shep Posted April 1, 2004 Share Posted April 1, 2004 I'm not suggesting that Zach is going to end up in a Travis Roche situation as I really think he more favorably compares to the Johnson, Hrkac, Blake trilogy of former Sioux, guys who became solid NHL'ers (at least in Johnson and Blake's cases) but who didn't dominate as they did in college. I just wonder when a young man signs that professional contract if he's truly aware of all the pitfalls inherent to it, and if he ever considers taking another year of development at the college level to better prepare for the pro game. Does anyone remember Gord Sjerven or Howard Walker or all the others who left early never to be seen again? I wonder if they feel it was too early. I just hope Zach can make a name for himself b/c that million dollar contract turns to 80 grand if he's in the minors, and it is worth a heckuva lot more than 80 grand to have the goons in the minors whack at you all season. Just a thought for any other players who may be reading this and wondering about the fruits of the NHL. For the record, I thought Roche was the best skating/stick-handling defenseman to ever play here, and I was in school when James Patrick was dominating the ice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted April 1, 2004 Share Posted April 1, 2004 Just a thought for any other players who may be reading this and wondering about the fruits of the NHL. If they are coming here to look for pro-hockey career advice - it is already over for them...."yes young man, you should turn down 3 million dollars as it just may not be in your best interest to be financially set at age 19....think about your future." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shep Posted April 1, 2004 Author Share Posted April 1, 2004 If they all received 3 mill that would be a relevant point. However, many of these contracts (Minus signing bonus) are not guaranteed and a player in the minors takes home 80 grand a year which is less than what they had in mind when they signed the deal and really a lot worse way to make 80 grand than sitting behind a desk wasting time on a message board. I'm just saying there are no guarantees in life and in hockey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fedorov Posted April 1, 2004 Share Posted April 1, 2004 If they are coming here to look for pro-hockey career advice - it is already over for them...."yes young man, you should turn down 3 million dollars as it just may not be in your best interest to be financially set at age 19....think about your future." Zach is going to spend all of his money on buying Corvettes for every UND season ticket holder. Wait, that is the premise for Mr. Deeds 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted April 1, 2004 Share Posted April 1, 2004 If they all received 3 mill that would be a relevant point.However, many of these contracts (Minus signing bonus) are not guaranteed and a player in the minors takes home 80 grand a year which is less than what they had in mind when they signed the deal and really a lot worse way to make 80 grand than sitting behind a desk wasting time on a message board. Let's not forget that the signing bonus is for keeps and it is quite rare for UND grads to start out at $80,000 a year in regular jobs. And I think most people who have played the game would agree that getting paid $80,000, or even the couple hundred a week in the ECHL is a pretty good life! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shep Posted April 1, 2004 Author Share Posted April 1, 2004 You really gotta love the sport to take a few hundred a week to have your teeth bashed in on a regular basis. The dental costs alone can be astronomical. I just wish God had given me the power to use my right arm as a middle reliever, come into a game in the low pressure situation of the 7th inning and pay me a quarter mil annually. Now that's a good gig. I know the signing bonus is forever, but it would have been there next year too. I just wonder if in the long run you could say that going early is better or waiting a year is better. I wonder if any researcher, toiling away at less than 80 large a year, has done some research on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted April 1, 2004 Share Posted April 1, 2004 I wonder if any researcher, toiling away at less than 80 large a year, has done some research on this. Maybe, but only because he regrets pissing his chance away to make a living playing a kids game. Also, if you are drafted and done with college elegibility - that signing bonus shrinks as there are no other options left (like returning to school) And by the way, minor league players are not paying for dental work out of their own pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shep Posted April 1, 2004 Author Share Posted April 1, 2004 Maybe they don't pay for the dental work when the teeth get smacked, but they do pay for years afterward. Look I'm all in favor of getting paid to play a kids game, but I just wonder about the timing of taking the money, leaving school (which has to be a ton of fun for these guys) and then riding a bus to Scranton every other weekend because I didn't make the big team. I'm just wondering about the value of the extra year in school and development. (I know, I know, what if he gets hurt that year.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted April 1, 2004 Share Posted April 1, 2004 Playing hockey you're "on the job" thus workers comp pays for the dentistry. Let's run the numbers: - Sign for $1 MM - Pay the taxes - Net about $600 k - Put that away in tax-free municipal bonds at 4% annually - That's $24k in tax free interest annually - Then you draw your salary ($80k or $1 MM) OK, how many 19 year olds that you know are: - doing what they've always wanted to do - making $100k doing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted April 1, 2004 Share Posted April 1, 2004 I'm just wondering about the value of the extra year in school and development What makes you think players develop better by playing 40 games against lower-level college competition rather than 80 games at a higher level AHL or ECHL competition? