Hammy Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 If that's what you think, then you're essentially calling Blais a liar. I have heard him say publicly many times in many different forums that scholarships are evaluated at the end of each season. I had a rather lengthy response to this but I realized it will likely turn into an argument on your board (see one poster's touchy response above as an example) and I have generally tried to be respectful when I come here. I think the way some people are looking at the recruiting process of players is pretty naive. I'd be more than willing to talk about the topic via Email if you (or others) choose. But, I am just going to show some respect for your board and drop it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammy Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 Clayton very well spoken man. To address the issue further, if you monitor the USCHO board you will see that players are being shown the door all over the place so we are not talking about a new concept. Findlay from the CHA just sent 6 players packing last week. I also don't think any of us are calling for a house cleaning, I would say there are probably just a few areas that will probably be addressed in the off season. One last point because I don't want to be misunderstood. The vast majority of the players you see being shown the door are because of academic or behavioral issues. I have no issues when a coach boots a player for that. If a player breaks team/school rules, I feel the coach has to do what is right and enforce the rules. (The Findlay players broke team/school rules which is why they were dismissed.) I just have an issue with any program that yanks a scholarship from a kid because that coach did a poor job of evaluating what that kid could contribute on the college level. If a kid works hard, goes to practice, goes to his classes but just doesn't pan out like the coach thought, I don't feel it is right to pull his scholarship. That is the only thing I am saying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 PCM Why does everyone think they actually know what Blais is saying or thinks. I don't pretend to know what Blais thinking. All I can do is match the words I've heard him say many times with his actions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 I had a rather lengthy response to this but I realized it will likely turn into an argument on your board (see one poster's touchy response above as an example) and I have generally tried to be respectful when I come here. I think the way some people are looking at the recruiting process of players is pretty naive. Just answer one simple question: Do you think that what Blais tells prospective players and their parents is different from what he tells the public? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammy Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 Just answer one simple question: Do you think that what Blais tells prospective players and their parents is different from what he tells the public? I don't know what he tells prospective players because I am not there But I seriously doubt he goes in to a recruit's house and makes an offer based on one year. Parents and their kid want to know what they can expect during their time in college and if a coach gives them a vague idea, they aren't going to go with him. If he walked into Sidney Crosby's home (or a top recruit of that nature) and said, "Sidney, I know you have a full ride for 4 years on the table from a few other top schools but we do things a little differently and look at scholarship amounts on a year by year basis. We may not give you a full ride every season if things don't work out to our expectations. What do you think?" He'd probably get laughed out of the house. I don't think Blais is stupid. I think he knows if he wants to win a recruit, he has to be pretty clear (like other coaches) on what he plans to offer over the kid's college years. No kid worth a damn is gonna blow off other top schools (who tell him what they will offer over four years) in order to go to play for a coach who doesn't give them any idea of what to expect beyond one year. If a player is told they'll get a 75% scholarship from a school during his eligibility but another school says they only will talk about doing that for one year, who do you think is gonna win that recruit 90% of the time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 If a kid works hard, goes to practice, goes to his classes but just doesn't pan out like the coach thought, I don't feel it is right to pull his scholarship. That is the only thing I am saying You can feel however you want about it. Not being the coach of a Division I college hockey team, it's a simple matter for you to hold such beliefs. You call me naive, and yet I know for a fact that college coaches can and do pull scholarships when athletes don't perform up to expectations. I personally knew an athlete who had it happen to him, and that was at the Division II level. Don't tell me it doesn't happen, because I know it happens far more often than you're apparently willing to admit. That being said, I believe athletes should be given every opportunity to prove themselves, especially in amateur sports. Some need more time to develop than others. Some, through circumstances beyond their control, don't immediately live up to their potential or have off years. Some players might need more than one chance before they "get it." Any good coach will take these factors into consideration when making decisions about the level of scholarship support he'll offer a player. Blais was once quoted in a Herald article as saying that he didn't know if he'd like being an NHL coach because the part of coaching he enjoys the most is developing young players. He takes great pride in that aspect of his job and the number of players he's helped put in the NHL. That's what brings some of the nation's top recruits to UND. