Anti-Semitism at UND

[SIOUXPR]

It seems that that this fine University just can't seem to get it right. This is about Social Justice, and UND needs to take action immediately.

http://www.grandforksherald.com/articles/index.cfm?id=74471

[Stromer]

It seems that that this fine University just can't seem to get it right. This is about Social Justice, and UND needs to take action immediately.

http://www.grandforksherald.com/articles/index.cfm?id=74471

Wow. I have never seen this and never thought I would. Drawing a symbol is one thing. It is insensitive but is done without real reason. Targeting this kid seems so high school. One has to wonder what was the underlying cause to the incidents. I doubt a bunch of people ganged up on this kid because he is Jewish but it is possible. I think it is more likely that they had a problem with him about something else and chose to express themselves in this manner. Either way, it is disgusting and the students responsible should be kicked out of school. This isn't like the NDSU incident, or the theme party at UND. This is a REAL example of discrimination/racism.

[siouxhockeyfan11]

The university is taking action tonight they had a police officer goto each dorm and talk to the students about this stuff and about if they see it to take a picture on your phone and call the police immediatly. I'm glad they are doing this there is no place for this at UND.

[Chewey]

In a letter to UND administrators, Weinstein linked the West Hall and Noren Hall swastikas with the Gamma Phi Indian party, suggesting that the UND administration had compromised its moral authority by defending for so long the school

[dagies]

This is clearly not a UND problem alone, as the Herald piece points out. Any attempt to link the respectful use of the logo to these repulsive actions is loose at best and irresponsible IMO.

UND officials should never have lagged in investigating things like swastikas showing up in dorms, or any accusations of harassment. That's the disappointing part. Kupchella is right, and I think 98% of the campus, alumni and the community would condemn this behavior. Hopefully this is a wakeup for UND to be a little more active the next time a complaint is made.

[fourwindsboy]

In a letter to UND administrators, Weinstein linked the West Hall and Noren Hall swastikas with the Gamma Phi Indian party, suggesting that the UND administration had compromised its moral authority by defending for so long the school

[SportsDoc]

The more unfortunate part of this story isn't that it happened, which is bad enough, but the fact that UND dragged it's collective feet for so long to address this. This should have been dealt with, strongly, and even harshly for those involved in a quick and forceful manner, with due process, of course.

The reality here is that UND's current response coincides with the crimes being made public, not, it appears, with UND's efforts to resolve this issue. That reflects poorly on the school, it's students, the administration and alumni.

There is no way to sugar coat this. Unfortunately, comparing this to the logo issue or Ralph Engelstad, while unfair, is to be expected, and is not, to many people, way off base. These kinds of comparisons will continue.

As one who enjoyed his time at UND and is and always will be a supporter of my Alma Mater and the Fighting Sioux nickname, it is time to put this to rest and move on. It is simply no longer worth the fight. The negatives clearly outweigh the positives at this point.

[Chewey]

It doesn't surprise me that UND drags it's feet on this swastiki issue afterall they didn't do a thing when their Sugar Daddy Englestad was having Nazi parties in Vegas. The UND prof is 100% correct. UND has given up its morals for the almighty dollar. IF the Spirit Lake tribe was full of doctors, lawyers, i.e. people with alotta cash, the nickname would have been changed long ago. Money talks, BS walks.

Oh, please. Is that all you have to bring out of the hat AGAIN? I don't see how investigating it carefully and closely constitutes a dragging of the feet. That mindset comes from PCers who just want people to conclude as to their own assertions without any support whatsoever (i.e. some profs and students claiming racism without documentation or reports). Another case in point is the Duke Lacrosse fiasco. This professor has spent too much time in his office and needs to stimulate his creative muse to come up with more logical and factually based positions. There is no nexus between the nickname and the terrible event that happened with the Jewish student. The university is absolutely correct in taking its time to investigate this matter, given the severity of the issues involved. I hope neither you nor the professor (charitably described) ever are allowed on a jury. Even if RE had Nazi parties (which, if proved, is abhorrent conduct), the reflection is on him and not UND. How about Obama accepting money from the terroist that came (or is he yet to come?) to UND? How about Obama going to church and listening to racist vitriol for 20 years? I guess Obama is responsible for the conduct of his pastor and the conduct of that rube who has appeared, or is going to appear, at UND. Obama is not responsible for the conduct of idiots who have expressed support for him. Neither is UND responsible for idiotic conduct by RE.

