SiouxMeNow Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 Just a couple years ago - I would have laughed at this suggestion but Bemidji States' performance last year in the National Tournament (they did give Denver their toughest game ) and really over the last couple years against the WCHA - maybe it's time to consider they'd be a good addition to the WCHA?? --Michigan Tech is a pain of a roadtrip for just about everyone and a consistent cellar dweller. Really they're better suited to the CCHA of the CHA (replacing Bemidji). --Bemidji is a good geographical fit for several WCHA teams! --They are a fully funded program!! (18 schollys - but damned if I know how they do it with 2400 seats! ) I'm just shooting in the dark here but it seems like BSU has gone from to a decent DI hockey contender...they've paid their dues and I think it's time they move up to the big time - then it's SINK or SWIM! (I think they'll swim!*) (* - or at LEAST be better than Tech ) could this ever happen? Would the WCHA consider realignment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 Wow. Just in case you missed the 15 threads about this on USCHO.com First off: Michigan Tech wasn't always a patsy. And if they go, they take the McNaughton with them. Before anyone brings it up, UAA leaves, then we lose a game in our season or something to that effect. I believe we get an extra conference game for either playing UAA in general or travelling to UAA. I can't remember the specifics. If we HAD to realign, really, the team that could lose out would be MSU Mankato. They are the newest program to the WCHA, IIRC. The more appropriate question would be: What would happen if the WCHA expanded to 12 teams by adding BSU and UNO? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiouxMeNow Posted December 18, 2005 Author Share Posted December 18, 2005 Wow. Just in case you missed the 15 threads about this on USCHO.com First off: Michigan Tech wasn't always a patsy. And if they go, they take the McNaughton with them. Before anyone brings it up, UAA leaves, then we lose a game in our season or something to that effect. I believe we get an extra conference game for either playing UAA in general or travelling to UAA. I can't remember the specifics. If we HAD to realign, really, the team that could lose out would be MSU Mankato. They are the newest program to the WCHA, IIRC. The more appropriate question would be: What would happen if the WCHA expanded to 12 teams by adding BSU and UNO? Sorry...not a CRUISER like you? (you need to hook up with BigMrG - he doesn't have a lot to do either! ) So screw UAA! That's another money-draining roadtrip - I say bring on UNO and BSU! These are actually ROADTRIPS we can make! Mankato has had more recent success that either UAA or Michigan Tech - and BTW - Tech couldn't GIVE AWAY more than 1600 at $6 a seat in their last "big" series...what the hell else is there to do on a weekend night in Houghton??? Thats cheaper than a movie! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnt Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 I would love to see Bemidji State in the WCHA. Another driveable road trip and regional rival couldn't hurt. I hear every year WCHA coaches saying what a hard trip it is to Anchorage, and I wonder why they ever took them into the league. Anchorage used to pay for WCHA teams to go out there, but now the teams agreed to remove that stipulation. Why schools put that extra strain on their budgets along with the fatigue which affects not only that series but the next (the gophers this year), is beyond me. Nevermind the fact that Anchorage isn't the model WCHA school and not exactly a big draw, and my vote is to get rid of Anchorage and replace them with Bemidji. It would be nice to have our own home and away opponent like Minnesota/St. Cloud and Denver/CC. Let's see, a short bus trip for a spirited battle or a ton of money to fly to a series that not many people give a rip about now that Chris Fournier is gone. Find a way to get it done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiouxMeNow Posted December 18, 2005 Author Share Posted December 18, 2005 I'm still scatching my head how they fund a DI program with that... ...of an arena they have? (Not to mention the anchor of a womens program BUT I won't go there ) I bet BSU wishes they could have an arena like the Old Ralph...seems like that would be perfect for them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZSIOUX Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 I'm still scatching my head how they fund a DI program with that... ...of an arena they have? (Not to mention the anchor of a womens program BUT I won't go there ) I bet BSU wishes they could have an arena like the Old Ralph...seems like that would be perfect for them! cant we just load the old ralph on a GIANT trailer and put it down in downtown bemidji Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 cant we just load the old ralph on a GIANT trailer and put it down in downtown bemidji A friend of mine has season BSU tickets, I think he said they were $70.00. They must get alot of alumni money? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZSIOUX Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 they have plans for a convention center with a arena in it planned out as of now. hopefully this will all happen for bsu. they have a good program on the up and should be in the wcha hopefully. i put bemidji in and either mankato or alaska goes. financially alaska would be the choice because bemidji is located very well with most of the current wcha teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZSIOUX Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 A friend of mine has season BSU tickets, I think he said they were $70.00. They must get alot of alumni money? 185.00 is the price i have heard located in the discussion thread here... http://www.thebeaverpond.