Carthage College and Midwestern State capitulate

[jimdahl]

The one other interesting thing that happened in the "missing" period that needed reintroduction into the official record is Carthage College and Midwestern State agreed to stop using Indian names / imagery.

[MafiaMan]

The one other interesting thing that happened in the "missing" period that needed reintroduction into the official record is Carthage College and Midwestern State agreed to stop using Indian names / imagery.

The issue of Carthage College is particularly humorous. Sports Illustrated even pointed this out in their NCAA basketball issue a few weeks ago under the "This Week's Sign of the Apocalypse" heading. Carthage College has changed their name from the Redmen to the Red Men (I am kidding you not) to disassociate itself from Native American imagery.

[YaneA]

Yes, and Carthage has to undertake an "educational" campaign to make the disassociation clear to anyone who can't quite figure it out themselves or who has a memory of the old name "Redmen" and of the feathers that, in a previous life, stuck out from the "C" logo.

[PCM]

This is why I think renaming UND's athletic teams the Raging Reds would be perfect. The NCAA has no problem with using the word "red" in a nickname as long as it's not associated with American Indians.

All we'd have to do is explain to Bernie Franklin at the NCAA that "Reds" refers to the Red and Red Lake rivers that have periodically raged through the communities of Grand Forks and East Grand Forks. How could there possibly be a problem with using "Reds" in a historical, geographical and geological context?

For good measure, we could further please the NCAA by voluntarily agreeing to stop using the offensive Siouan word "Dakota." Being located at the confluence of the Red River and Red Lake River, UND will the become the University of Fork, which will be shortened to Fork U.

[The Sicatoka]

... which will be shortened to Fork U.

Which would be shortened to something pronounced "eff-ewe".

[MafiaMan]

Yes, and Carthage has to undertake an "educational" campaign to make the disassociation clear to anyone who can't quite figure it out themselves or who has a memory of the old name "Redmen" and of the feathers that, in a previous life, stuck out from the "C" logo.

I was aware of that, too. Maybe it's just me, but does that remind anyone else of Stalin's Soviet Union or Mao's cultural revolution in China?

[PCM]

I was aware of that, too. Maybe it's just me, but does that remind anyone else of Stalin's Soviet Union or Mao's cultural revolution in China?

Bite your tongue, comrade!

[JESUS,family,rutgers]

mafiaman, you are right. Communist countries have been trying to make Christianity disappear for decades. People in Communist China and North Korea who are found in "unregistered churches" at the very least lose their homes and jobs and at the worst are sent to prison or disappear forever. In North Korea, Christians who don't give up their religion have been taken to airport runways,tied up with their faces up and had steamrollers run over them. Despite the government playing thought police, a large revival has been taking place. When any government starts talking about re-educating people's thoughts, it is getting into a very dangerous area.

[mako]

The point that the NCAA is making is that UND is being irresponsible. During the Jackson administration the only good Indian was a dead Indian. Genocide was the order of the century. Family were ripped apart as Indian Agents carted children off to boarding schools with the help of local police. Children were punished for speaking their language. They were taught to be ashamed of who they were. Sexual predators and perverts had their way with defenseless children, suicide was high. Today Native Americans are three times more likely to commit suicide than non-Natives.

UND continues to be culturally irresponsible when all the tribes in North Dakota sent representatives to Bismark to discuss the mascot issue. Representatives from the five federally recognized tribes in North Dakota voted unanimously to support the resolution that calls for UND to change the mascot name. Our tribal leaders have spoken and are being ignored. Now we are in a dogfight. Please reconsider your support for the UND mascot issue.

[dakotadan]

During the Jackson administration the only good Indian was a dead Indian. Genocide was the order of the century. Family were ripped apart as Indian Agents carted children off to boarding schools with the help of local police. Children were punished for speaking their language. They were taught to be ashamed of who they were. Sexual predators and perverts had their way with defenseless children, suicide was high. Today Native Americans are three times more likely to commit suicide than non-Natives.

And this was all because UND uses the Sioux name? I fail to see what this has to do with our hockey team using a beautiful logo on it's jersey. Every race and culture has hardships in it's history. Making UND change it's logo is not going to erase history.

Edited December 1, 2005 by dakotadan

[Sioux-cia]

mako, please explain to us how using the Sioux name and an American Indian logo keeps the American Indian from moving forward generations after the injustices that were inflicted on them occurred?

How is the American Indian any different from any other race that had similar fates?

What other race/ethnic group in American has 'been taken care of' by the government like the American Indian? Not the African American who was brought here forcefully, not the Mexican American who also endured the same atrocities as the American Indian, not the Japanese American who was imprisoned because of his/her ancestry, not the Jew who faced being slaughtered and was still denied entry into the United States, not the Irish American, etc, etc, etc.

The American Indian has been given much more than any other American by the American government and still continues to find excuses to not move forward.

I don't understand.

[Smoggy]

UND continues to be culturally irresponsible when all the tribes in North Dakota sent representatives to Bismark to discuss the mascot issue. Representatives from the five federally recognized tribes in North Dakota voted unanimously to support the resolution that calls for UND to change the mascot name. Our tribal leaders have spoken and are being ignored. Now we are in a dogfight. Please reconsider your support for the UND mascot issue.

Do those leaders truly speak the consensus of the people or are they on their own agenda?

[redwing77]

And this was all because UND uses the Sioux name? I fail to see what this has to do with our hockey team using a beautiful logo on it's jersey. Every race and culture has hardships in it's history. Making UND change it's logo is not going to erase history.

Yes.

The Fighting Sioux nickname causes alcoholism, low graduation rate, diabetes, disease, poverty, and the bending of the Native Americans under the heel of the "White Man."

Changing the nickname will prove that because the day after we change the name, all of it will change.

Sorry mako, solve your own problems before you start telling us who we can and cannot honor.

[The Sicatoka]

Yes.

The Fighting Sioux nickname causes alcoholism, low graduation rate, diabetes, disease, poverty, and the bending of the Native Americans under the heel of the "White Man."

Changing the nickname will prove that because the day after we change the name, all of it will change.

Sorry mako, solve your own problems before you start telling us who we can and cannot honor.

You missed one: Let's get Andrew Jackson out of the Oval Office.