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammy Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 You call me naive, and yet I know for a fact that college coaches can and do pull scholarships when athletes don't perform up to expectations. Where did I say otherwise? I never said it never happens. I said more often than not, it is an academic/behavioral issue but I didn't say players never get gas piped by a coach for lack of performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 But I seriously doubt he goes in to a recruit's house and makes an offer based on one year. Gee, Hammy, being such an NCAA a rules guru, I didn't think that I've have to quote this again. Over the years, some of the terms of the National Letter of Intent agreement have changed, yet the basic premise has remained the same, to provide certainty in the recruiting process. Specifically, pursuant to the terms of National Letter of Intent program, participating institutions agree to provide a prospective student-athlete, who is admitted to the institution and is eligible for financial aid under NCAA rules, athletics aid for one academic year in exchange for the prospect's agreement to attend the institution for one academic year. Furthermore, participating institutions agree not to recruit a prospective student-athlete once he/she signs a National Letter of Intent with another institution. Accordingly, a prospective student-athlete who signs a National Letter of Intent no longer is subjected to recruiting contacts and calls and is ensured an athletic scholarship for one academic year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammy Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 Gee, Hammy, being such an NCAA a rules guru, I didn't think that I've have to quote this again. Gee PCM, I didn't realize I had to say 100 times that I know that a scholarship is renewed every year. I just figured you had the intelligence to understand that coaches will tell a recruit what to expect for future scholarship amounts beyond one year. I didn't say all four years were put in writing at the same time and didn't have to be renewed. Comprende? If you want to continue, Email me. Otherwise, I don't want to drag this on on this board. All it is gonna do is rile people up and I do not want to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hopper Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 I'm not riled up, but I do want to say this...in no one's defense! This is just a thought I had so maybe this will help. I have had employees that sign a "contract". However, in the fine print, it says something to the effect that even though they are showing up for work, they can't lay down in the break room and sleep. Nor can they work for 6 hours and slack off for the remaining 2. Nor does it say that at any time I have to keep them around because I said I would. Like I said before, this has no bearing on what has been said in this forum. Nor am I saying that I am in favor of pulling/honoring any scholarships. What I am saying, is that some tough decisions will be made by Blais, and at that time I will be thankful that I am not in his shoes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 If you want to continue, Email me. Otherwise, I don't want to drag this on on this board. All it is gonna do is rile people up and I do not want to do that. Since you've insulted me twice now, I'm going to say it: You're a twit, Hammy. I've watched you play your little Blais-slandering game for years on USCHO. It's old. It's dumb. It's childish. It doesn't even make sense. Time and time again, the facts prove you wrong. If you think you can come here to peddle your moronic theory and not be challenged, think again. I have no intention of letting you get away with it. I don't have anything to say to you by e-mail that I wouldn't say here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammy Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 I can't help it if you fail to see rather obvious points. I just didn't realize I had to repeat certain things over and over again just so somebody understands I know certain facts ( I mean, did I really need to spell out that I understand scholarships are renewed every year? That was never my point anyway.) Nor do I have any issues being challenged. Its not like I just got on these boards yesterday and never had that happen. I am just trying to diffuse a situation on this board because I know a lot of Sioux fans probably don't care to read it from a Gopher fan. I respect Blais. You overrate any Blais bashing I have done. I do think some people are too willing to blame the Sioux players and don't really seem to place any responsibility on the coach when they falter. Blais isn't immune from making errors. Neither is Lucia. I just don't think the player who tries everything to succeed for his team (in practice and off the ice) needs to take the gas pipe because the coach made the error in recruiting him in the 1st place. You feel otherwise..... so be it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choyt3 Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 (see one poster's touchy response above as an example) This has to be directed at me. Touchy response? If you don't like what SIOUX fans post on here regarding situations occurring at UND, then you don't have to come here and make the comments. Seems pretty simple. How long would it take for a Sioux fan to get their posting privileges revoked if entering into a scholarship conversation on the POI site? Maybe two posts? You guys were calling for dirty's head for posting one (true) sentence. Like Pat has said, it doesn't matter how you 'feel' about it. As for the recruiting, each player is obviously handled in a different manner. If you think that players such as Zach Parise, or in the future, Sidney Crosby, are going to be told the same things as guys that are looked upon as role players, you are the one that is being naive. You obviously have an axe to grind with Blais for some reason and it has been going on for years. I'd also like to know how you know that the reason players leave UND is because of on-ice performance only. How would you know? Did you personally talk to Dean Blais about every player that has left UND during his tenure? It seems kind of odd that when players leave other programs "more often than not, it is an academic/behavioral issue", but when players leave UND, they are gassed merely because he "just doesn't pan out like the coach thought". How do you know that players that left UND ''were working hard"? How do you know that players that left UND "were going to practice"? How do you know? You don't. Just like EVERYBODY else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 I am just trying to diffuse a situation on this board because I know a lot of Sioux fans probably don't care to read it from a Gopher fan. Drop the condescending attitude. I know exactly what you're doing and it has nothing to do with being helpful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammy Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 Drop the condescending attitude. I know exactly what you're doing and it has nothing to do with being helpful. Just speaking the truth. I don't want to stir up a hornet's nest. That why I offered long ago to take it to Email. