Media Stories on the Sioux Name

[PCM]

The University Senate is at it again. Alumni from CAS and from the School of Engineering and Mines will be interested to see the way their respective dean's voted.

Just to be clear, the deans you mentioned both voted against the motion to change the name:

Bruce Smith, dean of UND aerospace, and John Watson, dean of engineering and mines, joined the students in opposition.

Also, with a somewhat whiny headline, here is another story from today's paper: "Kupchella has been hosting tribal councils".

The Herald put a large headline at the top of the front page about the University Senate vote. The story about the tribal council members was also on the front page, except it was at the bottom of the page with a smaller headline.

But trust me, folks, the story about the meetings with the tribal leaders is far more important than the story about the University Senate resolution. When you understand what's happening on that front and you understand what's going on with the NCAA, you can see the context for why this resolution was brought up now.

"Tribal leaders have visited UND recently, and we had a great dialogue with them about the university, our American Indian programs and the nickname issue," Harmeson said. "It's fair to say that some of them came away from UND after their first visit very impressed."

[The Sicatoka]

Alumni from CAS and from the School of Engineering and Mines will be interested to see the way their respective dean's voted.

Bruce Smith and John Watson rule! Proud to see those deans voting with the student block!

I'll have to get my checkbook out and sent Dr. Watson a "note" now.

[dagies]

Bruce Smith and John Watson rule! Proud to see those deans voting with the student block!

I'll have to get my checkbook out and sent Dr. Watson a "note" now.

As a graduate of SEM, I sent him an email, thanking him for his vote. The rest will come later.

[Teeder11]

PCM:

What do you mean by whiney headline? Are you reading something into it. Just curious. And are you suggesting that the guys at the Herald who work the night shift and who lay out the stories on front page placed the stories above the fold and below the fold due to some kind of agenda?

Again just curious.

[Air Force One]

PCM:

What do you mean by whiney headline? Are you reading something into it. Just curious. And are you suggesting that the guys at the Herald who work the night shift and who lay out the stories on front page placed the stories above the fold and below the fold due to some kind of agenda?

Again just curious.

The Heraldo had an agenda! Say it ain't so!

[dagies]

PCM:

What do you mean by whiney headline? Are you reading something into it. Just curious. And are you suggesting that the guys at the Herald who work the night shift and who lay out the stories on front page placed the stories above the fold and below the fold due to some kind of agenda?

Again just curious.

Ah, Clayton actually made the "whiney" comment.

PCM, good story.

[Teeder11]

My bad.... sorry PCM.

I just know a lot of the newsroom guys (reporters, photogs, copy editors) at the Herald. They come over for a drink after their shifts and we chat.

Yes, I would say that the top managers of the Heraldo have an agenda, but I wouldn't paint with a broad brush.

The reporters that I visit with me are all fervent Fighting Sioux fans, including the guy that wrote both stories for today's paper. I'm told that the editors don't pressure reporters to write a certain way, and if they did, the reporters would quit. I guess they're unionized.

And many of the anti-Sioux crowd as far as reporters have moved on.

So yes, the editorials may be slanted, but that's what they're supposed to be. But I wouldn't say the news pages are.

[PCM]

And are you suggesting that the guys at the Herald who work the night shift and who lay out the stories on front page placed the stories above the fold and below the fold due to some kind of agenda?

Story placement decisions are made by editors, not the guys who lay out the paper. They do what the editors tell them to do. The size difference in headlines and placement of the stories is intened to convey the relative importance of the stories -- in the opinion of the editors.

[Sioux-cia]

My bad.... sorry PCM.

I just know a lot of the newsroom guys (reporters, photogs, copy editors) at the Herald. They come over for a drink after their shifts and we chat.

Yes, I would say that the top managers of the Heraldo have an agenda, but I wouldn't paint with a broad brush.

The reporters that I visit with me are all fervent Fighting Sioux fans, including the guy that wrote both stories for today's paper. I'm told that the editors don't pressure reporters to write a certain way, and if they did, the reporters would quit. I guess they're unionized.

