The Current Situation

[Cratter]

Big Sky meets in October. They recently said they were going to consider expansion of 1-3 teams.

UND has just completed their evaluation for Divisions. They have until July 1.

What perfect timing Kupchella!!

Do not miss the boat. Could this be one of the most critical aspects for UND in some time.

[Cratter]

Fullerton said the schools the conference is looking at are SDSU, NDSU, the University of North Dakota, Southern Utah, Denver and Utah Valley State.

from the Argus Leader:

Big Sky looking at adding 10th member

All of those are Division I, except for one.

[aff]

You are actually serious aren't you? I mean, none of this is a joke. You actually believe there is a chance of UND being in the big sky next october don't you? It's not happening anytime soon... period. Chances are pretty good that NDSU and SDSU are going to be accepted to the mid con in the very near future, and your still talking about the big sky 3 team scenario.

BTW, great job with the selective use of quotes from the argus leader and other sources. You did manage to leave out this little tidbit though:

On their last day of meetings Tuesday in Missoula, Mont., officials told Commissioner Doug Fullerton to put together a report on what a 10-team conference would look like.

The league is not looking at plans to increase its membership to 12.

I suppose now the story is that UND only is going to big sky, once they declare division I. Its pretty interesting to see how far you guys will take this fantasy. I would have thought most people would have given up on this by now, but some of you absolutely refuse to give in. I'm sure you'll be talking about this for the next 20 years too. When NDSU and SDSU are going to switch out of the mid con, there will be people in grand forks talking about how UND is going to come along for the ride.

http://www.argusleader.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a...ORTS0202/605240 309/1002/SPORTS

[Shawn-O]

Here's another reason the timing is right (someone on this board brought this up briefly and I thought it was a great point). By declaring now, you'd really take a lot of the teeth out of the NCAA ruling in regard to hosting playoff games. As a new DI school, you're out of the loop for the playoffs anyway, so the only sport that is affected is hockey. Whip up an alternate jersey for post-season play in hockey, and people will flock to buy that, amounting to a few more bucks in the coffers.

The bigger issue: It's in the best interest of the University to make this move. Athletics is the collegiate equivalent to marketing spend in the corporate world. Inaction will result in falling behind the likes of the 'DSU's for prospective students and research investments. With the marketing analogy, it's basketball that is the real upside. From a standpoint of national visibility, the cost-benefit of DI-AA football versus DII football is minimal, at best. I hope you realize what is at stake, Mr. Kupchella.*

*Yes I've contacted his office via e-mail...I'm not just talking to myself on a discussion forum. Incidently, that was almost two weeks ago and I haven't received so much as a standard e-mail reply from his office in acknowledgement.

[Cratter]

You are actually serious aren't you? I mean, none of this is a joke. You actually believe there is a chance of UND being in the big sky next october don't you?

I am not the one who said UND is in consideration for the Big Sky. The commissioner of the conference did, so yes I believe he is serious. Those are facts my friend. You can not deny those. Why do you get so upset?

Odds might be slim, but he said they were interested in UND, a Division II school. Wonder why?

[Shawn-O]

IMO, no conference invite is coming until intentions are declared. Even at that, I believe the D-I path for UND will look very similar to the 'DSU's.

[Cratter]

BTW, great job with the selective use of quotes from the argus leader and other sources. You did manage to leave out this little tidbit though:

Apparently your selective because the title of the article as I stated was "Big Sky looking at adding 10th member."

[aff]

Apparently your selective because the title of the article as I stated was "Big Sky looking at adding 10th member."

Seriously Cratter, whats the very first thing you said. I'm not even going to waste my time on comment that stupid. Here's a quote if you need it:

Big Sky meets in October. They recently said they were going to consider expansion of 1-3 teams.

UND has just completed their evaluation for Divisions. They have until July 1.

What perfect timing Kupchella!!

Do not miss the boat. Could this be one of the most critical aspects for UND in some time.

Guess you shouldn't have said that if your going by the argus leader then, huh? I guess if you think UND is going to be considered as a stand alone member anytime soon, I see your point, but otherwise I don't. UND has virtually no chance of being in the big sky for the next 5-10 years.

[bincitysioux]

I am not the one who said UND is in consideration for the Big Sky. The commissioner of the conference did, so yes I believe he is serious. Those are facts my friend. You can not deny those. Why do you get so upset?

