is racism at UND fundamental?

[JBB]

The D1 debate has exposed another subtle racist attitude coming from the UND president and the herald. There are many more athletes of color in D1 sports, except for D1 hockey. Among the many reasons given why UND should not move up to D1 is the disturbing "too many criminal problems with D1 athletes". The statement would seem to except hockey players since UND actively promotes its D1 hockey involvement and discourages all other D1 participation.

Isn't that in line with the racial and cultural insensitivity the entire UND institution has exhibited with the "naming issue"?

[mksioux]

I think this might be the stupidest post I've ever read on any message board. Obviously, JBB, you have fallen into a subject you know nothing about and are now simply taking jabs at UND wherever you can. Luckily, I think most Bison fans are not so immature as to take the rivalry to this level.

In reading all your other posts, it's really cute how you refuse to capitalize UND or the 'g' and 'f' in Grand Forks while always capitalizing NDSU and Fargo. Are you 12?

I think your visceral hatred of all things UND and Grand Forks speaks to your insecurities about NDSU. If you truly believed UND didn't matter to NDSU, you wouldn't be on our board daily spouting off against UND and Grand Forks.

[JBB]

By personalizing the issue dont you avoid it? The point is valid. You have lashed out. That is adolescent.

[The Sicatoka]

Here is Dr. Kupchella's statement:

http://www.UND.edu/president/div1.html

What he said was, "There are great problems in intercollegiate athletics in America, and while these span all the divisions of the National Collegiate Athletic Association, most scandals seem to be associated with Division I."

He did not refer to the nature or types of scandals, nor to the perpetrators.

You are attempting to associate or infer something that just is not there.

However, with your opening sentence you may have slandered Dr. Kupchella. It would be wise for you to attribute the source for the statement you have in quotation marks.

[sprig]

Is ignorance fundamental at NDSU? As Sic has posted, you've made a giant leap from what the UND President said.

Why do you equate a division with more persons of color to more "criminal" activity? Who, exactly, is treading near racism here? It would appear to be you, JBB. Hope you don't represent the U to the south.

[mksioux]

By personalizing the issue dont you avoid it?  The point is valid.  You have lashed out.  That is adolescent.

I have lashed out? I believe you were the one who called a University President a racist without any supporting facts.

[PCM]

When in doubt, play the race card, right, JBB? That's not "personalizing the issue," is it?

It's interesting to note that after a two-year investigation at UND, the US Department of Education's Office for Civil Rights found no signs of pervasive or severe racism at the university.

I wouldn't get too smug about team names if I were you, JBB. Given the fact that Native Americans consider the bison a sacred animal, NDSU's moniker could easily end up on the PC hit list.

[ScottM]

Is ignorance fundamental at NDSU?

No, but utter stupidity seems to be the norm.

[sprig]

No, but utter stupidity seems to be the norm.

I think of it as udder stupidity

[Taz Boy]

The all-consuming jealousy of the stellar academic and athletic programs at UND that this particular NDSJC grad is harboring is rather amusing. At least in times of economic stress, we know we can count on Bison alums to serve up burgers nice 'n hot at the local McD's.

Thanks a billion (served), JBB,

mka

[teamsioux]

I have to thank JBB for the comic relief and the good laughs he gives me on this and other message boards. He is always good for at least a few laughs a day. For a school going D1, NDSU fans sure do worry a lot about what UND is doing. And if UND is so racist, one would think that NDSU would not even want to play us when they are high and mighty(and unsuccessful) in D1 and no longer have to play UND because of NCC requirements. I don't think we even deserve to play a school of such stature and outstanding citizens such as NDSU!! They are way too classy of a school to have to play a bunch of scumbag racists like UND!

Doesn't JBB realize that it is not Kupchellas decision to move to D1, we all know it is that damn Nazi Uncle Ralphie running the show here anyway, right JBB?

[Goon]

The D1 debate has exposed another subtle racist attitude coming from the UND president and the herald. There are many more athletes of color in D1 sports, except for D1 hockey. Among the many reasons given why UND should not move up to D1 is the disturbing "too many criminal problems with D1 athletes". The statement would seem to except hockey players since UND actively promotes its D1 hockey involvement and discourages all other D1 participation.

Isn't that in line with the racial and cultural insensitivity the entire UND institution has exhibited with the "naming issue"?

In reviewing this post, not once but a couple of times I have come to the conclusion that this has to be one of the most intellectually deficient statements I have read for quite some time, I hope you didn

[JBB]

Goon,

After reading your comments I too think your nick is appropriate.

Just 2 days after my post I was very disappointed to hear, on the liberal NPR, a story about racism on the UND campus. It was not very flattering to your institution and to North Dakotans as a whole. My post was timely and justified.

Your response, and those of our peers, smack of denial.

[kr]

jbb, since I don't know how much exposure you've had to NPR, I'll assume you don't listen too much to NPR or maybe that you're unable to form your own opinion(s). I've been a listener/member of NPR for years (I'm old) and I've learned a lot from that organization, but I've also learned that MANY of the programs they air seem to have an "agenda" which they are promoting. I did not hear the actual program you're referring to, however if it's like much of the programing it was produced/developed around a theme. I challenge you to name one institution of higher learning which doesn't have some form/degree of "ism" be it racism, sexism, ageism - I don't think that last one is a word, but since we're talking NPR I'm not going to let some silly facts get in the way of my argument!!! Every institution could be subjected to such an expose.