And many of the anti-Sioux crowd as far as reporters have moved on.

So yes, the editorials may be slanted, but that's what they're supposed to be. But I wouldn't say the news pages are.

In my limited experience with newspaper 'policy', it's my understanding that the layout of the paper is the editor's respponsibility, i.e. whose pieces go on the front page, where they go on the front page, how many words, headlines, etc.

But that may not be the case at the Herald?

[PCM]

In my limited experience with newspaper 'policy', it's my understanding that the layout of the paper is the editor's respponsibility, i.e. whose pieces go on the front page, where they go on the front page, how many words, headlines, ets.

You are correct.

[Teeder11]

From what I am told, It's a bit looser at the Herald than many might think.

The Herald top editors are pretty handsoff as far the newspages, and that's where the bias is (the top editors that is).

I'm told that the copy editors have a lot of freedom as far as how they lay out their own pages at the Herald. And all the copy editors I know at the Herald, and that's five or six, are all Sioux fans. The sports section also are Sioux fans, except for Kevin Fee, who is much more neutral.

The newroom is led by the managing editor, Kevin Grinde, in the Herald's case, and I can tell you for certain that he is not anti-nickname at all. He's a graduate of Bemidji State and cheers hard for the Beavers and the Fighting Sioux.

Mike Jacobs, as editor and publisher, has his hands on all divsions of the paper, and tends to spend more time worrrying about the bottomline and the money making ends of the paper -- advertising and circulation.

[PCM]

From what I am told, It's a bit looser at the Herald than many might think.

I've never worked at the Herald, so I can't say exactly how they operate. However, I do have a journalism degree and I have worked at other daily newspapers. I've been an editor and I've been involved in determining layout and story placement.

It's standard newspaper practice to hold a meeting of editors to decide which stories will be published, where they'll be placed and how much play they'll be given in relation to other stories. Those are always editorial decisions, as they should be.

There are always disagreements among editors, among reporters and among readers about which stories deserve more attention than others. The editors do their best to make the right decsion, but that doesn't mean that we must all agree with their decisions.

[BleedGrn]

I smell a conspiracy here somewhere. Right along with society's conspiracy to keep people down by using names and depictions to quell any efforts of bettering themselves.

[Teeder11]

I think you are right, PCM. Good post.

Take care.

[choyt3]

PCM:

What do you mean by whiney headline? Are you reading something into it. Just curious.

I definitely read the whiney tone into the headline and the story itself and don't think I'm alone in doing so. Then, it was quite early when I read it the first time.

[Teeder11]

Clayton:

You might be right. Different people can read it different ways. I thought it was just straight forward with no frills. Just the facts, man.

Oh well, to each their own.

[Goon]

PCM:

What do you mean by whiney headline? Are you reading something into it. Just curious. And are you suggesting that the guys at the Herald who work the night shift and who lay out the stories on front page placed the stories above the fold and below the fold due to some kind of agenda?

Again just curious.

Here is what I read into, some of the facualty have tried to ram this down the throat of the students and basically its not going to fly and basically it was a waste of time and energy. This will not stand and the majority of the students like the name and the alumni like the name and if these facualty members don't like the name move on and get a job at another campus.

[ScottM]

Birgit Hans, chairperson of UND's Indian Studies Department, said the school's special invitation to the tribes is "something that should have happened decades ago."

Heh. "White chicks".

I find it amusing/interesting that so many of the faculty in the Indian Studies department are really Eurotrash.

[Sioux-cia]

Heh. "White chicks".

I find it amusing/interesting that so many of the faculty in the Indian Studies department are really Eurotrash.

I noticed that too. GK and KTF keep bringing up the fact that a non-Indian (isn't he from Sweden or some such place) is teaching the Lakota language. In addition to applying for the position and knowing the subject, there are certain academic accomplishments and degrees required to teach at the University level. If indeed there are American Indians who meet the requirements. have applied for appointments and positions in the American Indians Studies Department/programs/services and not been hired, why are the American Indian activists not all over this?

