NCC expansion

[ESPNInsider]

I would think there are still plenty of opponents for the NCC schools to play before they schedule three conference games. Look at teams like ndsu and sdsu who need to fill out their schedules and wouldn't mind playing an NCC school. Also, the NCC, being a better conference, it seems the NSIC schools would continue playing them for non-connie games and drop lower teams, as to continue playing tough competition IMO.

[UND92,96]

RD17 or star2city (or anybody who has any "inside info")-

Which school or schools are the most likely next additions to the NCC? I think we've all touched on the schools that are potential candidates, and a lot of people have opinions as to who they'd like to see join, but I'm interested in who you think are realistic candidates? I don't really think any more NSIC schools will leave soon because they don't have to the money to fund football scholarships at a higher level and they're content where they're at for other sports. The u.p. Michigan schools are apparently not looking to leave. That pretty much leaves Kearney, who has repeatedly denied interest in the NCC (probably for the same reasons as the NSIC schools), and perhaps the Washington schools, MSU-Billings (except for football), some current NAIA school(s), or perhaps we just wait for SDSU to bounce back after a few more years of not being able to find a conference.

[RD17]

In order for the NCC to have any stability, the key school to keep

[RD17]

RD17 or star2city (or anybody who has any "inside info")-

Which school or schools are the most likely next additions to the NCC? I think we've all touched on the schools that are potential candidates, and a lot of people have opinions as to who they'd like to see join, but I'm interested in who you think are realistic candidates? I don't really think any more NSIC schools will leave soon because they don't have to the money to fund football scholarships at a higher level and they're content where they're at for other sports. The u.p. Michigan schools are apparently not looking to leave. That pretty much leaves Kearney, who has repeatedly denied interest in the NCC (probably for the same reasons as the NSIC schools), and perhaps the Washington schools, MSU-Billings (except for football), some current NAIA school(s), or perhaps we just wait for SDSU to bounce back after a few more years of not being able to find a conference.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's a good question. I guess if I had to handicap it as far as who I think is most likely at this point, I would go something like this:

Kearney: I just think it makes sense from a competitive and geographic standpoint for UNK to eventually be part of the NCC. I know they are concerned about having the money to fund enough scholarships but the new football facilities should help. It really is too bad that the NCC didn't have the foresight to boot Morningside in the early 90's when they had that big scandal in their athletic department and add UNK when they wanted in.

Northern State: Believe it or not, NSU led D2 in basketball attendance this year and I have to think the pull of bringing in USD, Augie, SCSU, UND, etc. on a regular basis for basketball would make joining the NCC very attractive. Very similar to UNK though in the sense that scholarship money is lacking and football would basically be sacrificed, at least in the short term.

Michigan Tech: MTU would fit nicely with the NCC because of the existing hockey relationship. Travel would actually be shorter for them in the NCC than GLIAC. I think the one thing really keeping them in the GLIAC though is the connection to the Lower Peninsula.

Winona State: Would have topped my list a month ago before the NSIC decided to invite UIU and Mary. Now that they are in a stable conference situation and essentially a guaranteed spot in the football playoffs each year, I don't think they'll leave.

St. Thomas: Definitely have the cash, it's just a matter of whether they would ever leave D3. This is the school I would most like to see join the NCC.

[knowledge]

Northern State has great NCC potential. Their Men's basketball program has the best coach in the Tri-State area (Dan Monson inclueded). Football would go through the same growing pains as UMD is going through but it wouldn't be long before they were competitive as well.

St. Thomas is in a great spot to be extreamly successful at the DII level. They have the money!! And other than Concordia-St. Paul they are the only option down in the Cities. Football would take time to improve, but basketball is a program that would have a short transition stage. Also both St. Thomas' track teams could probably win the NCC with the absence of NDSU and SDSU.

[bincitysioux]

I say,

#1: Winona St.--They are the cream of the crop in the NSIC. They have alot of success in recent years in football. They are relatively close to UND, USD, and Augustana, and could build in-state rivalries with SCSU, and UMD.

#2: Nebraska-Kearney--They have been down in recent years, but again: geography. Close to USD and Augustana. No farther south than UNO. Potential for a helluva instate rivalry with UNO.

[bigmrg74]

Yeah, not that its been mention, it wouldn't be such a great idea for the UP schools to leave the GLIAC and go NCC, even though they would be a lot closer to NCC schools than some of the GLIAC schools. They've got too many alumni that will show up to games they have down here in the LP, and still contribute to their schools. Not showing up on a regular basis in the LP will probably hurt their fundings, especially MTU's, which is now mostly alumni funded I think.

