Wilson vs. Bowenkamp

[CoteauRinkRat]

Wilson made plays in the second half ot the game vs. St. Cloud St., something Bowenkamp has failed to do all year long.

Does Wilson get the nod next week?

Does Bowenkamp get the start with Wilson ready to come in at any time?

[UND92,96]

IMO, starting Wilson next week is the obvious decision. Bowenkamp doesn't seem to make very good decisions, and he does not have much of any ability to elude the pass rush or scramble for yards. Wilson is not exactly a sprinter, but he did show relatively quick feet yesterday, and was able to elude the rush several times and at least get back to the line of scrimmage. Plus, he just seems more fiery and possibly more of a leader than is Bowenkamp.

[TheSiouxFan]

I agree, to me there is no doubt who should start. If you look at the thread against Augustana, we won the game, but I and others were not to impressed with Bowenkamp. People also complained about the stale playcalling. Now, look what happens, second half, new QB, and an trickery play ends in a TD. Gotta play him until he stinks it up.

[OETKB]

Watched the whole game on webcast. It looks to me like Bowenkamp has a good arm, but the ball was sailing high on him much of the time. Also, he just doesn't have the mobility it takes to avoid sacks.

Wilson played out of his mind! He was the difference in the second half. He scrambled out of the pocket when necessary, and located receivers downfield while doing so. Just an incredible performance.

I think you gotta play Wilson until he shows he is NOT ready to be the starter.

[bisonguy]

I'm going to try to sneak a little QB question in this thread. WTH does Bowenkamp hold for field goals and extra points? Did Klosterman hold when he was playing? It just seems like that's putting the starting QB in harm's way when you don't need to. Why not have the #2 QB or punter hold?

[redwing77]

I've watched some football games last year and this year and I have something to consider: It may not be either QB. Joe made plays at the Alerus on Saturday, no doubt about it. However, I want to question who calls the plays to begin with. Is it Lennon? Is it the O Coordinator? I think THAT is the guy we should be talking about here. Last season was horrible, yes, but I also noticed that the plays were very similar.

WAY too much screen passes and running at the inopportune times. It doesn't seem to me like this is a QB issue. It seems like we have an Offensive Coordinator who is training our QBs not to look more than 5-10 yeards down field. I'll tell you, 3 yard screen passes won't get you to the end zone. Eventually, the D will pick up your game plan a la the INT yesterday for a TD. Bowenkamp looked downfield twice: the first time for a sack and the second time we got big yards. We're batting 500, no? Why not go for that?

In my football watching experience (which means that those of you who played probably know better than I), my impression is that you come out playing hard, aggressive football and try to gain the lead. Then you try to keep or add to the lead for the rest of the game. Obviously, SCSU has that mentality because that is exactly what they did. We did not. Not until the cccoaching staff decided to experiment it seems and "let the dogs run loose."

So my opinion is: It matters little who actually starts. If I were Roger Thomas, or whoever makes the decisions on coaching staff, I'd be watching my O coordinator's play calling. If he keeps running endless screens and hb dives or whatever, can him and search for a more aggressive O coordinator. I believe we have the talent but a coaching staff who won't let em fly.

[RD17]

I'm going to try to sneak a little QB question in this thread. WTH does Bowenkamp hold for field goals and extra points? Did Klosterman hold when he was playing? It just seems like that's putting the starting QB in harm's way when you don't need to. Why not have the #2 QB or punter hold?

Klosterman was also the holder when he was QB. I think the coaches pick whoever they think is best for the job. I don't think I've ever seen a holder get hurt during a FG attempt, but strange things can happen on the field I guess (UND had both punters hurt at one time last year).

There are two very good reasons I can see for having your starting QB be the holder. First of all, they're warmed up and into the game and they're used to handling the ball alot. You don't need to worry about sending a backup out there that is cold and might mishandle the snap. Secondly, the defense has to respect the fake when the starting QB is in there. That alone can cut down on teams sending guys flying over the top like you see so much now in the college game.