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jk Posted March 5, 2003 Author Share Posted March 5, 2003 Yikes. I didn't mean to start this. Let's talk about Bucky this weekend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 Just speaking the truth. The truth? Here's Hammy, in his own words, saying exactly how much he knows about the truth: I don't know what he (Blais) tells prospective players because I am not there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammy Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 The truth? Here's Hammy, in his own words, saying exactly how much he knows about the truth: If you are going to be a child and take my comments out of their context, it only exposes that you have nothing of substance to refute them. Clayton, In my very first post on this thread, I said the following: (The above is just a hypothetical for argument sake. I am not saying the Sioux are doing all of these things.) In other words, I went out of my way to point out that I was not accusing the Sioux of anything on this thread. My statements were aimed toward a few FANS on here who talk about cutting this guy or that guy (imagine that, I am defending a Sioux player) due to performance and telling them that I don't agree with cutting players based on performance. I feel a coach (ANY coach whether it be Lucia, Blais, Dahl or whoever) shouldn't cut a player because of performance in games. If a coach recruited him and told him that he would get a scholarship of x% during his time at the school and the kid commits to that amount, then live up to that. I use that same standard for my own team so I don't think it is hypocritical for me to say that here. I don't have any issues with a coach kicking a player off of a team for behavior or for not keeping up grades. But I think it is a cop out for a coach to yank the rug from underneath a player for game performance when they are the one who recruited that player to the school. (And I'll repeat, I say that of my own team as well.) I agree with jk. It would be best if we let the topic die and you guys can focus on your upcoming series. Unfortunately, this has turned into exactly what I knew it would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 How do we know that guys who were kept on the Gopher team (but didn't pan out and rode out their careers on the end of the depth chart) really got what they were told they were going to get? Again, anyone can claim they kept getting the scholarship, but do we know they did? No, we don't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmidtdoggydog Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 Please PCM and Hammy, for the sake of everyone else on this board, can you either resolve your issue(s) quickly or continue your agrument by email or private message. As fans, we have much more important things to focus on and read about than your quarrel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammy Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 Please PCM and Hammy, for the sake of everyone else on this board, can you either resolve your issue(s) quickly or continue your agrument by email or private message. As fans, we have much more important things to focus on and read about than your quarrel. I apologize. I did offer to take it elsewhere. I will stop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 Please PCM and Hammy, for the sake of everyone else on this board, can you either resolve your issue(s) quickly or continue your agrument by email or private message. As fans, we have much more important things to focus on and read about than your quarrel. Well said. This kind of bickering belongs on USCHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 Coachs shouldn't cut a player because of performance in games. If a coach recruited him and told him that he would get a scholarship of x% during his time at the school and the kid commits to that amount, then live up to that. I use that same standard for my own team so I don't think it is hypocritical for me to say that here. I think the coaching philosophy you have brought up is wrong and flawed, your saying a coach shouldn't cut a player if he doesnt pan out, as long as he is good citizen, no matter how bad he plays. Yikes. Whatever... So in theory your saying we recruits a player and he has two misserable seasons we should stick with him, not cut him or any ammount of his scholarship funding, this in theory will not allow that said coach to recruit someone else to fill his spot on the roster... That is utter non-sense... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyeagle Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 I think the coaching philosophy you have brought up is wrong and flawed, your saying a coach shouldn't cut a player if he doesnt pan out, as long as he is good citizen, no matter how bad he plays. Yikes. Whatever... So in theory your saying we recruits a player and he has two misserable seasons we should stick with him, not cut him or any ammount of his scholarship funding, this in theory will not allow that said coach to recruit someone else to fill his spot on the roster... That is utter non-sense... It comes down to you (& PCM) having differnet philosophies than Hammy. Agree to disagree and be done with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted March 5, 2003 Share Posted March 5, 2003 Fair enough. Actually on second thought, screw it, this is a UND message board (Not POI) and on this web page it is a PRO-UND forum, I think one should be able to defend Coach Blais and the UND hockey teams especially when it is maligned by oppositon team's fans. I don't think we need to take suggestions from oppostion fans on what should be discussed on this web page. On second point Most UND fans, includeing myself mind their P's and Q's when visiting the POI web site. I have no problems with Coach Blais's coaching philosophy and will defend him when maligned in the message boards. So there... Maybe we should have the same standards when it comes to yanking posting priveledges as the POI... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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