I know the fellow who was in charge (maybe he still is) of INMED. He is probably one of the ten best human beings I have ever had the good fortune to have known and I have not seen him in years and, yes, he opposes the nickname. There are plenty of NA doctors on the reservations. There are plenty of NAs who are lawyers too who work on or have worked on the reservations: Ivan Bercier (a great guy from Turtle Mtn), Janice Schroeder-Morley at the U.S. Attorney's Office, Tom Bird Bear (its terrible that he died so young), etc. In fact, your conclusions that there are no such educated people on Spirit Lake is racist, isn't it?

[Stromer]

IF the Spirit Lake tribe was full of doctors, lawyers, i.e. people with alotta cash, the nickname would have been changed long ago.

If this was true, their wouldn't even be any discussion about the name. The name would be accepted by likely all but the most crazy of profs.

[The Sicatoka]

Change the name and all this type of stuff goes away.

Change it to some furry drooling mammal.

Like at

St. Cloud State, or North Dakota State,

where swastikas have also appeared on campus at times.

Kum-bah-ya.

PS - Sounds like the wrong one or ones no longer live in the halls. There should be some booting out for vandalism and threats.

[SiouxCrioux1]

In a letter to UND administrators, Weinstein linked the West Hall and Noren Hall swastikas with the Gamma Phi Indian party, suggesting that the UND administration had compromised its moral authority by defending for so long the school

[Sioux-cia]

IF the Spirit Lake tribe was full of doctors, lawyers, i.e. people with alotta cash, the nickname would have been changed long ago. Money talks, BS walks.

That could very well be! Why haven't the tribes with casinos used some of their money to fight the name and logo? Probably the same reason they don't share it with the tribal membership! Greed!! So why aren't the reservations full of doctors, lawyers, etc. BECAUSE they go to UND to get an education and can't stomach going back to the rez to live. They don't want their children exposed to corruption of casino funds, apathy, 'poor me' attitudes, low high school graduation rates, higher than normal alcohol and drug abuse, tribal council dictatorship, misapropriation of government funds, domestic abuse, gangs, etc. Yes, those things happen all over the U.S. but living on a reservation makes it more difficult to protect your family from them. How many doctors, lawyers, etc have gone back to the rez to make life better for those those still living there? I'm willing to bet that the number that run the other way is larger than the ones that go back. Oh sure, you hear them talking about working for a better life for those let behind but how much can you do living off the rez?

That said, it's disgusting that three individuls are getting away with these 'hate crimes'. AND, yes, that is what they are. Threats, verbal abuse, brandishing a gun (I couldn't tell the difference between a pellet gun and one that shoots bullets), etc. are crimes!! I'm ashamed that the university isn't being more pro-active. The fact that the victim and not the abusers had to leave his home is unbelievable!!

[Goon]

Couldn't agree more Chewey. I think that tying this together with the nickname and blaming UND for this is complete bull$%!# and nothing else.

That is right there is no link between this and the name. It has nothing to do with it.

[ScottM]

Change the name and all this type of stuff goes away.

Change it to some furry drooling mammal.

Like at

St. Cloud State, or North Dakota State,

where swastikas have also appeared on campus at times.

Kum-bah-ya.

My goodness. You just seem so jaded and cynical. Is your inner-child ill? *virtual group hug*

[fourwindsboy]

That could very well be! Why haven't the tribes with casinos used some of their money to fight the name and logo? Probably the same reason they don't share it with the tribal membership! Greed!! So why aren't the reservations full of doctors, lawyers, etc. BECAUSE they go to UND to get an education and can't stomach going back to the rez to live. They don't want their children exposed to corruption of casino funds, apathy, 'poor me' attitudes, low high school graduation rates, higher than normal alcohol and drug abuse, tribal council dictatorship, misapropriation of government funds, domestic abuse, gangs, etc. Yes, those things happen all over the U.S. but living on a reservation makes it more difficult to protect your family from them. How many doctors, lawyers, etc have gone back to the rez to make life better for those those still living there? I'm willing to bet that the number that run the other way is larger than the ones that go back. Oh sure, you hear them talking about working for a better life for those let behind but how much can you do living off the rez?

That said, it's disgusting that three individuls are getting away with these 'hate crimes'. AND, yes, that is what they are. Threats, verbal abuse, brandishing a gun (I couldn't tell the difference between a pellet gun and one that shoots bullets), etc. are crimes!! I'm ashamed that the university isn't being more pro-active. The fact that the victim and not the abusers had to leave his home is unbelievable!!

There are no MD's, Engineers who are enrolled members of the SLT. To my knowledge, there are 2 lawyers, one who lives on SLT and I don't know were the other resides or works. Wow you from Spirit lake? How do you know so much or think you know so much about the SLT? I get the feeling you are just making inferences based on stereotypes and heresay. I was born and raised on the SLN. Have a masters degree, am married with 2 kids, who attend a school on the SLN, and am very happy living here. Wouldn't want to live anywhere else. It is no where near as bad as you described it! Gangs, are you kidding me?! Corrupt polititians, boy you don't find those anywhere but on a reservation! Its people like you who perpetuate the negative stereotypes toward us.