[RD17]

I've watched some football games last year and this year and I have something to consider: It may not be either QB. Joe made plays at the Alerus on Saturday, no doubt about it. However, I want to question who calls the plays to begin with. Is it Lennon? Is it the O Coordinator? I think THAT is the guy we should be talking about here. Last season was horrible, yes, but I also noticed that the plays were very similar.

WAY too much screen passes and running at the inopportune times. It doesn't seem to me like this is a QB issue. It seems like we have an Offensive Coordinator who is training our QBs not to look more than 5-10 yeards down field. I'll tell you, 3 yard screen passes won't get you to the end zone. Eventually, the D will pick up your game plan a la the INT yesterday for a TD. Bowenkamp looked downfield twice: the first time for a sack and the second time we got big yards. We're batting 500, no? Why not go for that?

In my football watching experience (which means that those of you who played probably know better than I), my impression is that you come out playing hard, aggressive football and try to gain the lead. Then you try to keep or add to the lead for the rest of the game. Obviously, SCSU has that mentality because that is exactly what they did. We did not. Not until the cccoaching staff decided to experiment it seems and "let the dogs run loose."

So my opinion is: It matters little who actually starts. If I were Roger Thomas, or whoever makes the decisions on coaching staff, I'd be watching my O coordinator's play calling. If he keeps running endless screens and hb dives or whatever, can him and search for a more aggressive O coordinator. I believe we have the talent but a coaching staff who won't let em fly.

I agree that the playcalling needs to improve, but I disagree about the QB situation. I do not think Bowenkamp is playing very well right now. He's indecisive in the pocket, not real accurate, and he's just not seeing open receivers when they are there. I know he has the ability to play much better- he has been terrific at times in the past. It might really help him to be on the sidelines watching things develop during the game without having the pressure of having to deliver the ball.

[The Sicatoka]

Wilson actually threw

- to open receivers down the middle, and

- to a tight end.

I know, I know, it's crazy-talk.

When Klosterman held it gave a three-dimensional threat: kick, pass, or maybe he'd just take off around the corner.

[UNDvince97-01]

I was at the game this weekend, and it was a great comeback led by Joe Wilson. He has been there for 6 years, and it has finally paid off. He deserves all the credit in the world, and I couldn't be more proud of him. It looked as though he had been a 3 year starter leading his team down the field. All that being said, I wouldn't be so fast in naming him the starter next week. You have to realize that the situation he came into last week, was a "no lose" situation. If he led them back, he was going to look like the savior, and if he didnt, then he wasn't supposed to. Also realize that this was a home game, that helps ease the nerves alot more too. This week they are travelling to Brookings to play in one of the most intimidating venues in the NCC. SDSU also has a very good football team. This situation reminds me alot of the 1999 team that went in to SDSU at 7-0 and a #4 ranking in Coach Lennon's first season. They had just come off beating UNC at home and feeling very good about themselves, but then they went to SDSU and got beat by an obviously inferior team and Josh Ranek on Hobo Days. This will be a hostile environment to have a QB start his first game. John Bowenkamp has been struggling, but he has experience on the road in the NCC games. It is a whole different ballgame on the road in the NCC. It would be a shame to ruin Wilson's confidence by starting him in that kind of situation. You could argue that both QB's should start, I think. I just don't see it as being a no-brainer. Let's just hope that whoever starts does a good job leading thier team in a very tough NCC road game.

[airmail]

On the coaches show last Wednesday, Coach Lennon didn't mince words about taking Bowencamp out if he didn't produce. I guess we saw that result in the game on Saturday. Anyway, my point is that Wilson obviously knows the system and has looked decent in practice for DL to say something openly on radio before an important conference game. Bowencamp undoubtedly saw the writing on the wall, right?

I might be reaching here, but sometimes a team will rally around one individual vs. another. Much like coaching, sometimes a team will "play" for one coach but not another. Could this be the case with Wilson/ Bowencamp? Of course, its easy for me to say these things given the current win and situation as a whole. Just throwing it out there...