Doesn't Wisconsin have a couple of pretty good D3 teams that would love to go D2 if the Wisconsin legistrator would let them go??

[BisonMav]

Does anyone know the schools that originally voted against Upper Iowa for admission to the NSIC? The "No" votes could be possible members for the NCC.

[RD17]

Wisconsin have a couple of pretty good D3 teams that would love to go D2 if the Wisconsin legistrator would let them go??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Most of those WIAC schools would be great D2 members, but a public school going from zero scholarships to a full scholarship D2 conference would be a huge undertaking. Plus, I'm not sure how it would go over if one or two of the schools was allowed to go D2 and into new conference and the rest had to stay in D3 because the state would have to help subsidize most of the scholarship money, at least to start with.

IMO, it would be far more likely that the whole WIAC would move to D2 at once, if it ever came to that. That way the whole league could be incrementally and evenly be transitioned into scholarship sports.

[RD17]

Does anyone know the schools that originally voted against Upper Iowa for admission to the NSIC?  The "No" votes could be possible members for the NCC.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

From what I was told, Southwest Minnesota, Bemidji, and Northern were the three that voted against Upper Iowa. One of the main reasons those schools voted no was travel, but I believe having an odd number of teams was just as big a factor if not more so.

There was also a lot more behind the scenes politics going on with UIU getting into the conference this time than what there was last fall. I'll put it this way: even if UIU was the only school getting voted on this spring, I still believe it would have gotten in rather easily (maybe a 7-1 vote?) this time.

[BisonMav]

From what I was told, Southwest Minnesota, Bemidji, and Northern were the three that voted against Upper Iowa. One of the main reasons those schools voted no was travel, but I believe having an odd number of teams was just as big a factor if not more so.

There was also a lot more behind the scenes politics going on with UIU getting into the conference this time than what there was last fall. I'll put it this way: even if UIU was the only school getting voted on this spring, I still believe it would have gotten in rather easily (maybe a 7-1 vote?) this time.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good info, Thanks.

Bemidji St is interesting, do they have the funding to compete in the NCC? I don't hear them mentioned often as a candidate. It's a long way to Omaha, but they do have hockey.

[Goon]

[dakotadan]

John Bernstrom was just talking on the 10 o'clock news about Central and Western Washington joining the NCC for football. He said Interim AD Phil Harmeson stated that talks are going on. Apparently a vote could come at the next NCC meeting this spring and they would begin play the fall of 2006.

I am not sure if it is available to be watched online.

[dakotadan]

I believe that we are going to be seeing this happening. I wouldn't be suprised though if there are some conditions tied to the agreement, such as them leaving if all-sports teams are added or possibly even something like a 2 home/1 away for current NCC teams. Just some thoughts though.

[RD17]

Interesting news. I can't say I'm necessarily surprised by this and it does make some sense. Many NCC schools have been and will continue to play these teams anyway out of scheduling necessity, so why not make them part of the league? From the perspective of each of the current NCC schools, one plane trip west for a football game each fall shouldn't be a budget buster.

One thing people may not be aware of is that neither CWU or WWU are anywhere near fully-funded for football. CWU has 15 scholarships and WWU 21 I believe. I think the major difference though is that limited scholarships go much farther in that area of the country (higher population, less recruiting competition, more potential for D1 transfers) than they would around here. I guess my point is that these two schools would be more competitive in the NCC (and they've already proven it) than an NSIC school that offers the same number of scholarships. Maybe as part of this deal the two Washington schools would be still be required to raise their scholarship levels some?

Although this all sounds good, finding an 8th school for all sports still has to be the top priority. A seven team basketball conference obviously doesn't work very well.

[Let'sGoHawks!]

[UND92,96]

There was a Fargo Forum [url="http://www.in-forum.com/articles/index.cfm?id=97890

[star2city]

A Forum article on the issues facing the DAC conference: http://www.in-forum.com/articles/index.cfm...&section=Sports

The NSIC could again turn to the DAC, perhaps Minot State, to fill the void. Hedberg said the university will take a “serious look” at Division II even if the DAC decides to remain in the NAIA.

It is unlikely the DAC would venture into Division III, Mayville State AD Mike Moore said.

Such a move would force the league’s schools to abandon their athletic scholarship programs in favor of need-based aid. The NCAA does not allow athletics scholarships in Division III.

