Frank DeFord SI.com Article

[MafiaMan]

Frank DeFord's "American Indian nicknames do not honor the culture"

Found on www.si.com today...

[ESPNInsider]

I thought that was actually a pretty good article. It wasn't like Yellowbird's constant whining and most of the other articles which come across as being hate-filled.

[PCM]

I find it rather amusing that Deford would write this...

So long as we reflexively think of Indians as perpetual fighters in war paint, we cannot so easily connect with the real Native Americans of today, understand their plight, and appreciate how desperately they battle poverty, alcoholism, drug addiction along with a general hopelessness that result in such a high suicide rate. Sport nicknames may seem like a small, even foolish, thing, but their visibility helps keep Indians trapped in history, cartoon figures frozen on the warpath.

...for a column headlined:

Heap big hypocrisy

I guess it takes a hypocrite to spot hypocrisy, eh?

And who is the "we" Deford refers to that thinks of Indians as "perpetual fighters in war paint"? Speak for yourself, Frank.

[ScottM]

Never did white man speak with such forked tongue.

Looks like the author was watching too many 50s westerns with his bourbon when he wrote this screed.

[PCM]

Think this is the Scandinavians' idea of respecting their culture? Or maybe this?

[GeauxSioux]

I can understand how Redskins can be deemed inappropriate, but I don't understand how the use of the name Sioux is wrong. Isn't the name Dakota also a native american word? Are we supposed to also change the name of the state? How about all of the other states that have native american names?

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0854966.html

I know that some of the other schools on the list use a mascot, which UND doesn't. Is the mascot the main crux of the controversy?

[DamStrait]

Frank DeFord's "American Indian nicknames do not honor the culture"

Found on www.si.com today...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This just confirms my opinion that DeFord is a bombastic pompous ass.

[johnsowe]

This is the funny one

Minnesota From a Dakota Indian word meaning

[Goon]

This just confirms my opinion that DeFord is a bombastic pompous ass.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We will just tell this moron that name isn't going any where.

The name is bigger than this guy. True UND Alumni can not let these people take our proud name away from us.

[dagies]

Never did white man speak with such forked tongue.

Heap big hypocrisy

PCM, ScottM, good calls.

But Native American activists I've spoken to believe that the use of such nicknames -- and the display of dancing costumed mascots, who amuse the crowds at games -- manage to perpetuate the Hollywood version of Indians that we've all had pressed into our minds.

I wonder if he's ever seen a game at UND. I think things are handled a little differently here.

And, indeed, there are some Indians themselves who think the nicknames and mascots are respectful. I've even spoken to some such tribal elders.

It's nice that he mentioned this, but I find it surprising that he was so easily able to dismiss it. He, above, talked to "Native American activists" and felt they had great things to say. But apprarently talking to the average joe doesn't carry nearly the impact..........

[ESPNInsider]

Just found another article on USAToday:

Article here

Pretty much same old, same old. Thought someone might want to read it though.

[dagies]

From the USA today article ESPNInsider linked above:

Our society has co-opted another culture, one largely decimated, and mocked it for commercial purposes.

Oh oh.

[PCM]

For the record, I do think the Washington Redskins should change their name and the Cleveland Indians should update their logo. But that's as far as I'll go in agreeing with Jon Saraceno's column in USA Today.

Craig Stanley, a New Jersey Democrat and church deacon in Newark, wants to halt the team (New Jersey Devils) from using the moniker. He will introduce a resolution this month asking to replace the nickname with something less demonic, even though the team mascot is based on the mythical Jersey Devil and not the antichrist symbol. (Atheists living in Anaheim, no doubt, will want to contact their legislators about the Angels).

The devil may be in the details, but I have a difficult time getting worked up over something this silly and harmless.

In other words, if a Christian finds something offensive and demeaning, it becomes "silly and harmless." But it if some American Indians take issue with a word or symbol they find offensive, the world should immediately bow to their demands.

I'm no Phi Beta Kappa, but I don't call it "educational" when a student dressed as a Native American rides an Appaloosa into Doak Campbell Stadium before firing a flaming spear into the ground.

I'm also no Phi Beta Kappa, but I don't call shooting a ball through a hoop, firing a puck into a net or punching a football over a goal line "educational." Despite what I think, colleges across the country insist on engaging in such activities.

Our society has co-opted another culture, one largely decimated, and mocked it for commercial purposes. It then has the arrogance to suggest no one is harmed.

Back in the days when I was a bonafide reporter, I did a story about an alleged miracle cure for cancer called laetrile. Some claimed that the drug companies and the federal government were conspiring to keep laetrile from the public.

When I asked a doctor who specialized in cancer treatment about it, he said, "If laetrile worked even half as well as claimed, they'd have no trouble proving that it worked."

And that was the problem. Despite all the claims made, nobody could produce one shred of scientific evidence showing that laetrile cured cancer as claimed. We were all supposed to assume that because a few people offered anecdotal evidence that they got better after using it, laetrile should be legalized.

Saraceno expects us to make the same leap of faith on the nickname issue. He says it's arrogant "to suggest that no one is harmed," but provides absolutely no evidence that anyone is harmed. He simply assumes it. If every sports team dropped its Indian-related name or logo tomorrow, there's no evidence that anyone will be helped in the near term or the long term.

But we should do it anyway because those who agree with Saraceno are "smart" and visionary while those who disagree with him are "wrong" and "ignorant." At least the guy's not arrogant.

[ScottM]

A series of committee meetings will be conducted this summer that could force schools such as Florida State and Southeastern Oklahoma State to abolish their nicknames, in this case, the Seminoles and the Savages.

I can't recall, but I do not believe the NC$$ has the power to force schools to change their names, so much as create "incentives", e.g., limit post-season play, etc. (Unless they want to end up in a big fight, which they would probably lose.) Even this last one is considered a stretch by even the most candy-assed losers pushing this crap.

[dagies]

PCM, great distinctions in dissecting that article.

I felt the same way on your last point. I fail to see how the position of activists (who admittedly have an agenda) is more representative of the population than the average person who might have no problem with the nickname. In fact, he could find supporters. Probably one for every "activist".

I also agree with your first point about the Redskins. There are names that go too far. I don't know about the more generic names like Warriors and Savages. That can apply to many people, not just Native Americans.

I'm allowing for the possibility that one day someone will provide a persuasive enough argument that I'll agree that changing the name is the right thing to do.

So far I haven't seen it.

[Smoggy]

There are names that go too far.  I don't know about the more generic names like Warriors and Savages.  That can apply to many people, not just Native Americans.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's what I was thinking in reading these articles. I don't believe that Golden State has anything in their symbols dealing with Native Americans.

[Goon]

I can't recall, but I do not believe the NC$$ has the power to force schools to change their names, so much as create "incentives", e.g., limit post-season play, etc.  (Unless they want to end up in a big fight, which they would probably lose.)  Even this last one is considered a stretch by even the most candy-assed losers pushing this crap.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They said as much during the articles in the Heraldo.

[PCM]

Look at where this type of thinking leads. There are some academics who believe that until toilets are redesigned and women have urinals, sexism will never end. Sure, they're a minority, but if even a few women are offended by urinals, shouldn't we just give them what they want?