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fighting Sioux Fan Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 You cannot kick out Mankato, it clashes with the NCC theme in the WCHA. I could stand seeing MTech and AA go, but that really doesn't do much good for college hockey. MT takes the McNaughton Cup if they go and while the trip to AA is not convenient, is it better to lose another college team in D1 hockey? Why not make the WCHA a twelve team conference? How would that affect scheduling? I would love it if BSU joined the WCHA as that would be a road game that I could easily drive to and UNO is a traditional NCC rival for UND. They make a good fit because of the rivalries against all of the NCC teams in the WCHA. WCHA East Wisconsin Minnesota Michigan Tech Minnesota Duluth SCSU Mankato WCHA West North Dokata Denver Colorado College Nebraska Omaha AA Bemidji State Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 (edited) You cannot kick out Mankato, it clashes with the NCC theme in the WCHA. I could stand seeing MTech and AA go, but that really doesn't do much good for college hockey. MT takes the McNaughton Cup if they go and while the trip to AA is not convenient, is it better to lose another college team in D1 hockey? Why not make the WCHA a twelve team conference? How would that affect scheduling? I would love it if BSU joined the WCHA as that would be a road game that I could easily drive to and UNO is a traditional NCC rival for UND. They make a good fit because of the rivalries against all of the NCC teams in the WCHA. WCHA East Wisconsin Minnesota Michigan Tech Minnesota Duluth SCSU Mankato WCHA West North Dakota Denver Colorado College Nebraska Omaha AA Bemidji State Here is what I said earlier about this We may be visiting this issue again in the future, I hope not just a hunch though. I had an argument this morning about this at the corner bar with a BSU of mine on how UND and WCHA fans don't want to give up a traditional rivals like UofMN and UofWisconsin to play four games with the Beavers but I don't know what do you do with the members of the CHA after Air Force leaves. Robert Morris to the ACHA, Niagra to the EZAC Huntsville and BSU to the WCHA, I suppose WSU to the CCHA. I can't see the WCHA going to 12 teams unless we do way with 4-6 more non conference games and then the schedule still gets more unbalanced. Honestly I don't see the WCHA going to a 12 team league, or using my senario either, not with the unbalanced WCHA schedule and why would UNO leave the CCHA? The SOS wouldn't even be the same in the league you have suggested. Next, anything that doesn't include a majority of our games including Minnesota, Wisconsin and UMD year after year isn't exceptable in my opinion. I'd beat anyone money its not going to happen. The WCHA has to approve it first and the NCAA isn't going to make the conferences take extra teams. Edited December 18, 2005 by Goon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnt Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 There is no way they should expand the WCHA, unless you want to see rivals like Minnesota and Wisconsin less. I thought the WCHA was stupid for taking Alaska to begin with. There were some regional teams they could have considered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 Division one hockey is going to have to do something, but I just don't want the make up of our league changing, I like the fact that UND gets to play rougly 10 non conference games every year. It gives the fans a chance to see how they stack up against the rest of the competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 Goon- UAH in the WCHA? Are you insane? Send them to a league more to their suiting and talent levels, like the AHA. I wouldn't want to give up games against top tier opponents even if it would mean beating UAH 12-1, 8-0 in a 2 game series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 I've always had a soft spot for Bemidji State. Their ties to UND hockey over the years, and the fact they have a very rich hockey tradition at a lower level make them, IMO, very similar to UND. I think this is a rivalry that would be more interesting than the "rivalry" with SCCC. I'd love to see them in the WCHA, but the circumstances don't allow it. They've made some noise at the D1 level, and I suspect they will be the first CHA team to make the Big Dance some day. If they do, I'll be cheering for them ... unless they play the Sioux, then they can die and burn in Hell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millsy Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 BSU is not at a full 18 scholies yet. I believe they are at 14 or 15 right now and should be at 18 either next year or the year after. Saw the plans for the new event center in Bemidji on Friday night in the Beaver Pride Room. A $35 million, 3500 seat arena is going to be a very tough sell to the non-hockey people in Bemidji. There are a lot of people in the Bemidji area that do not want to see money spent on anything. It was a tough sell to set a 1/2 cent sales tax to fix up the parks and trails in Bemidji, most of which were WPA projects and in disrepair. The non-hockey people see this as a hockey arena, not something that will benifit the area. And there still seems to be some friction betwenn the University and the Town, even though it is less than it was a few years ago. They need to realize that they each need each other in order to survive. Without the University, the town would be a lot like International Falls, and without the City, the University will have a very hard time getting anything that will benifit them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 I just don't think giving the death blow to the CHA, potentially causing 3 or 4 schools to drop DI hockey, and only getting to see UMD, UM, and UW in GF every other year is worth it just to have a close road trip to Bemidji. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiouxMeNow Posted December 19, 2005 Author Share Posted December 19, 2005 At a minimum...I'd want to see BSU upgrade their facilities before they'd be considered for the WCHA - we're the premier league for facilities far and away. I think their convention center proposal would work - even though it's small by WCHA standards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZSIOUX Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 At a minimum...I'd want to see BSU upgrade their facilities before they'd be considered for the WCHA - we're the premier league for facilities far and away. I think their convention center proposal would work - even though it's small by WCHA standards. they should have 5,000 to 6,000 in the new plans...3,500 seems pretty low? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
