PCM Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 From the Beacon News Online: Chief's last dance U of I to retire symbol after this winter After 80 years, Chief Illiniwek Saturday will begin what is likely to be his last year dancing at University of Illinois football games, university sources have confirmed. The chief, who will appear at the season opener at Memorial Stadium in Champaign, also will dance at home basketball games this winter. But after that, he will no longer be an official university symbol, the sources said.For the Peoria Tribe of Indians of Oklahoma, who are the descendants of tribes from Illinois and other states, the decision "has been a long time coming,'' said current chief John P. Froman. Tribal leadership asked the U of I in 2001 to stop using the chief. "If it is offensive to one individual, it should be addressed in some appropriate manner, and it appears the university is addressing that,'' he said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 If it is offensive to one individual, it should be addressed in some appropriate manner, and it appears the university is addressing that,'' I'm offended by that comment, and demand Herr Froman's immediate execution. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 If it is offensive to one person? Oh dear God... The NCAA is offensive to me, therefore, they must be obligated to grant me remedy!!!!! I think the school colors of the University of Minnesota remind me of the color of bodily wastes and I find that disgusting and offensive! I think therefore, that UMN should change their colors to pink and sky blue! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 And in rides Chief Osceola on Renegade, flaming spear in hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 And in rides Chief Osceola on Renegade, flaming spear in hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 And in rides Chief Osceola on Renegade, flaming spear in hand. Is somebody going to tell that white boy he's going to stay that color? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Csonked Out Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 This is just another example of what society has come too. At what point should political correctness stop? At what point do we say it has gone too far? We blame killings on music and video games, we're taught to avoid confrontation so as not to make anyone mad. and now we're suppose to try and make everyone happy. I for one am sick of trying to please everyone in this world, if someone doesn't like it who cares, if a whole group of people don't like it then lets talk about it, but only if its that group of people. I for one don't really care if some white person out in California (Phil Jackson) is offended by a nickname, especially when he's not native american or a sioux. Theres got to be a line drawn somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 We've officially become a nation ruled by a minority of one. If one person objects to something, we scrap an entire project or idea, even if eight million are in favor of it. Unbelievable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GF_siouxfan Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 If it is offensive to one person? Oh dear God... The NCAA is offensive to me, therefore, they must be obligated to grant me remedy!!!!! I think the school colors of the University of Minnesota remind me of the color of bodily wastes and I find that disgusting and offensive! I think therefore, that UMN should change their colors to pink and sky blue! hahaha i agree i bet we wont have any more tribal dances, those were really neat. this whole ncaa thing is just too bad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 We've officially become a nation ruled by a minority of one. If one person objects to something, we scrap an entire project or idea, even if eight million are in favor of it. Unbelievable. Not exactly. For example, even though I'm an Irish-Scandinavian-American and I object to the Notre Dame Fighting Irish and schools that use the name "Vikings" for their sports teams, the NCAA doesn't care if my ancestors are portrayed in a cartoonish, stereotypical manner. And even though I sent a letter to Myles Brand objecting to the NCAA being located in Indianapolis, Indiana, the organization's business relationship with Pontiac and its glorification Teddy Roosevelt - a noted purveyor of anti-Indian hate speech - my complaints have fallen on deaf ears. Quite obviously, some people are more equal than others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiouxTupa Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 It's not the minority that is ruling, at least not in this case. Illinois is doing it for the money...just like eveyone else. Going against the NCAA means losing lots and lots of money. It's getting out of hand how much money means to the decision makers in this country. Now, I'm going to go sit in my air-conditioned apartment and play xbox on my huge TV. The helicopter should be here to take me to class any minute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 Not exactly. For example, even though I'm an Irish-Scandinavian-American and I object to the Notre Dame Fighting Irish and schools that use the name "Vikings" for their sports teams, the NCAA doesn't care if my ancestors are portrayed in a cartoonish, stereotypical manner. And even though I sent a letter to Myles Brand objecting to the NCAA being located in Indianapolis, Indiana, the organization's business relationship with Pontiac and its glorification Teddy Roosevelt - a noted purveyor of anti-Indian hate speech - my complaints have fallen on deaf ears. Quite obviously, some people are more equal than others. Well, duh, PCM. You know why that is, don't you? Because people like you and me were born white and male, we have "power" and can hold minority groups in their place. Myles Brand would visit you personally if you were Jesse Jackson and lodged a complaint about the Fighting Irish nickname. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sioux7>5 Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 Well, duh, PCM. You know why that is, don't you? Because people like you and me were born white and male, we have "power" and can hold minority groups in their place. Myles Brand would visit you personally if you were Jesse Jackson and lodged a complaint about the Fighting Irish nickname. Lets all get in a big circl and sing kumbyya(spelling, I suck at spelling) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted September 1, 2006 Share Posted September 1, 2006 Well, duh, PCM. You know why that is, don't you? Because people like you and me were born white and male, we have "power" and can hold minority groups in their place. Myles Brand would visit you personally if you were Jesse Jackson and lodged a complaint about the Fighting Irish nickname. That's true. If it weren't for the fact that we were born white, we wouldn't have this problem. Caucasians are the source of all evil to American Society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted September 1, 2006 Share Posted September 1, 2006 Because people like you and me were born white and male, we have "power" and can hold minority groups in their place. Actually, educated, white males are the minority group discriminated against the most if one reads the myriad of hiring policies, admissions policies and other affirmative action programs used by many government agencies and corporations. BROTHERS UNITE! