Why do they say this at games?

[Diggler]

Again, who cares about Sioux Falls, they aren't making a mockery of our name.  Besides, there are a heck of a lot more Lakota/Dakota in Sioux Falls than at UND.  Geez, I wonder why. 

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How is UND making a mockery of the name while Sioux Falls is not? Just wondering.

I would guess Sioux Falls has more Lakota/Dakota because of it's much higher population. Sioux Falls is comprised of 2.12% Native Americans. UND according to this link had 13,187 students in 2004 and has over students 400 American Indian. Therefore UND is comprised of 3.03% Native Americans, a higher percentage than Sioux Falls. True, all the Native Americans at UND aren't all Lakota/Dakota, but the same is true for Sioux Falls.

The only thing Saigo at SCSU has a spine about is worrying about other schools problems. He certainly doesn't have one in dealing with his own schools.

[iramurphy]

It's "not theirs", eh? I'm sorry... is there some sort of copyright on the name that I'm not aware of? Please fill me in. I'm waiting...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Graham continues to ignore the fact that his elders gave UND permission and because of what his elders did years ago, UND has a right both legally and morally to use the name.

If he thinks that because times change, we ignore what was done in the past means that should apply to all agreements and treaties and the white folks can then change the treaties and agreements with the tribes anyway they wish. Some of those treaties and agreements are no longer what we would do in today's world but we are stuck with them anyway. The tribes across the country use our federal courts to enforce those agreements. For Graham to think that because this permission was given years ago, and now the tribal chairs want to change that, only dishonors his elders and ignores the cultural diversity between the University and his culture. What he thinks of the use of the name doesn't mean it wasn't done with honor. It was something our culture did to honor his. His insults go way beyond his refusal to consider the cultural diversity outside his own. His thinly veiled referal to "homo...genous" is an insult to gays and those who participate in this forum.

Graham has no desire to have an intelligent conversation on the subject. I think he wants someone to come over to the Cultural center so he and others may verbally abuse you and attempt to physically intimidate you. After you leave they can pat themselves on the back and think they have won Little Bighorn II.

What would make more sense is to offer to listen to why it is so important to UND and then relate why the name change is important to him and his friends and the campus PC folks. If he were smart he would use the issue to gain allies in the work that really needs to be done for Native Americans and especially the Native American kids across the state.

Given the choice of leaving the name and using it to bring UND resources to the reservations or expand programs for Native Americans across the state, vs changing the name and pissing off a lot of people with UND ties, he would rather sacrifice the opportunites it could provide just to get the name changed. That is the saddest part of his argument and one of the reasons the kids on the reservations will continue to struggle. The so called leaders don't have the vision, leadership and foresight to make this a win - win situation for all concerned.

[fightonsioux]

grahamcracker: If it is wrong for UND to use the name Sioux what makes it right for the hockey team Soo Indians to use that name. And why aren't you and others complaining about them. Maybe not complaing so much about the Soo part, but what about the Indians part. This team was just established in 1995, you would think they would have known better at that time.

Everyone needs to go to sooindians.com and check it out.

And I don't care if the owner is Native American. They players are not. Please explain to me why he was able to do this without PC's protesting.

[PCM]

I think this school is a good school.  Unfortunately its plagued with this name that it not theirs in the first place. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"Sioux" is derived from the French word "Nadouessioux." I wonder if the Dakota, Nakota and Lakota had France's permission to call themselves Sioux because the word wasn't theirs in the first place.

[THETRIOUXPER]

Hey, what about Indian Motorcycles, the company went under again after being revived only a few years ago, maybe the pressure from the left wing wacko's finally made them buckle.

[Cratter]

That would be fun and count me in on that one. I guarantee we could have more people protesting the protesters.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm against picketing but don't know how to show it!

[cheppi]

I don't know about anybody else but I am tired of all this PC B.S. It has gotten totally out of control. If one percent of said paoulation complains about something than it must be changed. I'm sorry but in a democracy it should be the majority that rules. ie if you are offended by a posting of the ten commandments then don't read it. A great majority of these issues are very very minor in regards to every day life. Develope some tolerance and live your life as you see fit. You are only making enemies by trying to force minority opinion upon the majority. sorry about the rant.

[ESPNInsider]

I don't know about anybody else but I am tired of all this PC B.S.  It has gotten totally out of control.  If one percent of said paoulation complains about something than it must be changed.  I'm sorry but in a democracy it should be the majority that rules.  ie if you are offended by a posting of the ten commandments then don't read it.  A great majority of these issues are very very minor in regards to every day life.  Develope some tolerance and live your life as you see fit.  You are only making enemies by trying to force minority opinion upon the majority.  sorry about the rant.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think you need to stand up for what you believe though too. I agree that there are some people who are going to complain about every little thing, but I also think that people should stand up and fight for what they believe.

