What are the rules on fan behavior?

[cfm567b27]

I'm alumni and one of those that "donates" money to the University annually. I happen to sit in section 107 row R which is right in front of the suites and next to the Students in Section 108. Again - I have no problem with students standing because the sight lines are bad anyway down in the near corners on the far end - you learn to train your eyes to shift to the jumbotron when the puck moves down in that end anyway. I really don't see what the deal is here. I don't think the people directly behind me in the suits are impeded when I stand. Cripes I don't think it is physically possible to stand the entire game anyway.

[Diggler]

The whole problem from the students point of view is that they have done the things requested of them before and they got absolutely nothing in return. They have effectively been told to sit down and shut up. They ask for some things, but don't recieve them. They have seats that were theirs at the beginning before the arena opened taken away. Put all these things together and students get ticked off, much like people around the students get ticked off when they can't see the game.

For about two years the students respected the wishes of others and did what was asked of them. The only thing they got out of it was that letter for the Minnesota series last year telling them to be good. Never have the students gotten a letter that has said "Hey you're doing a helluva job and we think you are the best students in the country" that did include a but........ Whether it is true or not, students don't feel appreciated. Everyone wasnts to solve the problems that people around the students have, but no one even seems willing to listen to the problems the students have with the situation. When other's complain it's justifiable, but when students complain they are whining and should appreciate what they have.

[The Sicatoka]

The only thing they got out of it was that letter for the Minnesota series last year telling them to be good.

There were 11406 copies of that letter in the arena that night. It wasn't just the students being told "be good" as fans.

What is it that the students think they want? Seriously.

[siouxmenow21]

The whole problem from the students point of view is that they have done the things requested of them before and they got absolutely nothing in return.  They have effectively been told to sit down and shut up.  They ask for some things, but don't recieve them.  They have seats that were theirs at the beginning before the arena opened taken away.  Put all these things together and students get ticked off, much like people around the students get ticked off when they can't see the game. 

For about two years the students respected the wishes of others and did what was asked of them.  The only thing they got out of it was that letter for the Minnesota series last year telling them to be good.  Never have the students gotten a letter that has said "Hey you're doing a helluva job and we think you are the best students in the country" that did include a but........  Whether it is true or not, students don't feel appreciated.  Everyone wasnts to solve the problems that people around the students have, but no one even seems willing to listen to the problems the students have with the situation.  When other's complain it's justifiable, but when students complain they are whining and should appreciate what they have.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i like the way this man thinks.......

[cfm567b27]

There were 11406 copies of that letter in the arena that night. It wasn't just the students being told "be good" as fans.

What is it that the students think they want? Seriously.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I will probably be getting that letter in the mail as I joined the "F" The Gophers chant all night long . Couldn't give a rats a$$ who behind me was offended - It isn't church.

[jloos]

IMO part of the college sports experience is a rowdy student section. They should stand most of the game and yell as much as possible. It adds to the atmosphere. From my experiences in the student section, whenever the students act like students they are threatened by REA staff. To be fair the vast majority of the REA staff is very nice and kindly try and get the students to "behave", but eventually they find someone to threaten the students with expulsion.

I attended my last game where I will sit in the student section during the Gopher series. I had fellow fans yelling at me the entire game, one wanting to fight me. At the same time I was told by various REA security to sit down at least a dozen times, until the last REA guy said he was kicking out anyone found standing (he did kick out at least 10 people in 307). I will be watching the rest of the games on TV or picking up what tickets I can get. Next year I will hopefully get a good enough job where I can give the REA enough $$ to get season tickets.

[The Sicatoka]

I will probably be getting that letter in the mail as I joined the "F" The Gophers chant all night long

[Diggler]

What is it that the students think they want? Seriously.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Students really don't want that much other than to feel appreciated and listened to. What students want is for REA to make an attempt at creating atmosphere. Let the band play, put the lyrics to the school song on the scoreboard, somehow encourage people to do the sieve cheer and most importantly listen to the students because incredibly they actually have some good ideas. Students would be happy to help with this as we did the first year. REA seemed to have the attitude that it was too much work though, so they just abandoned it.

One example of the students being ignored is that it took REA two years to put gates up to stop the moron students at the back of the line from pushing. Now it isn't REA's fault that these students are stupid and should be smacked upside the head, but it is REA's fault that they didn't take any action against the pushing and shoving until it got totally out of control and people got hurt at the Wisconsin series two years ago. We told them time and again to put up gates and they always told us ok yeah good idea, but they never followed through on it. When they finally do follow through, it works and since then there have been much fewer problems.

And Sica, we know who that letter was mainly addressed to. Let's not kid ourselves.

