Fullerton Still Talking Big Sky Expansion

[aff]

You know aff, you are just too damn smart to be wasting your time posting on a message board like this. You should dedicate your massive intellect to something truly worthy of you. Something like world domination or inventing a feasible cold fusion process.

I doubt even S2C would bet any serious money on his musings. His real point, IMO, is that the BSC is probably going to experience some stress due to a reduction in the number of "core" members. That stress, along with other factors such as a relative dearth of attractive DI schools in close proximity to its footprint, is likely to give birth to unique solutions.

If thats his real point than why doesn't he state it? Why are all of these exact scenarios being laid out if you don't want to discuss them? I think the problem may be you don't want to hear a view point that doesn't involve everything working out perfectly for UND in this situation.

[DamStrait]

If thats his real point than why doesn't he state it?

Because some people are so easy to bait no matter how smart they think they are.

I think the problem may be you don't want to hear a view point that doesn't involve everything working out perfectly for UND in this situation.

Yeah it's either that or we don't care to be lectured to as if we are idiots - idiots without a sno-cone's chance in hell of experiencing a successful reclassification - regardless of how smart that lecturer thinks he is.

[DI IN FARGO]

Because some people are so easy to bait no matter how smart they think they are. Yeah it's either that or we don't care to be lectured to as if we are idiots - idiots without a sno-cone's chance in hell of experiencing a successful reclassification - regardless of how smart that lecturer thinks he is.

Or maybe its just that you don't like to hear the truth?

[PCM]

Or maybe its just that you don't like to hear the truth?

No. It's some people's warped version of the alleged "truth" that we get tired of hearing.

[Gothmog]

No. It's some people's warped version of the alleged "truth" that we get tired of hearing.

"When free speech is chipped away in the name of avoiding offense, all else is soon forfeit."

[aff]

No. It's some people's warped version of the alleged "truth" that we get tired of hearing.

Yes, because Sioux Sports.com is full of people telling the God's honest truth about UND. I mean, who would ever think that some homers would be posting about UND and their future success. Thats almost unbelievable.

I seriously laughed so hard I had tears coming out of my eyes when I read that last post. You calling my version of events the "alleged truth", while you don't even discuss Starcity's ludicrous posts about the NCAA allowing a school from canada in, the big sky taking denver, denver accepting, and all of this somehow getting UND into a conference too? Yeah, I'm the one with the "warped vision". That scenario is so crazy its almost breath taking that people are able to look at that and think, "yeah, thats a real possibility". I mean, come on, that has as much chance of happening as me spitting a nuclear bomb. For Christ's sake, you're talking about conference affiliation based on something that has never occured in the history of the NCAA, and I simply point that out, and I'm the one with a warped vision? Thats really what you think? Seriously just look that over again, and tell me that it has a chance of happening. Just do it, please, and think about it for awhile, and then come back and tell me that I'm the one with the "warped vision" LOL.

FYI, it makes me laugh to read posts like these. Instead of actually debating something, or presenting something even close to a fact, you try to get someone with a desenting view point to simply shut up, because you don't like what they have to say. When I start reading these kinds of posts, I know that the guy on the other side is pretty desperate to keep something going, and that he knows I'm right.

If I seem like I'm arrogant, or that I know I'm right, its because I only post on subjects that posters are obviously incorrect on. Its not hard to be smart, when you only discuss situations that someone else is blantatly wrong about. And if you think you can shout me down with crap posts like you've had you're wrong too. If you don't like hearing dissenting opinions.... too bad. Lifes full of them, get used to it.

[PCM]

Yes, because Sioux Sports.com is full of people telling the God's honest truth about UND.

Get over yourself already. I only skim these threads because they're mostly filled with rumor, spin and speculation from people who obviously don't have a clue what they're talking about. And, yes, that includes some Sioux fans. But by far the most annoying people are those who pretend to be able to read minds of UND administrators, know UND's athletic budget inside out and claim to know answers to questions that Kupchella and Buning probably don't even know.

If you expect me to accept that drivel as "the truth," then you're not nearly as smart as I thought you were.

[DI IN FARGO]

Get over yourself already. I only skim these threads because they're mostly filled with rumor, spin and speculation from people who obviously don't have a clue what they're talking about. And, yes, that includes some Sioux fans. But by far the most annoying people are those who pretend to be able to read minds of UND administrators, know UND's athletic budget inside out and claim to know answers to questions that Kupchella and Buning probably don't even know.

If you expect me to accept that drivel as "the truth," then you're not nearly as smart as I thought you were.

