CoteauRinkRat Posted November 10, 2003 Share Posted November 10, 2003 I am surprised that SU stayed at No. 5 - although that is probably where they deserve to be! I'm surprised also Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted November 10, 2003 Share Posted November 10, 2003 OK, now where are the numbers-grinders in this "one week to go" scenario? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND Fan Posted November 11, 2003 Share Posted November 11, 2003 Didn't move up much in the D2 poll -- No. 9! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted November 11, 2003 Author Share Posted November 11, 2003 OK, now where are the numbers-grinders in this "one week to go" scenario? I'm still not sure how much weight the strength of schedule index really merits, but for what it's worth, Winona has already clinched a higher s.o.s. index than NDSU regardless of what happens on Saturday, not to mention a better overall record. Winona currently has a 10.3, and would still have a 10.0 even if they were to lose to UMD. NDSU apparently can't finish with a higher s.o.s. than 9.64. NDSU is at number five more out of default than as some sort of an indication that they are on the verge of getting into the playoffs with a loss by Winona, Pitt St. or Emporia. And you can pretty much count on the fact that the national committee will override any attempt to keep an NSIC team out of the playoffs. It's been done before. Hallstrom, Michaels and Gene Taylor are on WDAY radio right now trying to talk themselves into the idea that NDSU still has a somewhat realistic chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WYOBISONMAN Posted November 11, 2003 Share Posted November 11, 2003 I think there is almost no way NDSU can get into the playoffs. The politics of the situation are all with the NSIC. But, if UMD and NDSU win big it will put a very interesting twist in the selection process. I think NDSU is better than any in the NSIC, but we are being penalize by the insane way D2 calculates strength of schedule. Oh well, so be it. If the herd gets in it would just be icing on a good season. A season that was better than many of us ever thought. It is just too bad the NSIC gets an almost automatic bid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSiouxFan Posted November 11, 2003 Share Posted November 11, 2003 My guess is if Pitt St. loses next wk they will still be ahead of the Bison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RD17 Posted November 11, 2003 Share Posted November 11, 2003 Here's the current regional strength of schedule index: 1. North Dakota 9-1 10.4 2. Emporia St. 9-1 10.1 3. Winona St. 9-1 10.3 4. Pitt St. 9-1 10.3 5. NDSU 7-3 9.3 6. Central Missouri 8-2 8.7 7. UNO 8-3 9.36 8. Minnesota Duluth 8-2 8.3 9. Concordia- St. Paul 8-2 8.7 10. Missouri Western 7-3 8.9 Some thoughts: Both Pitt St. and Winona St. could finish with a higher SSI than UND, but UND will still retain the #1 seed based on the fact that they've won 8 straight and are undefeated within the conference and region. Pitt St., win or lose, is a lock for the playoffs. If NDSU wins and Emporia loses to Central Missouri, it is likely that both teams could finish with the same SSI (9.64). I believe that Emporia would still get in over the Bison because of having a better overall record and it would be difficult to drop them out of the top 4 behind a team with 3 losses. The interesting part is what would happen if NDSU wins and Winona loses to UMD. Winona would still have the better overall record and SSI (10.0), BUT they would finish in 3rd place in the NSIC! Would the committee select a 3rd place NSIC team over a 3 loss NDSU? I have no idea how that scenario might work out. Another interesting tidbit. The reason Concordia- St. Paul, UMD, and CMSU all have such low SSI ratings relative to their records is that they made a mistake worse that scheduling a I-AA school- playing a DIII or NAIA school. If those three schools had all played bad D2 teams instead, you could add .7 to each school's SSI. All three would have a very good shot at making the playoffs with a win on Saturday instead of already being out of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted November 11, 2003 Author Share Posted November 11, 2003 The interesting part is what would happen if NDSU wins and Winona loses to UMD. Winona would still have the better overall record and SSI (10.0), BUT they would finish in 3rd place in the NSIC! Would the committee select a 3rd place NSIC team over a 3 loss NDSU? I have no idea how that scenario might work out. I was looking at that, also. But I am convinced that no matter how the various selection criteria come out, the bottom line is