[The Sicatoka]

Trust me, it's not just the good ideas of the students that have been summarily ignored. I've tried and I'm just as invisible.

A new management regime is coming into place at REA with Todd Berning's departure. Would we have ever expected to see "comments@theralph.com" on the ring either of the last two seasons asking for inputs? There may be hope.

[The Sicatoka]

And Sica, we know who that letter was mainly addressed to.  Let's not kid ourselves.

I recall it pointing to all UND fans. Unfortunately, the easiest situations to point to are with students at home. Trust me, I've seen some questionable road behavior at times from UND non-student fans also. I'm glad the letter was written addressed to all.

[iramurphy]

Good Day to all. I am one of the old guys but I am on the other side so the only part about the students is that I expect a little more humor and ingenuity in the cheers. The Wisconsin students have been the best over the years. The signs aren't as good this year as last but just like with the team, we shouldn't rush to judge. Two years ago I was in temporary seats to the left of the student section and frankly, I thought I knew why the students stood up. It was the only way I knew they were there. The cheering wasn't that loud and certainly needed more work with the content and coordination. I don't think most fans care if the students stand to cheer or jeer. If you are going to obstruct someones view I think you ahve an obligation to entertain them. To stand for the sake of standing is not needed and I believe the reason the the "old fat guy" was upset. Why don't you be proactive and go up and get to know some of the alumni. You may find they are not any different only older. If the only true tradition our hockey student fans are going to be remebered for is standing, then you should enroll at the agricultural college in Fargo. I for one want the students at the games and expect them to be more clever than to think yelling "f" the gophers is a good cheer. If you use your brain power you can be much more entertaining and insulting.

More years ago than I care to remember we started something later called the "snake pit" behind the visitors bench at Basketball games. We didn't swear other than hell or damn and most of the refs in the NCC and coaches knew about us. Some would come and talk to us before the games and we had a pretty good time. Eventually, they initiated a new conference rule which outlawed students behind the visitors bench and for one regional tournament Pete Coe "Kojack" the head of campus security sat next to me the whole game. He had a good sense of humor and wasn't a bad guy.

The previous administration at REA is now gone and that is a good thing. Things should improve.

What I hope will also improve, is the cleverness and quality of the students cheers and jeers and insults otherwise sit down and stay out of the way so at least the old fat guy and his buddies can see. Also, you should be able to be smart enough to be funny and keep your language clean. If you do that and someone whines let me know and I will come and sit with you and the fat guy can have my seats.

[fightingsioux4life]

[dagies]

Good Day to all.  I am one of the old guys but I am on the other side so the only part about the students is that I expect a little more humor and ingenuity in the cheers.  The Wisconsin students have been the best over the years.  The signs aren't as good this year as last but just like with the team,  we shouldn't rush to judge.  Two years ago I was in temporary seats to the left of the student section and frankly,  I  thought I knew why the students stood up.  It was the only way I knew they were there.  The cheering wasn't that loud and certainly needed more work with the content and coordination.  I don't think most fans care if the students stand to cheer or jeer. If you are going to obstruct someones view I think you ahve an obligation to entertain them.  To stand for the sake of standing is not needed and I believe the reason the the "old fat guy" was upset.  Why don't you be proactive and go up and get to know some of the alumni.  You may find they are not any different only older.  If the only true tradition our hockey student fans are going to be remebered for is standing,  then you should enroll at the agricultural college in Fargo.  I for one want the students at the games and expect them to be more clever than to think yelling "f" the gophers is a good cheer.  If you use your brain power you can be much more entertaining and insulting.

More years ago than I care to remember we started something later called the "snake pit" behind the visitors bench at Basketball games.  We didn't swear other than hell or damn and most of the refs in the NCC and coaches knew about us.  Some would come and talk to us before the games and we had a pretty good time.  Eventually,  they initiated a new conference rule which outlawed students behind the visitors bench and for one regional tournament Pete Coe "Kojack" the head of campus security sat next to me the whole game.  He had a good sense of humor and wasn't a bad guy.

The previous administration at REA is now gone and that is a good thing.  Things should improve. 

What I hope will also improve,  is the cleverness and quality of the students cheers and jeers and insults otherwise sit down and stay out of the way so at least the old fat guy and his buddies can see.  Also,  you should be able to be smart enough to be funny and keep your language clean.  If you do that and someone whines let me know and I will come and sit with you and the fat guy can have my seats.

Sing it, brother!

AMEN!

[PCM]

If state government support was to vanish overnight, tuition and fees would just be jacked up to compensate.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nobody would pay that much to attend UND. The university would disappear without state support. You know it. I know it. It's assinine to pretend that it would be otherwise, no matter how you try to spin it.