govikes27 Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 Division one hockey is going to have to do something, but I just don't want the make up of our league changing, I like the fact that UND gets to play rougly 10 non conference games every year. It gives the fans a chance to see how they stack up against the rest of the competition. The problem with the status-quo in college hockey is that all the conferences (besides the hodgepodge that is the CHA) are full, so that even if a school wanted to start up a hockey program it could have a hard time getting into a conference, especially ones west of the Mississippi. Not that there are schools lining up to have hockey programs, but hypothetically it could an obstacle in the sport's growth at the college level. I seem to recall UNO's revenue from hockey a few years after their program started turning a few heads, though I don't think anything ever really came of it. Maybe if the mythical Big Ten Hockey conference ever materializes it will shake things up. Anyways, just a few random thoughts. Wasn't South Dakota looking at hockey a couple of years ago? What happened to that, did it just fizzle out? (sorry if it's old news) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millsy Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 they should have 5,000 to 6,000 in the new plans...3,500 seems pretty low? There is no way that the area around Bemidji would support 5000-6000 seats. I know a lot of people who don't go to the Beaver games right now because of the arena, but there is no where near 2500+ of them. If it was a 5000-6000 seat arena, BSU would rely on visiting fans to help fill the place, and now all of a sudden a home game turns into a road game. Plus it is better to have 3500 seats and people wanting to get in then a 6000 seat arena with it half full. Right now, I still believe that College Hockey needs the CHA to survive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 Wasn't South Dakota looking at hockey a couple of years ago? What happened to that, did it just fizzle out? (sorry if it's old news) I vaguely recall one of the SoDak schools having a club team or exploring a "real" team at some point in the past. Herb Brooks was of the opinion that that 'SU and at least one Iowa school, probably Iowa State, would be great candidates for D1 programs. As has been noted, a full D1 hockey program costs alot of money, and not all programs make money. As well, I don't see alot of other institutions with the fortitude to do what it takes to move club or D3 programs to the D1 level. Unless a school gets a ton of money dropped on it, ala Ralph, specifically for hockey I don't think there will be any major expansions going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airmail Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 A $35 million, 3500 seat arena is going to be a very tough sell to the non-hockey people in Bemidji. There are a lot of people in the Bemidji area that do not want to see money spent on anything. It was a tough sell to set a 1/2 cent sales tax to fix up the parks and trails in Bemidji, most of which were WPA projects and in disrepair. The non-hockey people see this as a hockey arena, not something that will benifit the area. And there still seems to be some friction betwenn the University and the Town, even though it is less than it was a few years ago. They need to realize that they each need each other in order to survive. Without the University, the town would be a lot like International Falls, and without the City, the University will have a very hard time getting anything that will benifit them. I understand your points, but disagree. With all of the new infrastrucure that has popped up over the last 5-10 years, Bemidji seems to be catering to the regional population more than to those within the city. (certainly the constantly expanding new populous in the area doesn't hold the grudges and close-mindedness as the now dwindling old) With new plans for an outlet mall and other retail and industrial businesses on the table, it seems that the event center/ arena is just another step in the "destination city" classification that Bemidji is leaning toward... and having success with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millsy Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 I understand your points, but disagree. With all of the new infrastrucure that has popped up over the last 5-10 years, Bemidji seems to be catering to the regional population more than to those within the city. (certainly the constantly expanding new populous in the area doesn't hold the grudges and close-mindedness as the now dwindling old) With new plans for an outlet mall and other retail and industrial businesses on the table, it seems that the event center/ arena is just another step in the "destination city" classification that Bemidji is leaning toward... and having success with. Good Points airmail. Bemidji is catering to the Regional population, but the problem is, the 1/2 cent sales tax extension has to pass the City voters, not those of us who visit the city quite often (I live 80 miles from BSU). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roper1313 Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 they should have 5,000 to 6,000 in the new plans...3,500 seems pretty low? Some perspective- Duluth/Superior- Population 112,497 (2004 US cenus est.) DECC- 5,333 (4.7%) Proposed arena- 6,630 (5.9%) Bemidji- Population 13,016 (2004 US census est.) Glas Fieldhouse- 2399 (18.4%) Proposed arena- 3,500 (27.9%) IMO, its not the size that matters, but the quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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