And while I'm on the subject, another issue that the NameChangers keep bringing up is that the American Indian programs and federal monies are here because of the action of American Indians. If UND is such a hostile and abusive environment to American Indians, why don't those responsible for the federal money,etc. that is funding the American Indian programs take their programs elsewhere. I think it's because of the support that the UND and Grand Forks community provides to those programs but what do I know, I'm not American Indian.

Judy DeMers, leading radical leftist, oh, and associate dean at the medical school stated that an American Indian student turned down an INVITATION to study medicine at UND because of the name and logo. Don't American Indians have to apply for a position in the med school? As pointed out in another thread, if you go on line and Google UND, the home page states "HOME OF THE FIGHTING SIOUX". If the student didn't look up UND before applying or didn't know UND's name or logo before appllying, IMHO, he/she isn't smart enough to be in med school.

[Goon]

Judy DeMers, leading radical leftist, oh, and associate dean at the medical school stated that an American Indian student turned down an INVITATION to study medicine at UND because of the name and logo. Don't American Indians have to apply for a position in the med school? As pointed out in another thread, if you go on line and Google UND, the home page states "HOME OF THE FIGHTING SIOUX". If the student didn't look up UND before applying or didn't know UND's name or logo before appllying, IMHO, he/she isn't smart enough to be in med school.

Oh yeah and in case anyone forgot this Judy Demers is the same woman that has a law suit against her from some half wit named Vivian Nelson that she pushed out of school. In case you forgot the story it is at

http://www.UND-fraud.com/UNDSM/index.html again the name change crowd has a bunch of credibility.

Of course the people that own that site are also against the name change. Fringe groups.

So how is it, at a Great Indian Studies school like UND (which I think it is) have a white woman from Sweden or wherever teaching Lakota language to Native American kids? It doesn

[Teeder11]

Goon:

I was at the meeting (one of the students in the crowd, but not a member of the senate), and DeMers did say that the student was "invited to attend" the medical school. Whether that was on a scholarship of some kind or some other means, she did not say at the meeting--but the stupid people at the Herald got it right.

Just FYI. Have a great day!

[Goon]

Goon:

I was at the meeting (one of the students in the crowd, but not a member of the senate), and DeMers did say that the student was "invited to attend" the medical school. Whether that was on a scholarship of some kind or some other means, she did not say at the meeting--but the stupid people at the Herald got it right.

Just FYI. Have a great day!

Wow, I guess college has changed since I was there. Hey thanks for clearing that up for us. Its nice to know that we have people there to police the Herald.

[Sioux-cia]

Goon:

I was at the meeting (one of the students in the crowd, but not a member of the senate), and DeMers did say that the student was "invited to attend" the medical school. Whether that was on a scholarship of some kind or some other means, she did not say at the meeting--but the stupid people at the Herald got it right.

Just FYI. Have a great day!

Teeder11, since you were at the meeting, do you know what DeMers position is on the name and logo? I 'assumed' she is against the name and logo but I may be wrong. The Herald only gave that one statement of hers. Was she asked or did she volunteer? How many American Indian students were in attendance? Did they speak? Thanks

[Teeder11]

No, I think you guys do a pretty good job of that on your own.

Keep up the good work.

[Teeder11]

Per Sioux-cia's questions:

DeMers voted for the resolution to get rid of the nickname and logo.

She offered her anecdote about the American Indian student not coming to UND all on her own.

The usual anti-name and logo suspects were there sitting in the peanut gallery: Liegh Jeanotte, Lucy Ganje, Jim Grijalva, Doug McDonald, Donna Brown etc.

There were other American Indians there, not many though, and I don't know what their affiliation to UND was.

Other than Doug McDonald, who may be at least part Indian, no American Indians spoke on the issue, for or against.

There was at least one minority student who spoke up in opposition to the resolution. He was not American Indian, though.

I can't remember if I got all your questions, or not, but I hope this helps.

IF you want to know anything else just ask, and I'll see if I can recall.