“At this point, I don’t think anyone is interested in Division III,” Moore said. “I haven’t had any other AD say to me that they kind of like Division III. We are looking into it to cover our bases.”

If the DAC goes DII (which IMV is more than 50% chance), the pressure by Sioux fans to move to DI will be huge as being in the same division as Mayville and Valley City will be deemed unacceptable.

By going DII, the DAC would likely have more choices for adding schools: like Crookston, maybe UM-Morris, perhaps Chadron St., and maybe even MSU-Billings, which now has horrible travel. IMO, Minot has to move up to DII if they ever want to play DI hockey (their NAIA affiliation prevents this now).

[bincitysioux]

I'm shocked that Winona only has 9 football schollies. That is a credit to their players and to their coaching staff. It also illustrates the quality of the NSIC. I guess I always just assumed that they were at the max of 24. I would think that they would have no interest in joining the NCC if they can dominate their current conference with only nine scholarships. Does anybody know how many scholarships UMD offered before joining our conference. The future of the NCC looks pretty bleak to me.

[UND92,96]

According to a report on the KVLY sports tonight, Central Washington and Western Washington will be added to the NCC as football-only members, starting play possibly as early as 2006.

[RD17]

A Forum article on the issues facing the DAC conference:  [url="http://www.in-forum.com/articles/index.cfm?id=97892

[RD17]

According to a report on the KVLY sports tonight, Central Washington and Western Washington will be added to the NCC as football-only members, starting play possibly as early as 2006.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This is a good move for NCC, IMO. If I remember correctly, WWU was at 21 scholarships last year and CWU had around 15, but both schools benefit from their isolated location in the sense that they pick up a lot of good players (especially transfers) without needing to offer much scholarship money. I think it will be tough for either school to compete for league titles consistently with the limited funds and all of the travel, but they should be very solid, competitive teams year after year.

The other big advantage I see to this (from UND's perspective) is the potential to start recruiting the Pacific Northwest.

Now all we need is for RT to get Winona to sign on the dotted line and we're all set.

[sioux goo]

i disagree that this is not a good move....temporary solution to a long term problem....what is the gurantee UND pays the two Washington schools to come to UND...15 grand...20 grand....what will it cost UND to fly out to Washington...travel party of 70 people at 500 a ticket....you tell me if it makes more sense to leave them as a come to UND home game for gate or have the chance of going to Washington twice in one year....UND cannot balance the budget now...how will this help the conference....Auggy will really love adding 70 grand to their travel budget for football...not a good move...and oh by the way....not to mention it isnt helping any of the other programs in the NCC!!!!!!

[bincitysioux]

If I remember correctly, WWU was at 21 scholarships last year and CWU had around 15,

So will WWU and CWU have to increase schollies to 30 to meet the NCC minimum, or will they not be held to those standards because they are "affilliate" members?

[UND Fan]

i disagree that this is not a good  move....temporary solution to a long term problem....what is the gurantee UND pays the two Washington schools to come to UND...15 grand...20 grand....what will it cost UND to fly out to Washington...travel party of 70 people at 500 a ticket....you tell me if it makes more sense to leave them as a come to UND home game for gate or have the chance of going to Washington twice in one year....UND cannot balance the budget now...how will this help the conference....Auggy will really love adding 70 grand to their travel budget for football...not a good move...and oh by the way....not to mention it isnt helping any of the other programs in the NCC!!!!!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You make some good points but, in my opinion, they are offset by a few facts:

1) There is no other quick fix for finding others schools to join the NCC. Having only six conference FB games is not a good thing. It doesn't make for a very interesting conference race and finding 4 or 5 nonconference games is often difficlut.

2) I don't know this to be fact but I would guess that UND will not need to pay either of the WA schools any guarantees if they are part of the conference.

3) There is no question that travel out west will be expensive but each current NCC team would only go out there once a year - alternating between the two schools. This will be a major expense for Augie, etc. but from UND's point of view. Hell - we needed to schedule both of them this year just to fill out our schedule so the cost won't be any higher. In fact, it may be lower (disregarding inflation, etc).

4) I hope this isn't a long term fix but it does give more exposure to the NCC and to UND out west. This may, at some point, help in recruiting and the increased exposure out there may help UND a little in getting the attention of the Big Sky.

I fully agree if there were one or three other universities here in the Midwest who were interested in joining the NCC now, this would be a poor move! But there aren't and I don't know if there will be anytime soon!