Odds might be slim, but he said they were interested in UND, a Division II school. Wonder why?

I agree, I think they are very slim at this point, but............

IMO, no conference invite is coming until intentions are declared.

.......The Mid-Con could very well add one or both NDSU and/or SDSU in June. UND has until July 1st to declare their intentions. If UND, coincidently with and extra $9 Million in the bank account, declares it's intentions to move to DI by July 1st, then in October the Big Sky (which is apparently more interested in adding one school rather than three at this point) is basically going to be deciding between Southern Utah and UND. Personally, I think DI is pretty much a dead duck at UND right now, but the DSU's desperation for conference affilitation could, in theory, land UND in the conference that they've both been seeking all along.

[Shawn-O]

Portland St. and Sac. St. are two wrenches in the works that can't be overcome in the near term for a Sky invite, IMO.

[Cratter]

Come October with a DI UND, both NDSU and SDSU could be in the MidCon therefore you essentially only have UND and three other school considered for expansion in the Big Sky.

AFF, The last Big Sky meeting this May, Fullerton was interested in moving the conference to 12 teams. That is a fact try not to argue with it (I know it will be hard for you). Just because some members want to see what a report with ten members looks like doesn't mean they are definately NOT going to add 12 members. Its not like the Argus Leader has any inside info the rest of us don't.

[bincitysioux]

Portland St. and Sac. St. are two wrenches in the works that can't be overcome in the near term for a Sky invite, IMO.

Don't forget about Kupchella. Unfortunately, I think he is a major obstacle regarding DI.

[star2city]

Portland St. and Sac. St. are two wrenches in the works that can't be overcome in the near term for a Sky invite, IMO.

IMO, Sac State's days in the Big Sky are numbered, as Sac is the most logical candidate to replace Louisiana Tech when they move out of the WAC. Louisiana Tech can only afford to stay in the WAC now because the basketball credits (and NCAA payout) left behind by Tulsa when it moved to CUSA. When those payments expire in two years, La Tech will move on. And that force the WAC to take in another team: Sac St. The Honolulu Advertiser would seem to agree.

If the Big Sky Conference is the WAC on-deck circle, then look at who's likely warming up there now.

Officially, both Sac State and the WAC say there have been no talks, handshakes or promises. But they hardly need to when you look at the big picture. The WAC is at an awkward number (9) for scheduling. Louisiana Tech is a geographic anomaly as the conference's most far-flung continental member and will someday flee.

So, when Sac St is gone and with Northern Colorado is in July 1st, the votes can be there for expansion east. The time is right to prepare for this change by UND. There are no other options in DI (the MidCon will not remain viable much longer).

[DI IN FARGO]

You know I've read some pretty funny stuff on this board but this theory has got to be about the most ridiculous that I have seen. If you guys think UND is going to the BSC let me tell you about this ocean front property I have about ten miles south of Fargo you might be interested. I sell it to you at a really good price too. You guys get some cash from a very gracious donor's estate and you've already spent it on your dreams of a BSC invite. That is some good stuff, really it is. Watch out Cratter and the rest for the guys in the white coats, especially if they have a little white jacket for you. Actually you probably should go seek them out and ask for help, if you believe this fairy tale you've concocted then its time to seek professional help. Bincitysioux is usually got a pretty good grip but you've even sucked him into your little fantasy to a point. ShawnO you better help your friends, they need it.

[star2city]

[paraphrasing] The MidCON is an awesome option. [paraphrasing]

The MidCon is not an option. If it loses another school within two years, it will cease to have an autobid for men's basketball. Not a single school in the MidCOn has any level of satisfaction with its circumstances. Any school that the MidCon takes, whether it be IPFW, UTPA, UVSC, NDSU, or SDSU, will only cause futher dissatisfaction because of travel issues. Adding UTPA would torgue all the northern teams; adding IPFW will not exactly excite ORU, Centenary, or SUU. Adding NDSU and/or SDSU will aggravate every school but UMKC. Both SU's could very well get into the MidCOn, but if its lacking a men's autobid, membership would be bitterweet.

The MidCon's options are really bound, because no school from another conference (like UALR) will make a jump unless SUU is gone. But if SUU is gone, the autobid is gone. Catch -22. The schizophrenic geopraphic footprint makes the MidCon just too unattractive for any school that has any other option.