This is to PCM, I've had my disagreements with AFF in the past but on this point I have to side with him. He isn't speculating when he refers to star2city's notion that you guys are going to get into a conference based on the NCAA letting a Canadian school into the mix, that's just plain ludicrous. Just becuase someone brought that notion up certainly doesn't mean its going to happen and to base conference invites on that scenario is so far out in left field really is grasping at straws. Like the saying goes don't shoot the messenger

[PCM]

This is to PCM, I've had my disagreements with AFF in the past but on this point I have to side with him. He isn't speculating when he refers to star2city's notion that you guys are going to get into a conference based on the NCAA letting a Canadian school into the mix, that's just plain ludicrous. Just becuase someone brought that notion up certainly doesn't mean its going to happen and to base conference invites on that scenario is so far out in left field really is grasping at straws. Like the saying goes don't shoot the messenger

Read, once again, what I wrote. Read it more slowly. Move your lips if it helps you comprehend the words.

[DI IN FARGO]

Read, once again, what I wrote. Read it more slowly. Move your lips if it helps you comprehend the words.

You should heed your own advice, remember to move your lips if it helps

[PCM]

You should heed your own advice, remember to move your lips if it helps

If you can teach some of the "messengers" the difference between fact and opinion, truth and conjecture, known and unknown, and fantasy and reality, my desire to use them for target practice will completely disappear. Until then, don't shove a plate of putrid garbage in front of my nose and tell me it's a gourmet delight. Deal?

[DI IN FARGO]

Get over yourself already. I only skim these threads because they're mostly filled with rumor, spin and speculation from people who obviously don't have a clue what they're talking about. And, yes, that includes some Sioux fans. But by far the most annoying people are those who pretend to be able to read minds of UND administrators, know UND's athletic budget inside out and claim to know answers to questions that Kupchella and Buning probably don't even know.

If you expect me to accept that drivel as "the truth," then you're not nearly as smart as I thought you were.

Well you are the one who made the remarks in the post above. Rumor, spin and or speculation was on the part of Star2City. Aff was only pointing out how far fetched the idea of a Canadian school being brought into the NCAA and resting your hope on that to gain entrance into a conference. Nothing more and nothing less. I was only agreeing with him on that point, I think its foolish to rest your hopes on that scenario playing out because I just can't imagine it even becoming anything close to reality.

[PCM]

Well you are the one who made the remarks in the post above.

Did you miss this part that I wrote?

And, yes, that includes some Sioux fans.

[PCM]

For the record, I'm not saying that anyone in this debate should be banned for tossing around various scenarios based on fantasy, reality, fact, fiction, wishful thinking, delusions of grandeur, LSD flashbacks, reading from tarot cards, tea leaves and animal entrails, psychic connections, assumptions, educated guesses, groundless claims, presumptions, valid hypotheses, common sense, Larry King streams of consciousness, misinformation, misconceptions, misperceptions or Kaptain Kangararoo reruns. I've long since ceased to care about any of it because nobody posting here has all the answers, can predict the future or know all the relevant information affecting UND's move to DI.

So go ahead and speculate away. Just don't tell me that any of it has a thing to do with "the truth."

[The Sicatoka]

Aff was only pointing out how far fetched the idea of a Canadian school being brought into the NCAA ...

Far-fetched? Yes.

But is there evidence that the NCAA has looked and is looking? Yes.

Far-fetched? A little less.

Extrapolating from there? Yes, that can get far-fetched quickly.

Then again, all any of us are doing is speculating on snippets of information. Claiming by anyone, supporting or rejecting a theory, to be more than speculating is in itself far-fetched. Quite simple, objectively looking at the case in point:

"UND will get into BSC" <--- speculation

"UND will get into Mid-Con" <--- speculation

"UND will get into Great West FB Conference" <--- speculation

"UND will be in DI indy pergatory until 2011" <--- speculation

[aff]

Far-fetched? Yes.

But is there evidence that the NCAA has looked and is looking? Yes.

Far-fetched? A little less.

Extrapolating from there? Yes, that can get far-fetched quickly.

Then again, all any of us are doing is speculating on snippets of information. Claiming by anyone, supporting or rejecting a theory, to be more than speculating is in itself far-fetched. Quite simple, objectively looking at the case in point:

"UND will get into BSC" <--- speculation

"UND will get into Mid-Con" <--- speculation

"UND will get into Great West FB Conference" <--- speculation

"UND will be in DI indy pergatory until 2011" <--- speculation

I think you're missing the idea of "degrees" of speculation here. I can say that I think that I'm going to eat cheerios for breakfast tomorrow, and thats speculation, because it hasn't occured. You could tell me I'm going to have a heart attack tonight, so I won't eat those in the morning. I could also say that I'm going to be the next president of UND. Thats also speculation, but since I'm hardly qualified for that position, its not nearly as "likely" as me eating cheerios tomorrow. I don't think you would simply lable both my breakfast tomorrow, and my presidential aspirations as the same speculation, would you?