that I don't believe the national committee--which can and sometimes does veto the regional committees--will allow the NSIC to be shut out UNLESS there are four NCC/MIAA teams who all have a BETTER overall record than the top NSIC team. And by top NSIC team, I think that can mean either the conference champion or the team with the best overall resume. It's not necessarily fair, but the NSIC is probably going to get a bid every year from now on unless there is a situation where you have four NCC/MIAA teams with 9-1 or 10-1 records and the top NSIC team is at 8-3 or perhaps even 9-2. Since that can't happen this year, I fully expect Winona--or possibly even UMD despite their very poor strength of schedule index--to get in. Even Concordia still has an outside chance if they were to pull the huge upset and UMD were to defeat Winona. EDIT: I forgot about the expanded playoff field and the change in region make-up starting next year. With six bids instead of four, there's probably no chance at all for the NSIC to be shut out again starting next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WYOBISONMAN Posted November 11, 2003 Share Posted November 11, 2003 I also think that the national politics are against us getting in the playoffs if Winona looses. I am sure that the national selection committee is unhappy with NDSU leaving and would prefer we go away quietly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearer88 Posted November 11, 2003 Share Posted November 11, 2003 It is most likely that if Winona beats UMD this weekend that they will make the playoffs. Can anyone tell me how this could be? It is just a waste of a playoff spot. Winona is going to get smoked by whoever plays them in the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND Fan Posted November 11, 2003 Share Posted November 11, 2003 WYOBISONFAN - Although it isn't right, I would guess that you are probably correct that NDSU would not get any breaks from the Committee due to your leaving DII. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bisonfan1234 Posted November 11, 2003 Share Posted November 11, 2003 It is most likely that if Winona beats UMD this weekend that they will make the playoffs. Can anyone tell me how this could be? It is just a waste of a playoff spot. Winona is going to get smoked by whoever plays them in the playoffs. Smoked? Probably not. Beaten? Definately. Last year we beat Winona with a 2-8 team. It wasn't the prettiest victory...but we won. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beersong Posted November 13, 2003 Share Posted November 13, 2003 So if UMD beats Winona, the Bison are in? Or is it not that simple... I tried following all your scenarios but I'm not that smart... And if Winona gets in, I don't think they'll be an easy first round opponent for anyone. UMD almost knocked off the #1 seed last year, so anything can happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoDak Posted November 13, 2003 Share Posted November 13, 2003 I believe that Gene Taylor is on the selection committee. Can anyone confirm this? As I recall, he's on either the regional or national committee. Politics does play a role here and he might be the bison ace in the hole if he can call in favors from other committee members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted November 13, 2003 Share Posted November 13, 2003 Taylor is on the Midwest committee. Committee members have to step out of the conversations regarding their institutions, meaning they don't vote either. (I'm not sure if that's by rule or precident.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted November 13, 2003 Author Share Posted November 13, 2003 I'm sure many of you have heard this story, but for those who haven't, here it is: Prior to 2001, the NSIC had never received a playoff bid. It was widely assumed that the only way they had even a prayer was if one of their teams went undefeated, and even then it was far from a sure thing that a playoff bid would be awarded. At the end of the regular season in 2001, the regional committee selected UND, Pitt St., UNO and Central Missouri for the playoffs. However, the national committee overruled the regional committee and replaced Central Missouri, the second-place team from the MIAA, with Winona St., the champion of the NSIC. Winona was 10-1 during the regular season, with its one loss being a lop-sided one to USD. USD finished last in the NCC that year. Central Missouri had finished 9-2 during the regular season. Last year, the decision was easier because I believe UMD was undefeated during the regular season. They made a good showing with a narrow loss at number one seed NW Mo. St. It's up to each