[GrahamKracker]

[GrahamKracker]

[sioux goo]

ignorance i guess isnt always bliss......

if you like SCSU so much go t here with their hyprocacy...how they discriminate against their minority population...hypocrits all around us....and if your not getting free items from the gov't....show proof....since your going to school your not receiving any assistance from the govt??? food stamps...living asssistance...that is all aiding your education....so please stop with that story....as was stated earlier...please concern yourself with bigger problems going on in this country and with the native american people....poverty....alcholism...drugs...etc etc....as well there is a war going on.....young people are dying everyday....and your here acting like this......seems silly? i think so....

[iramurphy]

[spochunk]

if you like SCSU so much go t here with their hyprocacy...how they discriminate against their minority population...hypocrits all around us....and if your not getting free items from the gov't....show proof....since your going to school your not receiving any assistance from the govt??? food stamps...living asssistance...that is all aiding your education

This statement is just plain ignorant...I am an American Indian and I have never received food stamps, living assistance or anything of the sort. How are you supposed to prove that anyways?? We get by going to school just like anybody else...we have to take out loans or apply for scholarships. People are not just running around handing us money for being Indian. We have to maintain a high gpa,have high ACT/SAT scores, write out essays, and everything else to obtain money to pay for our education. All I know is that I seem to be paying a lot to be going to college...I would like to know where Indian people are supposed to be getting these "free" things?

[PCM]

You claim to have picked up an M-16 for this country.  You claim to have launched warplanes from an aircraft carrier. As a combat vet I guess that may occur,  but normally if you are  on the flight deck of an Aircraft carrier you don't carry an M-16.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My father-in-law served in the Navy in World War II and in the Army during the Korean War, so what GrahamKracker says he did is indeed possible. I imagine it's also possible that he was taught to use an M-16 while in the Navy without being in the Marines or SEALs. Heck, the Air Force showed me how to fire an M-16 during the early 70s when I was teen-aged kid in Civil Air Patrol.

[IowaBison]

This statement is just plain ignorant...I am an American Indian and I have never received food stamps, living assistance or anything of the sort. How are you supposed to prove that anyways?? We get by going to school just like anybody else...we have to take out loans or apply for scholarships. People are not just running around handing us money for being Indian. We have to maintain a high gpa,have high ACT/SAT scores, write out essays, and everything else to obtain money to pay for our education. All I know is that I seem to be paying a lot to be going to college...I would like to know where Indian people are supposed to be getting these "free" things?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

what did you buy with your per-cap?

[MafiaMan]

Personal insults accomplish nothing. I respect GrahamCracker's opinion and respectfully disagree.

A few years ago, I stood in line at Target behind an American Indian wearing a Cleveland baseball hat and Indians jersey. Racist? Misguided? An Uncle Tom? I don't know...you tell me.

Just the other day I was at the pool and an American Indian man walks up to me and says he noticed the tattoo on my back shoulderblade. It is of the old Sioux logo (Blackhawk, if you will) with the words "NORTH DAKOTA" above it and "FIGHTING SIOUX" below it. He asked to see it close-up and asked if I was Indian. I am not and told him that I attended UND and am a fan of the hockey team. He was familiar with the school and the hockey team. His response?

A) "You're a racist pig!"

B) "Change the nickname!"

C) "Cool tattoo...I like it."

The answer would be C. The gentleman must be another uninformed commoner who needs to be told that white society is putting him down. Or maybe, just maybe, he really thought it was a cool tattoo.

While we're busy trying to wipe out the Sioux nickname and logo, perhaps we can start burning history books, too, and making sure no one knows who inhabited North Dakota before white Germans and Norwegians. I don't see how changing the nickname accomplishes anything.

[PCM]

A few years ago, I stood in line at Target behind an American Indian wearing a Cleveland baseball hat and Indians jersey.  Racist?  Misguided?  An Uncle Tom?  I don't know...you tell me. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I was once in Valley Dairy when in walked an older American Indian man decked out from head to toe in Washington Redskin sports apparel. I probably did a double-take.

A few years ago, I attended an educational event on the Spirit Lake Reservation. A student probably around 14 or 15 years old noticed from my nametag that I was with UND. She told me that her uncle attended the university and then opened her coat to reveal that she was wearing a UND sweatshirt adorned with the Fighting Sioux logo.

At Turtle Mountain Community College, an American Indian student told me how proud he was of the UND logo because it had been designed by local Chippewa artist Ben Brien.

A colleague of mine from UND was visiting the Standing Rock Sioux Reservation when a member of the tribe asked him his position on the Fighting Sioux logo. He thought he was perfectly safe in stating his honest opinion, which was that he supported changing the Fighting Sioux name. But immediately after he said this, the tribal member proceeded to berate him for his position and UND for even considering changing the name.

Of course, all of this is anecdotal evidence, which means that it doesn't prove a thing. However, based on my experience, I'm highly skeptical of anyone who claims to know where all or even most American Indians stand on the nickname issue.