[BisonMav]

Portland St. and Sac. St. are two wrenches in the works that can't be overcome in the near term for a Sky invite, IMO.

Won't Terry Wanless, AD at Sac St help UND get into the Big Sky more than hurt.

[bincitysioux]

.......... Bincitysioux is usually got a pretty good grip but you've even sucked him into your little fantasy to a point.

What can I say? I'm getting desperate.

[aff]

AFF, The last Big Sky meeting this May, Fullerton was interested in moving the conference to 12 teams. That is a fact try not to argue with it (I know it will be hard for you). Just because some members want to see what a report with ten members looks like doesn't mean they are definately NOT going to add 12 members. Its not like the Argus Leader has any inside info the rest of us don't.

I see, so when the argus has something positive to say about UND (citing them as being considered for affiliation) your all over that to tell everyone its a fact... and when they have something negative to say "its not as if they have any inside information". Thanks for clearing that up.

Either take the article or leave it... don't cut the pieces out you want and discard the rest.

And seriously if another person talks about what fullerton wants, as if they actually know, or that anything out of his mouth is remotely close to a "fact" I'm going to throw up. I don't know what else the guy has to do to lose your trust? Invite you to the conference, and then tell you it was a joke two days later? I mean seriously every possible situation imaginable has come out of that guys mouth, and ITS NEVER RIGHT. Why can't you see that? Are you blind? Its not that hard. Sorry again about arguing with your "facts" of having cited the conference comissioner that has absolutely no say in what happens, about what he was talking about prior to a meeting last month, a meeting where he said that they didn't want to expand to twelve, and that UND isn't going to get any consideration until they are part way through the transistion. Oh wait, those are "facts" that you're choosing to ignore. Sorry, I forgot to not include those.

[aff]

Some words for thought from the man sooooooo interested in UND"

[big Sky Commissioner]Fullerton said he would advise UND to start its own conference with other schools in transition. In the third year of a transition, former North Central Conference members North Dakota State and South Dakota State are independent in several sports.

Some other current NCC schools may also be interested in moving up.

[GeauxSioux]

I have been reading your posts for a couple of weeks now aff and you seem to have a negative bent on everything. All of your posts seem to just bomb on someone elses post. Offer something constructive. Since this is a UND board, tell me where YOU see UND in two years, five years...

[Sioux-cia]

I have been reading your posts for a couple of weeks now aff and you seem to have a negative bent on everything. All of your posts seem to just bomb on someone elses post. Offer something constructive. Since this is a UND board, tell me where YOU see UND in two years, five years...

I think this guy's just been dumped by a UND student/alum. Posting here is a way for him to assuage his angst.

[aff]

I have been reading your posts for a couple of weeks now aff and you seem to have a negative bent on everything. All of your posts seem to just bomb on someone elses post. Offer something constructive. Since this is a UND board, tell me where YOU see UND in two years, five years...

Why because I choose to argue with posts that are incorrect? Sorry I guess. I'm not a UND cheerleader, and I don't claim to be. Out of all of my posts I challenge you to find any that are irrational, or incorrect in the information they provide. If you can't than I don't understand your problem.

In two years UND will be in D-II. In five years, UND will still be in D-II working on their hockey program. The longer UND goes without being a peer of NDSU's the less likely it is they will change. 10 years from now, talk about UND and NDSU playing each other is going to seem like a novelty. Thats my opinion. I'm sure it pisses you off. Thats why I don't go around saying it on the board, and instead just talk about topics that interest me.

[aff]

I think this guy's just been dumped by a UND student/alum. Posting here is a way for him to assuage his angst.

Yeah, my hearts broken. Thats sounds like something someone's mom would say to them. "Don't worry about him, hes just jealous of what a nice boy you are". Give me a break. I can tell that nobody has any actual facts when I have to read stuff like this.

Everybody remember, I'm the reason UND isn't D-I right now, so keep insulting me, and it will just go away!!!

[perry c]

The Mid-Con commissioner said his conference won't be talking to North Dakota as long as the Sioux are in D-II. By saying that, in my opinion, he implied the Mid-Con would be very interested if North Dakota went D-I.

I think NDSU and SDSU will be invited to join next month. I hope you're next.

UMKC Board:

http://umkcroos.proboards78.com/

[MplsBison]

What do you think about IPFW and UTPA's chances?