[UNDvince97-01]

Bisonguy,

yes Klosterman was the holder when he played, as was Tony Stein before him. I think it's a good thing just in case something happens on the snap or hold. If something does happen, then you have your QB able to make the throw on a botched attempt. Who does NDSU have as their holder?

[PCM]

On Dale Lennon's show on WDAZ Sunday night, Pat Sweeny asked the coach which QB would be starting against SDSU. Lennon said he didn't know yet, but that he would make the decision early in the week. Maybe he had to say that to be diplomatic, but it certainly wasn't the answer I expected.

[UND92,96]

I was at the game this weekend, and it was a great comeback led by Joe Wilson.  He has been there for 6 years, and it has finally paid off.  He deserves all the credit in the world, and I couldn't be more proud of him.  It looked as though he had been a 3 year starter leading his team down the field.  All that being said, I wouldn't be so fast in naming him the starter next week.  You have to realize that the situation he came into last week, was a "no lose" situation.  If he led them back, he was going to look like the savior, and if he didnt, then he wasn't supposed to.  Also realize that this was a home game, that helps ease the nerves alot more too.  This week they are travelling to Brookings to play in one of the most intimidating venues in the NCC.  SDSU also has a very good football team.  This situation reminds me alot of the 1999 team that went in to SDSU at 7-0 and a #4 ranking in Coach Lennon's first season.  They had just come off beating UNC at home and feeling very good about themselves, but then they went to SDSU and got beat by an obviously inferior team and Josh Ranek on Hobo Days.  This will be a hostile environment to have a QB start his first game.  John Bowenkamp has been struggling, but he has experience on the road in the NCC games.  It is a whole different ballgame on the road in the NCC.  It would be a shame to ruin Wilson's confidence by starting him in that kind of situation.  You could argue that both QB's should start, I think.  I just don't see it as being a no-brainer.  Let's just hope that whoever starts does a good job leading thier team in a very tough NCC road game.

Your points are all well-taken, but what sticks out to me is that in the first 6 quarters of the NCC season, all at home, Bowenkamp has directed the offense to exactly zero touchdowns. While I wouldn't put all the blame on the quarterback, certainly he must bear a good deal of the responsibility. Whether Wilson will be consistent or not is a complete unknown, but it certainly appears that he has earned the right to show what he can do as a starter on a trial basis. I look at this situation far differently than if we had a proven starter, i.e. Kelby Klosterman. I wouldn't be anywhere near as quick to bench him. But Bowenkamp has been very inconsistent during his career as a starter, and I would have to think that his confidence must be shaken at this point. If he can't produce at home, particularly against a relatively mediocre defense like Augie's, I wouldn't expect much more from him on the road against a better SDSU team. Let's see if Wilson's hot-hand can continue.

[UNDvince97-01]

UND 92,96

you have made very good points also, and i can't really argue with them. realize that i am a big joe wilson supporter, and i hope the best for him. he deserves his shot. also realize that bowenkamp had some success last year on the road in the NCC. a good example would be when he threw for 515 against augie last year at howard wood field. i am just saying that i dont think it's a no-brainer to start wilson. if they did start him, i would definitely think it was warranted. i think it's a tough call for the coaching staff.

[The Sicatoka]

1 Attempt

1 Completion

61 Yards

1 Touchdown

0 Interceptions

Start Strouth!

[UNDvince97-01]

LOL, funny stuff sicatoka

[bisonguy]

UNDVince97-01,

NDSU started this year with the punter holding. The new coaching staff carried this over from Nebraska. The reasoning is that the punter, kicker and long snapper are off on their own during practice, so they can spend all their time practicing as a unit. I understand that it does add an extra threat with the QB holding, but it can be done without a QB holding (i.e. NDSU vs. Montana). I just think that on a special teams play with the defense going all out for the ball and the QB in a vulnerable position (kneeling down) that there is a extra potential for injury that could be avoided.