Your implication seemed to be that "Since the taxpayers of North Dakota fund UND, students shouldn't complain".

I never said that. I said it's silly to believe that UND exists because of the students. It doesn't.

My whole point is that in order to increase enrollment, retain the students we have now, and make it more likely that students will give back to their alma mater as alumni, we need to treat them with respect and consideration. How we treat them at athletic events is part of that equation.

Students, like all people, must earn respect. They don't automatically deserve it simply because they're students and they believe the university exists because of them. That attitude is part of the problem.

I've said this several times before, but I'll repeat it again: Students are the best part of the atmosphere at hockey games and that's they way it should be. That has always been my position. But it doesn't mean that students get a pass when it comes to behaving in a socially acceptable manner at the games.

If students were the only people in the audience at hockey games, how they behaved wouldn't matter. If the games weren't broadcast outside of Grand Forks, it wouldn't matter.

But the fact is, there are other people at the games besides students who pay good money and deserve to see them. And whether you like it or not, how students behave at the games does reflect on the university, on the community and on the state.

[PCM]

I recall it pointing to all UND fans. Unfortunately, the easiest situations to point to are with students at home. Trust me, I've seen some questionable road behavior at times from UND non-student fans also. I'm glad the letter was written addressed to all.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Didn't that letter also reference poor fan behavior at Sioux football games and complaints from visiting fans who were harrassed by non-student UND fans?

[Cratter]

Nobody would pay that much to attend UND. The university would disappear without state support. You know it. I know it. It's assinine to pretend that it would be otherwise, no matter how you try to spin it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah god knows there is no such thing as private schools that exist without state support.

Funny thing because that is what dunker was saying that you nitpicked. If there was no students there would be no university (as you seem to state because the students couldn't pickup that big of a bill). He didn't say anything about the students funding the building of the university.

[fightingsioux4life]

Nobody would pay that much to attend UND. The university would disappear without state support. You know it. I know it. It's assinine to pretend that it would be otherwise, no matter how you try to spin it.

I agree with you, but that's where the state legislature is taking us. But that's another topic for another time. The point I was trying to hammer home is that with students paying more and more of the bill (in tuition and in other fees), students shouldn't be treated like dirt at hockey games or anywhere else. I guess I could have picked a better example.

Anyway, if I remember correctly, the legislature voted back during the 2001 session to not help pay for any maintenance or operating costs for the new REA, so this whole "taxpayer" discussion is somewhat irrelevant to the topic at hand. My mistake, again.

I never said that. I said it's silly to believe that UND exists because of the students. It doesn't.

You are partially right. UND wouldn't exist without state sponsorship and support and with the support of alums and other private organizations. However, without students continuing to chose UND as their college, UND would be in a tough spot.

Students, like all people, must earn respect. They don't automatically deserve it simply because they're students and they believe the university exists because of them. That attitude is part of the problem.

I went to hockey games as a student and now as a season ticket holder. I never have detected this "attitude" you are talking about, either sitting in the student section or now sitting a couple of sections across from the student section. All I've seen is a bunch of college kids having fun on a Friday or Saturday night. Sure, there are always a few bad apples and malcontents, but it is wrong to paint the entire student section with this label. If anyone needs an attitude adjustment, it's the REA management and some of the staff.

I've said this several times before, but I'll repeat it again: Students are the best part of the atmosphere at hockey games and that's they way it should be. That has always been my position. But it doesn't mean that students get a pass when it comes to behaving in a socially acceptable manner at the games.

Again, what "behavior" are you talking about? Is it the standing up for the whole game? I've already stated that I think both sides need to sit down and hammer out an agreement that everyone can live with. Profanity? I don't use it and I don't like it. But you will always have it to a certain extent in sports crowds in this country, whatever the sport. At least we don't fight each other like soccer crowds in Europe. Throwing stuff on the ice? Other than hats after a hat trick, it hasn't happened much in the new Ralph. I think it happened much more in the old Ralph. Again, I haven't seen much inappropriate or rowdy behavior on the part of student fans. The only inappropriate behavior I've heard about is on the part of REA management and staff, based on the comments I've read on this forum and on what I've heard from others on campus.

If students were the only people in the audience at hockey games, how they behaved wouldn't matter. If the games weren't broadcast outside of Grand Forks, it wouldn't matter.

But the fact is, there are other people at the games besides students who pay good money and deserve to see them. And whether you like it or not, how students behave at the games does reflect on the university, on the community and on the state.

