Irish

This may be true, but we don't have to look any farther than Football Bubba to see an example of a UND coach who had crappy special teams and a flawed offensive philosophy who stubbornly refused to make any changes for far too long and was allowed to stand pat until things were really in the toilet. There is a huge difference between coaches feeling some pressure to do well and having the self-awareness to honestly evaluate what is going on in the program and then make the necessary changes. Some very good sports minds are hampered by a stubborn refusal to change even in the face of strong evidence. I hope Hockey Bubs is not one of them, but there is mounting evidence that he is (see power play for an example).

This is so true - I really worry about what has happened to totally drain the offense out of Berry's teams. Absolutely no scorers. None. Doesn't matter how they were rated coming in they don't score when they are here. I have not seen a team with so much dead weight in a long long time. I used to have faith in Berry, but his total inability to even improve our power play doesn't bode well in my opinion. I wish I knew what was going on (not that I think I will)

And as frustrated as I am we need your perspective on this board too - we are nothing if not reactive. I just hope things change soon.

First, I am not saying Fire Berry after this season. I am saying that we should be concerned and as of now no one is convinced that Berry "gets it". It is so hard to tell through all of the coachspeak and lack of any questions from the press. At a minimum Shaw should be gone. Our power play is an embarrassment to hockey. I think changes need to be made - maybe Berry is willing to make them but who knows. As to the roster being set, quite often in addition to early recruits we bring in the finishing touches. See the championship season with the additions of Boesser and Schmaltz. Now we are losing good players to the very team we got these two studs from.

At least we are properly framing the problem. Here is what many posters are looking at - Berry took over a program loaded with NHL talent and hard chargers. He did a great job and led them to a much anticipated championship. Since then it has been downhill both in wins and talent. We are poised to miss the tournament for the second year in a row after making it 17 consecutive years. The talent is the lowest since the last years of Gino - after 3 bad seasons then we fired a coach that had led us to 3 National Championships. The optics for our program are horrible - absolutely no scoring punch - guys who are not developing. Uneven play. Can't hold leads. Canesius. Not playing a full 60. Ill timed penalties. Guys on the roster for 3 years who bring no scoring to the table. And imagine what this season would be if we didn't have a stud goalie. Many are concerned with the trajectory of this program even more so than missing the tournament for two years. Tell me where I am wrong.

In my opinion, the total lack of information coming from the program and lack of questioning by the press contributes a lot to the frustration on this board (and I'm not saying that we need to be privy to sensitive info about JJ - just commenting on the total lack of explanation about anything) - We are watching a dumpster fire in the program that won #8 just 3 short years ago with as talented a team as I have seen. I am totally baffled by our sudden fall. Our power play is an embarrassment yet no questions or explanations as to what is going on - why can't we even get it in zone? We are world beaters one night and can't hit the ocean the next. We give up leads like no Sioux team I have ever seen. We don't have any scorers on our team. We seem to lack any grit. I don't think coaches are going to admit any mistakes, but it would sure be nice to hear some honesty about our program. All we hear from the media is hot goalie, puck luck, and bad bounces. All we hear from staff is culture and process. Things need to change or we are in big trouble. And I don't think our talent coming in next year will save us. None of the guys brought in to score so far have done squat. Not sure if it is misjudging talent, schemes or what. For once I would like someone to admit there is something amiss and that we have a plan to deal with it. Pie in the sky wish, I'm sure. Looking at you, Schlossman and Hennesy. Ask a tough question for once.

Maybe, but all we get from him is coachspeak about "culture" and "process" - no indication he gets it at all.

Not our team - if we take penalties we prefer for them to be the stupid kind.

We've given up lots of leads the past two years - anyone know how many times we have rallied to win?

This is much closer to how I thought we would play this year and definitely something we can build on - if we keep this up and add some scorers next year we could return to dominance. Nice win.

My definition of trolling is someone who uses personal insults instead of facts. I have said we have an elite tradition and history. I believe that overall we are the best program in the country. My point is that we are not currently among the elite and it is frustrating. If you disagree with these definitions so be it. No need to be a tool about it.