individual to decide whether what happened in 2001 set some sort of precedent or not, but it would appear to me that there's a pretty good chance that the NSIC team with the best overall resume will be selected for the playoffs over any NCC or MIAA team which has a worse overall record. Of course, with so many selection criteria, it's not difficult to make a case that an MIAA or NCC team may be more deserving. But in the end, I believe that the fact that NSIC teams have made a decent showing (and a good showing last year) in the playoffs the past two years has significantly bolstered their position, especially in the eyes of the national committee. Keep in mind that these guys seem to love including teams from the less well-funded conferences like the West Virginia league, the NE-10 (where Bentley plays--non-scholarship) and the NSIC. Of course, Winona takes away all doubt if they win on Saturday as they're probably expected to do, but even if they lose, don't be shocked in they--or possibly UMD--get in anyway. If a 10-1 NSIC team can get in over a 9-2 MIAA team, it's probably not much of a stretch to expect a 9-2 NSIC team to get in over an 8-3 NCC team, especially considering the pervasive attitude of some on the national committee who feel the smaller conferences should be represented if at all possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bisonfan1234 Posted November 13, 2003 Share Posted November 13, 2003 The main thing that keeps the NSIC less competitive than the NCC and MIAA is the limit of 21 scholorships for football while the NCC/MIAA have 36. UMD knows this and is switch to the NCC. Not only that, but the NSIC has 2 good teams and 2 decent ones (Winona, UMD good; CSP, BSU decent) while the NCC and MIAA ahve at least 5 solid teams each year (NDSU, UND, UNO, SDSU, SCSU for the NCC for example) even if their records don't reflect it from having to play each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hansel Posted November 13, 2003 Share Posted November 13, 2003 I believe that Gene Taylor is on the selection committee. Can anyone confirm this? As I recall, he's on either the regional or national committee. Politics does play a role here and he might be the bison ace in the hole if he can call in favors from other committee members. A little FYI Here is the Midwest Playoff Selection Committee Bob Boerigter, Northwest Missouri State University, chair Kevin Buisman, Minnesota State University Mankato Dave Herbster, Concordia University, St. Paul Mike Lockrem, Northern Sun Intercollegiate Conference Gene Taylor, North Dakota State University Jerry Wollmering, Truman State University Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiouxMeNow Posted November 17, 2003 Share Posted November 17, 2003 I also think that the national politics are against us getting in the playoffs if Winona looses. I am sure that the national selection committee is unhappy with NDSU leaving and would prefer we go away quietly. I'm sure the National Committee is tossing and turning at night thinking about what DII will do WITHOUT the Bison. I thought you guys had made THE MOVE and DII wasn't worth a crap! (EXCEPT for all the DII championships you won - which SOMEHOW are TOTAL GOLD!!!) You are going away...by your own choice...don't bitch because your former division isn't kow-towing to YOUR supposed status. You had a great run in the '80's but haven't done SQUAT since!! Let's see...the AL is 3 years old and will be hosting it's 4th Playoff game...The DOME is 11 years old and you haven't seen ONE postseason game and you won't until at least the BARNS 15th Anniversary!! good luck!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted November 17, 2003 Author Share Posted November 17, 2003 The final poll: Midwest 1. North Dakota (9-1) 2. Winona State (10-1) 3. Emporia State (9-2) 4. Pittsburg State (9-2) 5. North Dakota State (8-3) 6. Central Missouri State (9-2) 7. Nebraska-Omaha (8-3) 8. Missouri Western State (8-3) 9. Northwest Missouri State (8-3) 10. Minnesota Duluth (8-3) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D2Football Posted November 25, 2003 Share Posted November 25, 2003 I definitely agree WYOBISONMAN. I've emailed them before and they never write back. RinkRat, You have never emailed me once. If you have any questions please send me an email. It's my last name @d2football.com. I won't actually type it in because there are programs that pick your email up off the web and send you spam. Brandon Misener Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hansel Posted November 25, 2003 Share Posted November 25, 2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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