[The Sicatoka]

My goodness. You just seem so jaded and cynical. Is your inner-child ill? *virtual group hug*

Frey, Henley, et al, said it best:

"I'd like to find your inner child and kick its little ... "

[Sioux-cia]

Its people like you who perpetuate the negative stereotypes toward us.

http://www.walkingsky.com/restless/4.html

[SportsDoc]

In a letter to UND administrators, Weinstein linked the West Hall and Noren Hall swastikas with the Gamma Phi Indian party, suggesting that the UND administration had compromised its moral authority by defending for so long the school

[Sioux-cia]

There are no MD's, Engineers who are enrolled members of the SLT. To my knowledge, there are 2 lawyers, one who lives on SLT and I don't know were the other resides or works.

So why aren't there any MDs, engineers, etc. who are enrolled members of the SLT? Why is there a higher than average high school drop out rate on SLT. Why aren't the majority of enrolled members not raising their children to reach for the sky? Why is there silence/acceptance of abuse of power and resources by the SLT government officials? Is your answer, 'the Fighting Sioux name and logo'?

I do know NAs who are doctors, lawyers, teachers, accountants who don't live on reservations. Their reasoning is they want a better life for themselves and their children. My family left their ancesteral home for the same reasons. Their response to racism? Raising us to be over achievers, to be successful in our lives and communities to reach for the sky and beyond. Yeah, I know that sounds hokey, but, its true!

[Stromer]

While sticking to my original feelings, I can't help but feel there are some things that don

[siouxfan123]

While sticking to my original feelings, I can't help but feel there are some things that don

[Stromer]

I think you are reading way to much into the whole "paying" issue. There are things that get changed when information transfers from one person to another (anyone remember playing telephone when we were little?). So the person telling the story in the article interviews a person and they say they had to "get a new meal", the journalist then changes or infers getting a new meal into "paying for a new meal." Facts when not provided first person get lost and we don't get all of the information, it is just bound to happen. So things may not connect with the information, but you are not getting first hand information either, which is what you need to get to make informed comments and conclusions on how well the facts fit together.

Second the problem is that the student wanted to be moved or move out, and for whatever reason the university's housing department wasn't going to allow the student to move or give him a refund to move out (for students on a budget, its hard to move out without money). So while it wouldn't be prudent to move all of the students, the one who did want to be moved got no response from the organization that held all of the cards.

I understand that facts get changed but even though that was a small one, the next one could totally change the story. This is also an email between two people. It involved no journalist. If you are trying to make a point like Jack was, you should have your info as accurate as possible. I also realize that I am missing obvious pieces but it doesn't sound like Jack and UND are on the same page either.

From what I understand from reading the email, the university was not going to give him a refund if he moved out of the dorms (a poor decision by the housing people). However, it sounds like they did offer to move him to another room, which was found to be unacceptable by Jack and likely the student. Thats how I am currently reading it.

[fourwindsboy]

I think you are reading way to much into the whole "paying" issue. There are things that get changed when information transfers from one person to another (anyone remember playing telephone when we were little?). So the person telling the story in the article interviews a person and they say they had to "get a new meal", the journalist then changes or infers getting a new meal into "paying for a new meal." Facts when not provided first person get lost and we don't get all of the information, it is just bound to happen. So things may not connect with the information, but you are not getting first hand information either, which is what you need to get to make informed comments and conclusions on how well the facts fit together.

Second the problem is that the student wanted to be moved or move out, and for whatever reason the university's housing department wasn't going to allow the student to move or give him a refund to move out (for students on a budget, its hard to move out without money). So while it wouldn't be prudent to move all of the students, the one who did want to be moved got no response from the organization that held all of the cards.

Sounds to me like you're putting the victim on trial rather than the perps. Why? I get the feeling you attitude is the same as UND's, make the victim prove he was terrorized rather than have the perps prove they are innocent. Another blackeye for UND. I am a UND grad and I always wanted m kids to go to UND for college but incidents like these and the nickname issue have changed my mind. I can't stop them from going there but I certainly won't encourage them. Go ahead, let the potshots begin! I put on my mental kevlar.

[Blackhawk19]

I'm wondering how this situation would be handled if it was a super-star athlete from the football or hockey team. I suggest that you stop trying to make it to seem that the victim is guilty. It lets your inner ignorance shine

[jloos]

Something smells fishy with these allegations. From my experience when you have a story so over the top, everything needs to be investigated. I am in no way saying the victim made everything up. Just that the authorities should be investigating this possibility. It would not be the first time this has happened.