I am not attempting to define us in two seasons - I've said it before - we have an elite tradition. I am, however, expressing concern about the shape of our program right now. I think this is a reasonable concern.

I certainly didn't post a list of criteria for an elite program -I was just illustrating our play this year. I could have easily added our inability to hold leads and our power play. These are just a few reasons that added together show that we are not an elite program this year - When you add up the scoring info it shows that we have a serious lack of talent up front - How many times do we have to watch us miss a wide open net to realize this? As for the Canesius opponents scoring more than us, this doesn't make them elite as much as it makes us not elite this year. Like I said previously - do we have an elite history - absolutely. Have we been elite the last two years? No way.

This I agree with - when you take into account the last 40 years we are elite. When you look at the last several we are not. The question was "are we still an elite program? I agree that our fantastic history doesn't go away. However, we have been far short of elite the last couple of years, and if next year's class doesn't pan out like we hope we will be in for a long slide. I've been watching Sioux hockey for a long time and I can't recall a more punchless team ever. I am stunned at the lack of scoring talent and how fast we have fallen. We'll see - elite programs don't stay down for long. I have my fingers crossed for a turn around.

I'm not sure what you are implying, but elite programs can put up more than 2 goals in a weekend on Canesius - elite programs can hold 2 goal leads - elite programs have a few guys who can score and who are in the top 50 scorers in the nation - elite programs make the tournament. Is this temporary? - perhaps - but we have not seen much "elite" play lately. Tell me what has been elite about the last two years. How long a slump do we have to have before reality sets in?

Sadly no.

I see this as showing "parity" about as much as the Sioux Falls game in football showed the football parity. This was an ugly display from a team who lacks offensive firepower and grit. You are correct about the other parts of your post - I'm not so sure we beat them again, but then again we could beat the number 1 team. We have some pieces necessary to be a good team, but mental lapses and no talent up front holds us back.

Sorry - didn't mean to sound so harsh - Just pointing out that if puck luck is part of it we are in the midst of an ultra-long cycle. And the more I look at the past almost 2 years the more I think the lack of playing a full 60 enters in too. Call it grit or whatever, but we puke up leads like no team I have ever seen and seem to take turns making bone headed or lazy plays. And the above poster is dead on about playing down to our competition. Berry has some serious issues to correct.

It's what we do.

Puck luck? Do you honestly think our group of logo shooters are cursed by bad puck luck? If that's the case, the hockey Gods must have been squatting on us for the past 2 years. Could it possibly be our lack of talent?

It is good to have goals.

I'm not saying we don't have a capable recruit - I'm saying we know less about him. It was a good scramble by staff. However, given we are in dire need of good QB recruits it is natural this scenario caused angst among the fans - seems like we finally got a capable coach and a stud recruit, then all of a sudden not. I really hope this works out.

I'm not saying he won't be good, I'm saying it is hard to tell. There are a lot of good high school QBs. Additional scouting gives us valuable information to perhaps more important factors such as pocket presence, arm strength, mobility, mechanics, and the ability to read defenses. At this point we don't know a lot. And to list NFL QB's with the same height doesn't help the analysis at all.

Really - it's an easy one for me - Bubba has had a continued inability to recruit and develop QB's - no high school QB at all in last year's class. When we did get guys with potential he turned them over to Rudy for "development". The results speak for themselves. Now, finally, we get a new OC and a stud QB commit. Then 3 days before signing he bolts. At the last minute we get a QB from Michigan who had a good high school career. Other than HS stats it is very hard for us to determine if he is the real deal or not, but there is a nagging suspicion that if he was really good he wouldn't have been available this late. I am not saying he is not going to be a good player - I am saying that this is a difficult way to recruit the most important position on the team. The angst comes from finally getting a change in OC, gettintg a stud to commit then losing him, then a last-minute pick-up.

Point taken - I'm not saying we should win every recruiting battle with them, but in my mind there is no reason those two schools should be skating circles around us.