Sorry for getting semi off topic.

Start Wilson!!

[UND Fan]

This is a very interesting decision that the coaching staff has to make. While I also feel that Wilson deserves the opportunity to prove that Saturday was not a fluke, he is a senior that that really complicates things. It is likely that, if they go with Wilson, Bowenkamp may continue to be No. 2 on the depth chart but I am sure that the coaching staff would not be looking for him to be the starter next year. If he has not shown the leadership abilities this far, they wouldn't assume that he would magically become a leader next year.

I realize that we have had some very successful senior first-time starters over the last 15 years but none of them had failed when given the opportunity earlier in their careers.

So as I see it, if Wilson gets the nod and does a good job, the staff will look at one of the other talented young QBs to take over next year. That QB just might be Groeschl, even if he isn't playing the position this year. It would be somewhat sad to see BowenKamp not with the team next year after he has been a part of the program for four years. I would guess that they would be honest with him and tell him that they were looking at a young QB for the future.

[UND92,96]

This is a very interesting decision that the coaching staff has to make.  While I also feel that Wilson deserves the opportunity to prove that Saturday was not a fluke, he is a senior that that really complicates things.  It is likely that, if they go with Wilson, Bowenkamp may continue to be No. 2 on the depth chart but I am sure that the coaching staff would not be looking for him to be the starter next year.  If he has not shown the leadership abilities this far, they wouldn't assume that he would magically become a leader next year.

I realize that we have had some very successful senior first-time starters over the last 15 years but none of them had failed when given the opportunity earlier in their careers. 

So as I see it, if Wilson gets the nod and does a good job, the staff will look at one of the other talented young QBs to take over next year.  That QB just might be Groeschl, even if he isn't playing the position this year.  It would be somewhat sad to see BowenKamp not with the team next year after he has been a part of the program for four years.  I would guess that they would be honest with him and tell him that they were looking at a young QB for the future.

I agree with basically everything you said, but I do believe that Bowenkamp is currently a 5th year junior, so after this year he will have already had essentially a full career in the program. True, he will have the opportunity to come back for a 6th year if he so chooses, but I imagine that may depend in large part on whether he is on schedule to graduate this spring or not. Unless he again earns the starting job this season and does well, I agree that most likely the staff will be looking to whomever emerges among Groeschl, Manke and Bellmore as the starter next season.

I am a firm believer that in this day and age, a quarterback needs to be mobile, and unfortunately Bowenkamp does not fit into that mold although he does supposedly have good straight-ahead speed. I'm not sure on Bellmore as I haven't seen him play except for briefly in the spring game, but both Groeschl and Manke run very well.

[siouxyah_0]

UNDvince97-01 you are right that he Bowenkamp through for 515 but you forgot to metion the 4 ints he threw. the fourth coming on what would have been the game tying drive...Bowenkamp seems to lack the toughness to play...I haven't seen a UND quarterback slide in many years...mobilityis another concern...Wilson seemed to feel the pocket much better and escape easier...also when he escapes he seems to get more than 2 yds a scramble...another + for wilson...he let the receivers make athletic plays...we have good athletes in our receiving core...wilson layed it up and let them make the plays..."you can't score unless you take a chance"...play calling doesn't seem to be the problem...many many times we have open people down field, Bowenkamp doesn't get them the ball though...all in all we need a quarterback that will lay it on the line and win games...wilson gets my vote.

[UND92,96]

The decision has been made: Wilson is starting against SDSU.

[PCM]

The decision has been made: Wilson is starting against SDSU.

Hold on. I just fell of my chair and I can't get up.

[Diggler]

Hold on. I just fell of my chair and I can't get up. 

So have you learned your lesson? You are at that age where you have to keep your walker by your side at all times.

[PCM]

So have you learned your lesson?  You are at that age where you have to keep your walker by your side at all times. 

Hey, you try typing from the floor and see how easy it is.