Did the program say why it was targeting UND? Was UND the only institution under investigation in the program?

And pleezzzeeee stop talking about denial ---- your inability to type UND and/or Grand Forks smacks of denial of proper rules of "capitalization" and/or respect!!!

[JBB]

the story was focused on UND and its history or racism with the logo and exploitation of native culture at the center of the controversy. It was uncomplimentary and unfortunately degrades not only UND and its constituents but all of North Dakota.

Bridges is entirely correct. No human logos should be used as sports mascots. I just had to sit through another story concerning their protest. Again it was an embarrassment to UND and its constituents and North Dakota as a whole.

Your response was very thoughtful and a far cry from the usual denial that almost always attempts to mock the dissenting opinion. No caps are coming your way until respect is earned on the issue of human rights. At this point I do not believe yours is a proper name. you bring disgrace upon the State of North Dakota.

I especially take offense at the common reply of many UND constituents when they will post a banner, produced by others, that shows the native culture in some degrading way. These people are quick to jump on that but refuse to realize that it is their own original disregard for cultural integrity that opens the door to these types of things. After all, if your not going to recognize the violation of human dignity why should others? After all its only an abstract reference. Just insisting its ok does not make it so. running down others that feel your cultural exploitation is dishonorable is a common, and distasteful tactic, typical of denial.

At least UND should be paying cash royalties to the culture it has decided to exploit for profit

[The Sicatoka]

"Asked if high school and college teams should stop using Indian nicknames, 81% of Native American respondents said no."

Source: Sports Illustrated, March 4, 2002, page 69

Survey: Peter Harris Research Group

Methodology: 351 Native American interviewed (217 on reservations, 134 living off). Responses weighted according to US census figures for age, race and gender, and for distribution of Native American on and off reservations.

Margin of Error: plus or minus 4%

NPR or the Native Peoples themselves?

[JBB]

Does that poll give UND the right to exploit a culture that has objected? The original post pointed out how subtle and pervasive this racist attitude is at UND. The original point has since been reinforced by two regionally (nationally?) broadcast radio reports.

The comments that somehow you have a right to exploit cultures and human dignity because SI had some kind of poll don't offer much rebuttal. In fact, those comments tend to reinforce the negative and distasteful image now shrouding UND by insisting it has the right to exploit native american culture because a majority of native americans do not object. It remains a tragic situation and an embarrassment to UND, its constituents and the people of North Dakota that pay taxes to fund it.

[PCM]

the story was focused on UND and its history or racism with the logo and exploitation of native culture at the center of the controversy. It was uncomplimentary and unfortunately degrades not only UND and its constituents but all of North Dakota.

Gosh, imagine that. NPR joined the thundering media herd and provided its typically biased, slanted, sensationalized, liberal view of an issue. I never cease to be amazed when this happens.

Bridges is entirely correct.

That, of course, is your opinion. There are many who disagree. According to a poll commissioned by Sports Illustrated, that includes a large majority of Native Americans.

No human logos should be used as sports mascots.

No Raiders? No Vikings? No Buccaneers? No Fighting Irish? No Trojans? No Vandals? No Spartans? No Deacons? I wasn't aware that all these groups and their decendents were complaining about their human dignity being violated.

I would think that the use of animals considered sacred to Native Americans should be off limits, too. After all, NDSU is being culturally insensitive by exploiting the sacred bison for profit. In addition, given the fact that activists in South Dakota have asked the Watertown High School Arrows to stop using their logo because it appears to show eagle feathers, a similar request to the NDSU Bison can

[The Sicatoka]

Does that poll give UND the right to exploit a culture that has objected?

When 81% of Native Americans say the names should not change, has the culture objected?

[JBB]

You ask what percentage of the population that comprises the culture must be offended?

Apparently 19% nationally isn't enough? Are you telling me that an 81% majority gives you the "right" to exploit a regional culture that has expressed its own displeasure independent of the SI poll?

[The Sicatoka]

You rarely find 4 to 1 agreement on any issue within any demographic.

Are you telling me that an 81% majority gives you the "right" to exploit a regional culture that has expressed its own displeasure independent of the SI poll?

Great point. It's difficult to believe that anyone would stoop so low as to "exploit a regional culture" for the sole purpose of making a buck. How revolting. Certainly you would never expect the Standing Rock Sioux to do anything like that, would you?

[JBB]

Its their culture, not yours.

[The Sicatoka]

In American culture the American Flag is sacred and should not be misused. It should only be used in ways the majority of the culture deems fit.

However, some use it in ways that others may not agree with. Why?

We live in the United States of America and using symbols and words is Constitutionally protected.

If one can express it, all can express it.

[The Sicatoka]

Next thing you know you'll be telling me only Chinese people should own and run Chinese restaurants.

[jimdahl]

Next thing you know you'll be telling me only Chinese people should own and run Chinese restaurants.

It depends if you're talking about authentic Chinese, or the more common Americanized Chinese (which can be operated in good conscience by Chinese-Americans).