.

The Forum has never identified the writer of its opinions. This is nothing new. It's Jack Zaleski most of the time, but it's supposed to represent the opinion of the entire editorial board. The Herald is one of the few newspapers whose daily opinion writers identify themselves, usually it's Tom Dennis, and Mike Jacobs when Tom is on vacation. Kevin Grinde on a rare occasion will step in.

Just tweeted Josh Duhamel to let him know about the Sioux in the Frozen Four. Should have known that he was already all over it! Here was my tweet followed by his response: Siouxfan72: "Hey, Josh, yur Fighting Sioux play Michigan in the Frozen 4 Apr. 7 at the X in St. Paul. Wear yur cap for good luck! Go Sioux!" @joshduhamel: "I'll be watching!"

Very true. However, shouldn't we hold a publication like the Plains Daily to the same standard. Or, and seriously here, maybe it is a different sort of pub that doesn't carry the same responsibilities. Not sure what the new rules are for e-news sites. I would contend that as much overt bias or even bias by omission that we see in the Herald news pages is seen in the Plains Daily. The only difference is that the Plains Daily perspective is what we want to see written, or in other words, it is favorable to the pro-nickname point of view. The Plains Daily clearly has an agenda and I applaud it for pursuing an angle that obviously wasn't being covered, but completely fair and balanced it is not. I think a more complete picture of what might have taken place with "plane gate" can be discerned only after reading both pieces -- the one in the Plains Daily and the reaction piece in the Herald. That's the way news consuming should work... get your information from more than one source. If you limit yourself to one you're usually only getting one side.

No problem...thanks for the clarification. Sometimes jokes don't translate well or I am too dense. Probably the latter. Rock on!

Good points, Star2city. I respect your opinion and share it as well.

It happens every game. Not a news flash. You're grasping at straws for a conspiracy. What are we going to say next that Schlossman has to be fired!?? Or, maybe we should say that everyone but Shloss should be let go, because he writes what we want to read." The Web layout team who would have chosen that photo are as big a Sioux fans as you and I. Admittedly, the choice in photo could have been better so as to avoid the inevitable cry of "bias" by the vast majority. My first reaction, too, was "why couldn't you just use the same Ben Brien Fighting Sioux logo that is usually used with Fighting Sioux stories." The difference is that I know it wasn't an intentional jab at the pro-nickname crowd and instead just a boneheaded decision. But, then again, why should it matter? Why should they have to walk on egg shells and care about how one side or the other is going to perceive the motives behind a simple photo decision that at any other university town would have been a non-event? That smacks of PC-think: to cave and make decisions that won't offend a certain group. I know it's done all the time with non-nickname issues. But c'mon, they are not showing anything that can't be seen by anyone who attends a game at REA and that isn't shown a thousand times each game night on FSSN. I will chalk that up to ignorance rather than organized conspiracy to foil the nickname. Jacobs and Dennis' influence isn't as great as some purport it to be. The vast majority of Herald employees are huge Fighting Sioux fans and pro-nicknamers. Jacobs' administrative assistant is as big a Sioux fan as there is. But like any big organization, you are going to have wide-ranging and varied opinions on the matter. You're opinion is valid and welcomed, don't get me wrong. I wasn't going to write this much, but I get a little worked up with blanket statements that malign the loyalty of some of my good friends and loyal Fighting Sioux fans at the Herald just because of the few that I would describe as having tepid, at best, feelings against the nickname. Don't let the few spoil the bunch! Go Fighting Sioux and Fighting Sioux forever!

It's coming. I have a hunch.

+1 for you. That is exactly right! We recruit the best in the nation and the world. Why limit yourself just because you "think" you can? I don't see Ohio State or Michigan or Texas or any of the SEC teams in football recruiting only from their home states. Same for in basketball. Why should hockey be any different?

Thanks for the clarification on that. Phew! That's great to hear (for basketball, anyway)!

What happens if the Big Sky keeps it current tourney format, and at some time in the future, UND wins the league, and by virtue, is awarded host status? Would it be able to host under the threatened sanctions of the NCAA due to the nickname and logo? And if not, where would the tourney be held in those years? Would the Big Sky have to always have a neutral site contingency plan for UND? Seems like a bit of a headache for the Big Sky if that would be the case. Might this be what Fullerton was alluding to when he was saying that the Big Sky was watching the nickname legislation carefully? I know these are a lot of questions and it may not be something to worry about for a while, but I am wondering if anyone has pondered these scenarios. I would love the feedback. Sorry if this has been hashed and re-hashed already. I missed it, if it was.

Do you need one? This is the Internet. Sadly, there's B.S. tossed about on here every hour.

Since you use a hypothetical... I will too .....I could imagine cheering the Mens team if we finished 6th of 12, if prior to that, we had been perennial cellar dwellers like Michigan Tech, which is pretty much what the Sioux Women's team was during the pre-Idalski years. So, I think in that context, it is call for some celebration among Sioux fans. You will never hear Idalski or his team saying that, though. In their minds, they've done squat and have their eyes set on bigger prizes.

Yeah, her name is Kelly Sanders, a freshman marketing student, and she is an awesome representative for UND. She lost a lot of weight since she started and MTV has made a couple of trips to the UND campus already to tape segments for this series. Way to go, Kelly!!!

I totally agree with your analysis. Again, the commonly held beliefs concerning the UND nickname and logo, with all the inaccuracies and revised histories, is the prevailing narrative in the local, regional and national media. No PC conspiracy, just shoddy journalism.

It was a KVLY (Valley News Live-- Fargo, N.D.) report that was re-posted on the MSNBC site. KVLY is an affiliate of MSNBC's parent station.

The media excerpt you quote is cited as coming from KVLY in Fargo, which means it was probably compiled by a freshly-minted Moorhead State journalism grad whose knowledge of the nickname issue probably derived from a 30-second study of one paragraph on Wikipedia before filing the report. It shouldn't be that way; but believe me, that's usually the extent of media research these days. Especially, by the young punks that our small market television stations attract around here. So, I'm fairly confident that the lesson of Hanlon's Razor applies here, which is "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence." I know it makes for a more interesting message board if we could continue to allege that conspiratorial or clandestine forces were at work here, but sorry to be a buzz kill, it's more likely to be the result of media ignorance.

Well said. I too want the nickname and logo to stay FOREVER. I too am as anti-PC as you can be. And I am very intrigued and excited by what is taking place in Bismarck, but I have that luxury as an arm-chair critic. BUT for those who bear the burden of resolving this issue, sometimes the best course of action is not the most popular one.

Don't disagree. Just hate to see your credibility diminished by typos and misspellings. If we have such strong feelings against individuals, we should at least know how to spell the their names.

Did they ever get your vote?