mksioux Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 I think you are giving the committee too much credit. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I might be giving the whole dang NCAA too much credit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 If the NCAA finds it offensive (whether they're right or wrong), the First Amendment will not prevent the NCAA from banning it from its tournaments. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> And therein lies the true heart of the problem. Even if we win (the pro-keep the name forces), the NCAA may just chuckle and say "good for you guys...now enjoy not being picked for the NCAA tournament or playing any playoff games on the road." I don't know if I like that thought any better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 I'll say it once more: The NCAA doesn't want to go there again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driveforshow Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 Any truth to the story that Ralph has the legal rights to the logo that is used at REA. Do to the fact that he has changed a few things in the logo. So since UND rents the buildings from REA will that change anything in the legal end. If you change the name and keep the logo that was designed by the group that is backing UND. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GCWaters Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 First amendment or not? (1) Pete Rozelle tells Jim McMahon what he can and cannot write on his headband. (2) A public school tells students which t-shirts can and cannot be worn based on what they believe is offensive or not. (3) Metrodome workers confiscate signs from fans that they believe are offensive and should not be seen in the dome. (4) MLB tells a pitcher that he cannot wear his lucky hat in the World Series, having to wear the official Series cap instead. You make the call... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 First amendment or not? (1) Pete Rozelle tells Jim McMahon what he can and cannot write on his headband. (2) A public school tells students which t-shirts can and cannot be worn based on what they believe is offensive or not. (3) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 You make the call... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Okay. You call the NCAA and tell them they did all that work studying First Amendment case law for nothing. Maybe they'll hire you as their lawyer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 First amendment or not? (1) Pete Rozelle tells Jim McMahon what he can and cannot write on his headband. I don't believe McMahon ever raised a 1st Amendment issue. (2) A public school tells students which t-shirts can and cannot be worn based on what they believe is offensive or not. Courts have generally upheld students' rights to self-expression, even if offensive, in public settings. (3) Metrodome workers confiscate signs from fans that they believe are offensive and should not be seen in the dome. See 1. (4) MLB tells a pitcher that he cannot wear his lucky hat in the World Series, having to wear the official Series cap instead. Again, see 1. You make the call... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Man Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 First amendment or not? (1) Pete Rozelle tells Jim McMahon what he can and cannot write on his headband. (2) A public school tells students which t-shirts can and cannot be worn based on what they believe is offensive or not. (3) Metrodome workers confiscate signs from fans that they believe are offensive and should not be seen in the dome. (4) MLB tells a pitcher that he cannot wear his lucky hat in the World Series, having to wear the official Series cap instead. You make the call... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> But it becomes discriminatory when you allow one group of people (FSU, NC-Pembroke, Utah and CMU) to use names and images deemed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 That makes absolutely no sense.... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I give up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Man Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fightingsioux4life Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 Actually the first amendment, the part about freedom of assembly, allows the NCAA to make stupid rules for its voluntary members. With the exception of forcing the University to remove depictions of Native Americans, though a binding contract was in place. I have no idea what UND can base its case on. IowaBison, Let's put the semantics aside and look at the facts: 1) The NC$$ is a monopoly. It makes Microsoft look altruistic by comparison. You either are a part of the NC$$ or you don't have an athletic department. And don't bring up the NAIA, that is not an option for most schools, including UND. 2) Even those on the anti-nickname side (like the Grand Forks Heraldo) have argued that UND should make the decision, not the NC$$. 3) If the NC$$ gets by with this, what other institutional decisions will they stick their noses into? The ethnic and cultural diversity of the student body? The male-female ratio of the student body? If the NC$$ wins this case, they will in essence own every school's athletic department lock, stock and barrel. By the way, that would include NDSU. 4) If these anti-nickname groups win this war, what other names and symbols will they target next? I think the team name of your school is a possibility. Bison are cultural and spiritual symbols of many Native American tribes. They might argue that the use of the Bison nickname is "hostile and offensive" to them because you are using their cultural symbols for "fun and games". I think that is more possible than most people think. Once they gain an inch, they'll take a mile. Or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 (edited) Not trying to irritate you...you obviously have a great deal of passion for this and, as an Atlanta Braves fan who's gone through somthing similar (though not as bad), I do have some empathy for you guys. Edited September 9, 2005 by PCM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaBison Posted September 9, 2005 Author Share Posted September 9, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 Now which of those arguments are you going to use in court? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Who says that you only have to use one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choyt3 Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 Now which of those arguments are you going to use in court? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, PCM, which one are you going to use? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 Yeah, PCM, which one are you going to use? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I'll only answer that after my nomination to the U.S. Supreme Court becomes official. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GCWaters Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 I'll only answer that after my nomination to the U.S. Supreme Court becomes official. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Holy moly--we're in the presence of greatness and didn't even know it!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 Holy moly--we're in the presence of greatness and didn't even know it!!! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Nobody ever does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaBison Posted September 9, 2005 Author Share Posted September 9, 2005 Who says that you only have to use one? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamStrait Posted September 9, 2005 Share Posted September 9, 2005 I didn't. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> DO NOT FEED THE TROLL! Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaBison Posted September 9, 2005 Author Share Posted September 9, 2005 DO NOT FEED THE TROLL! Thank you. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> So apparently, my bison moniker makes me a troll? I was simply clarifying that my previous post does not limit the argument to one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fightingsioux4life Posted September 10, 2005 Share Posted September 10, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted September 10, 2005 Share Posted September 10, 2005 1) The NC$$ is a monopoly. It makes Microsoft look altruistic by comparison. You either are a part of the NC$$ or you don't have an athletic department. And don't bring up the NAIA, that is not an option for most schools, including UND. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> What about the NCCAA? Then we could be DI in all sports!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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