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mksioux Posted September 1, 2006 Share Posted September 1, 2006 I don't think it had much chance to begin with, but I think the proposed legislation against the NCAA will fizzle-away now. This policy hit UND the hardest and UND is going to be the only one left fighting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 1, 2006 Author Share Posted September 1, 2006 Remember, the NCAA is pursuing its policy against American Indians nicknames and imagery in the name of "diversity and inclusion." Jeff Jacoby has an excellent column in the Boston Globe about when happens when the goal of diversity for diversity's sake is pursued to its logical conclusion. By reducing ``diversity" to something as shallow and meaningless as appearance, they reinforce the most dehumanizing stereotypes of all -- those that treat people first and foremost as members of racial, ethnic, or social groups. Far from acknowledging the genuine complexity and variety of human life, the diversity dogmatists deny it. Is it any wonder that their methods so often lead to unhappy and unhealthy results?There's an excellent discussion of Jacoby's piece here on a blog called The Belmont Club. Poster Mark Terwilliger's comments on the nature of political correctness will ring true to those who have followed UND's battle to retain the Fighting Sioux nickname and logo. Terwilliger writes: Political correctness is not just a slightly over-enthusiastic embrace of "good manners," or a silly effort at coining new euphemisms. It is far worse than that. At its base, it is not even an attack on "white males." It is far more subtle and dangerous than that. I take PC to be nothing more or less than a deliberate attempt to establish -- as the basis of ALL human morality -- an unstated and unquestioning adherence to the following (false) logic: -- Oppression is (always) evil and the lack of oppression is (the only) good. -- The strong (always) oppress the weak. ... Therefore: -- The strong are (always) evil and the weak are (always the only) good. That's the underlying logic of PC in a nutshell. What makes this logic particularly PC (and also false) are the terms in parentheses. PC is an absolutist formulation. For PC to operate successfully, however, this underlying logic must never be displayed in the open where it's flaws become all too obvious. Further, any attempt to challenge the results of this logic must be met with a storm of accusations of moral turpitude, arrogance, callous indifference to the noble aspirations of a suffering humanity, etc. The whole point of the exercise is to keep the underlying logic out of sight, and to only allow the "resultant" pronouncements to be aired. Adherence to the underlying logic is sacred to the PC crowd, and they will brook no contradiction, nor even any question. PC is not the celebration of true diversity. It is the exaltation of weakness and the demonization of strength. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted September 1, 2006 Share Posted September 1, 2006 I don't think it had much chance to begin with, but I think the proposed legislation against the NCAA will fizzle-away now. This policy hit UND the hardest and UND is going to be the only one left fighting. I disagree. The legislation is not about UoI, UND,etc. It's about the NC$$ oversteping their bounderies as an institution whose mission is to protect student athelets. It's about the NC$$'s attempt at being the conscious of all U.S. citizens and their attempt at dictating to us what is morally right and wrong. And I have to say this, I'm as sick of the 'poor me, I'm a white man' as I am of the 'poor me, I'm a (pick a minority)'. Geeze! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 1, 2006 Author Share Posted September 1, 2006 And I have to say this, I'm as sick of the 'poor me, I'm a white man' as I am of the 'poor me, I'm a (pick a minority)'. Geeze! I don't expect anyone to feel sorry for me because I'm a male WASP. That would be silly. However, I don't think that it's acceptable for society to get in the habit of discriminating against male WASPs because they're perceived as having too much power and too many advantages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted September 1, 2006 Share Posted September 1, 2006 I don't think it had much chance to begin with, but I think the proposed legislation against the NCAA will fizzle-away now. This policy hit UND the hardest and UND is going to be the only one left fighting. Then again, it might help if NoDak's do-nothing congressional delegation used their purported "clout" to advance the federal legislation, instead of hemming and hawing in the Beltway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YaneA Posted September 1, 2006 Share Posted September 1, 2006 Illinois denies previous report of Chief Illiniwek retirement: http://chronicle.com/temp/email2.php?id=jQ...PgnpnzWvtzC3Mjc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slap Shot Posted September 1, 2006 Share Posted September 1, 2006 For those of you more plugged into this issue, do think that something like this hurts UND's own fight with the NCAA or will it have no impact? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 1, 2006 Author Share Posted September 1, 2006 (edited) For those of you more plugged into this issue, do think that something like this hurts UND's own fight with the NCAA or will it have no impact? I don't think it really matters what other schools do or don't do because none of them have exactly the same circumstances as UND. Assuming that UND takes the NCAA to court, the case will succeed or fail on its own merits based on how the NCAA has enforced the policy among its members. Edited September 1, 2006 by PCM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted September 1, 2006 Author Share Posted September 1, 2006 Illinois denies previous report of Chief Illiniwek retirement: Very interesting. Some media outlets were certainly eager to jump the gun on that story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YaneA Posted September 1, 2006 Share Posted September 1, 2006 Ironic that the Chronicle of Higher Ed is the one to set the record straight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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