This situation is similar to the discussion. UND will get into the mid-con is valid speculation. "UND will get into the big sky, because the NCAA is going to allow a school from Canada in, which will create a hockey rivalry with denver, who will want UND in because they will form a rivalry in other sports, so they will force the big sky to add UND and the canadian school into the conference, that they have never shown interest in joining" is bordering on being insane. If this comes true, I'm going to be kidnapping some of you, so that you can pick my lottery numbers in the next couple of months.

The point here is that a factor of this speculation has to be the liklihood of it actually occuring. Not all situations have the same chance of happening, and using common sense we can rule some of these out.

[The Sicatoka]

The point here is that a factor of this speculation has to be the liklihood of it actually occuring. Not all situations have the same chance of happening, and using common sense we can rule some of these out.

Really?

So which are more or less likely?

(Don't add or subtract from the words. Go on just what is says, nothing more.)

"UND will get into BSC"

"UND will get into Mid-Con"

"UND will get into Great West FB Conference"

"UND will be in DI indy pergatory until 2011"

Enjoy your Cheerios, but don't eat too fast or you may cause a heart attack.

[IowaBison]

IowaBison's order:

"UND will get into Great West FB Conference" (80%-as long as it still exists, there should be an open invitation)

"UND will get into Mid-Con" (50%, increase to 70% if NDSU/SDSU get in)

"UND will be in DI indy pergatory until 2011" (50% chance)

"UND will get into BSC" (10%-needs a major shakeup in order to become viable option-also needs to happen before another option emerges)

[DI IN FARGO]

Really?

So which are more or less likely?

(Don't add or subtract from the words. Go on just what is says, nothing more.)

"UND will get into BSC"

"UND will get into Mid-Con"

"UND will get into Great West FB Conference"

"UND will be in DI indy pergatory until 2011"

Enjoy your Cheerios, but don't eat too fast or you may cause a heart attack.

UND in to the BSC- I'd say 10% is being wildly optimistic

UND into the Midcon- I'd say 50% only after probationary period is over and probably 2-5 years after that.

UND into GWFC- 80% if its still around

UND in DI indy pergaroty- maybe longer then 2011 possibly 2015

That's my take.

[DI IN FARGO]

I should have said this is all dependant on you guys actually going through on the deal. No smack buy kuppy did leave himself an out on the deal if he wanted to stay DII.

[GeauxSioux]

I should have said this is all dependant on you guys actually going through on the deal. No smack buy kuppy did leave himself an out on the deal if he wanted to stay DII.

I think Kupchella would have a very tough time to say we are going to stay DII. I do believe that that there are a few Bison fans, not saying that you are one of them, that don't want UND to be Division I.

[IowaBison]

I think that UND needs to do what's best for them, but Kupchella has left the door wide open to say, "We did the math and DII is the best place for the [insert new team name here ]," in a year.

[gjw007]

For the record, I'm not saying that anyone in this debate should be banned for tossing around various scenarios based on fantasy, reality, fact, fiction, wishful thinking, delusions of grandeur, LSD flashbacks, reading from tarot cards, tea leaves and animal entrails, psychic connections, assumptions, educated guesses, groundless claims, presumptions, valid hypotheses, common sense, Larry King streams of consciousness, misinformation, misconceptions, misperceptions or Kaptain Kangararoo reruns. I've long since ceased to care about any of it because nobody posting here has all the answers, can predict the future or know all the relevant information affecting UND's move to DI.

So go ahead and speculate away. Just don't tell me that any of it has a thing to do with "the truth."

Now really, did you have to bring Captain Kangoo into this? Next thing you know you'll add Mickey Mouse!

[bincitysioux]

I should have said this is all dependant on you guys actually going through on the deal. No smack buy kuppy did leave himself an out on the deal if he wanted to stay DII.

I think that UND needs to do what's best for them, but Kupchella has left the door wide open to say, "We did the math and DII is the best place for the [insert new team name here ]," in a year.

I always laugh when a Bison fans argue that by not declaring 2006 the exploratory year that Kupchella is obviously creating an exit strategy. What's the big deal about taking two years to plan things out the right way. Were you all so up-in-arms when President Chapman also left NDSU a two year window from the time NDSU announced their intention to go DI to the time they actually joined DI?

[jimdahl]

I think it is an exit strategy, but not in the way hoped for by those who desperately want UND stay D-II. I think Kupchella is very risk averse about committing to big new athletics expenses but the athletics and alumni leaders have assured him the money will be there. I think they got to announce the reclassification, with the completion of the process contingent on using the two years to "show him the money".

If that's the case, I have a good deal of confidence that they correctly estimated their ability to raise the additional funds and it would take an unexpected catastrophic event to cause UND to step back.