I am one of those people who pays good money to watch our team play. And the only bad behavior at the games has been on the part of REA management. You know, the most outrageous thing about this whole ordeal is how the whole student section has been blamed for the actions of a few jerks that you will invariably get at sporting events. That green-colored 'riot act' that showed up last year at the CC series is an example of blaming one whole group for the actions of a few jerks. By all means, kick out those that are causing trouble. But don't look for any excuse you can find to kick students out of the Ralph. A little balance and common-sense goes a long way to preventing problems.

The old Ralph had rules: No banging on the glass, No throwing garbage on the ice, basic common-sense things that probably 99% of students had no problem with, including myself. People who couldn't behave were tossed out. And deservedly so. But people who were behaving were left alone. That is not the case in the new Ralph, if the posters on this forum are telling the truth, which I think they are.

If we can fix the seating arrangement so that students aren't bothering season ticket holders and vise-versa, that would fix most of the problems we've had since the new Ralph opened in 2001. And I don't think the atmosphere would suffer much, if at all. I think it might even be better. As for troublemakers, toss them out but leave everyone else alone. That makes sense, probably too much sense for REA management!

The bottom line is, I want a good college atmosphere where everyone has a good time and no one feels unwelcome. This is as a former student, season ticket holder and FSC member. There's my viewpoint, fair and balanced!!!

[cfm567b27]

Whats wrong with the "F the Gophers" cheer? I thought it was a brilliant play on "Lets Go Gophers" that resonates throughout Mariucci when we play in that building. Lots of creativity in the student section - keep it up

[PCM]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah god knows there is no such thing as private schools that exist without state support.

I'm well aware that private universities exist. That's not the point. Without state aid, who's going to come to UND's rescue and foot all the bills that the state pays? The students? Are they going to turn UND into a privately funded university? Get real.

Funny thing because that is what dunker was saying that you nitpicked.  If there was no students there would be no university (as you seem to state because the students couldn't pickup that big of a bill).  He didn't say anything about the students funding the building of the university.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Let me make this simple. UND exists because the voters, the taxpayers and the elected officials of North Dakota deem it to be in the public's best interest. Students would exist with or without UND. As a public university, UND wouldn't exist without the support of the state legislature, alumni contributions and funding from other government agencies.

[siouxjoy]

Students really don't want that much other than to feel appreciated and listened to. What students want is for REA to make an attempt at creating atmosphere. Let the band play, put the lyrics to the school song on the scoreboard, somehow encourage people to do the sieve cheer and most importantly listen to the students because incredibly they actually have some good ideas. Students would be happy to help with this as we did the first year. REA seemed to have the attitude that it was too much work though, so they just abandoned it.

One example of the students being ignored is that it took REA two years to put gates up to stop the moron students at the back of the line from pushing. Now it isn't REA's fault that these students are stupid and should be smacked upside the head, but it is REA's fault that they didn't take any action against the pushing and shoving until it got totally out of control and people got hurt at the Wisconsin series two years ago. We told them time and again to put up gates and they always told us ok yeah good idea, but they never followed through on it. When they finally do follow through, it works and since then there have been much fewer problems.

And Sica, we know who that letter was mainly addressed to. Let's not kid ourselves.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Okay. Here's my thoughts on this. I completely agree that the students haven't been given a fair shake.

Now for my personal opinion. There needs to be advocates. What I mean is when students (or alumni, or whomever) makes suggestions, have someone that MAKES SURE it gets achieved. Now I don't know the whole story with the gates thing, but what I am wondering is if there were a bunch of emails and suggestions ("You know what you should do, put some gates up here") or did someone specifically contact the person in charge at REA with a detailed plan to prevent injury that included several examples and testimonies.

My interpretation of the whole words of the school song on the screen thing is that it was approached half-a$$ed. I remember being at a game with the words to the school song on the scoreboard, but the person that was in charge didn't know the song, so the words didn't show up at the right time, no one could sing along, and it was extremely annoying, like watching someone sing your favorite song on Karaoke that doesn't have a clue. Since no one sang along (how could you?) it was dropped. If there would have been people truly passionate about posting the words involved, I have a feeling it would have made a better showing. It just needed someone to say "give it another shot, this is why it didn't work..."

If students feel that they are getting a raw deal, there needs to be more than just complaining about it on message boards and letters to the Dakota Student. I know everyone is busy, and in theory the Student Body President is the official rep for the students, but I believe (maybe I am just naive) that if people sit down like adults and are respectful of all parties, much more will be accomplished. Find someone to be a representative of the students that is willing to not only talk to REA and company, but to persist and make sure that the voice is heard.

That's just my view.