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shep Posted April 1, 2004 Author Share Posted April 1, 2004 Again, all I'm wondering is if we could determine whether that 100 K he's making at 19 will turn into more if he waits until he's 20 to start taking it. I wonder about waiting the extra year AND getting the same money if not more b/c of your development. Ok, what I'm really doing is the whole "Stay in school" thing OK? I mean, seriously where are these guys gonna find this many college girls to drool over their every move? Scranton? Wilkes Barre? Hershey? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shep Posted April 1, 2004 Author Share Posted April 1, 2004 What makes you think players develop better by playing 40 games against lower-level college competition rather than 80 games at a higher level AHL or ECHL competition? That's a fair point. I guess I've had a stereotypical view of minor league hockey ever since I saw Slapshot and the Paul Michael Glaser character (The Zach?) didn't appear to enjoy the situation that much. But I guess there is some benefit to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagies Posted April 1, 2004 Share Posted April 1, 2004 I also don't necessarily buy that a player needs to stay in college to better prepare for the pro game. I would guess that the minors do a great job of preparing a player for the game, if only in numbers of games played, travel, etc. The competition must be at least as high probably higher than in D1 hockey. Maybe less practice, more games. But that might be what a player wants/needs than being in school and practicing more but playing less, with fewer travel demands, etc. Now, if a player is making the decision that they want to jump straight from D1 to the pros without playing in the minors I suppose it becomes a valid argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petey23 Posted April 2, 2004 Share Posted April 2, 2004 Shep, I think the biggest factor is that that signing bonus in all likelihood will NOT be there after this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hrkac_Circus Posted April 2, 2004 Share Posted April 2, 2004 Plus, he never has to go to class anymore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoteauRinkRat Posted April 2, 2004 Share Posted April 2, 2004 Plus, he never has to go to class anymore Exactly, who would want to sit in class when they could have a full bank account and the possibility of playing in the Stanley Cup Playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jloos Posted April 2, 2004 Share Posted April 2, 2004 Playing hockey you're "on the job" thus workers comp pays for the dentistry. Let's run the numbers: - Sign for $1 MM - Pay the taxes - Net about $600 k - Put that away in tax-free municipal bonds at 4% annually - That's $24k in tax free interest annually - Then you draw your salary ($80k or $1 MM) OK, how many 19 year olds that you know are: - doing what they've always wanted to do - making $100k doing it. 10-15% agents commission NHLPA Fees Other fees? Apartment in NJ - at least $1500/month (can't live in team hotel forever) 2004 Bentley with 28 inch rims, customized leather (Green and white) $250K Wait, he's in the NHL not the NBA, scratch the Bentley. Still not a bad gig, but the expenses add up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YaneA Posted April 2, 2004 Share Posted April 2, 2004 Shep, I think you mean Michael Ontkean, who was in the TV police drama "The Rookies" & "Slapshot" and not Paul Michael Glaser who was in "Starsky and Hutch" (on TV) but not "Slapshot." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shep Posted April 2, 2004 Author Share Posted April 2, 2004 Shep, I think you mean Michael Ontkean, who was in the TV police drama "The Rookies" & "Slapshot" and not Paul Michael Glaser who was in "Starsky and Hutch" (on TV) but not "Slapshot." My bad. You're right. I knew a Michael was involved. Regarding the notion of "not having to go to class" allow me to say that I skipped more than I went, and still enjoyed the college life. In fact, that's why I enjoyed the college life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NDFlyer Posted April 2, 2004 Share Posted April 2, 2004 Shep, Speaking of college hockey players and classes..........you wanna tell them your Darren Jensen story? Statute of limitations has probably expired by now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shep Posted April 2, 2004 Author Share Posted April 2, 2004 Shep, Speaking of college hockey players and classes..........you wanna tell them your Darren Jensen story? Statute of limitations has probably expired by now. Well... Gather around my chair here you young'uns as I regale you with a tale of yesteryear. Seems we (DJ and I along with Rick Zombo and my friend Barry) were all in the same accountin' class at UND back in a time most of you can't remember but that we like to call the 80's. It was a mysterious time with no recognizable fad other than a pet rock and a Rubik's cube and strangely enough a band called the Flock of Seagulls was darn popular. But I digress. The night b/4 the final, Barry, Darren and I are studying and DJ realizes this aint sinking in so he starts talking about getting some assistance shall we say. Long story short, he doesn't trust Barry, who is seated next to him in class, to be his source of info and asks me to provide any help I can, and rather than create a whole academic investigation, I'll leave it at that except to say I got a B on the Final and he got a C. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubz Posted April 2, 2004 Share Posted April 2, 2004 I remember Zombo playing. Good, solid defenceman from the 82 team. Shoot, now I feel old. Zombo is still coaching at St Louis. I think the team will fold this year due to attendance problems. Hope not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagard Posted April 2, 2004 Share Posted April 2, 2004 Shep- All your points are good points for those who are border line. Parise like P. Martin and D. Hale will never see minor league ice unless there is a lockout next year. Even then, I'm guessing he is a player that would be considered "locked out". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shep Posted April 2, 2004 Author Share Posted April 2, 2004 Shep- All your points are good points for those who are border line. Parise like P. Martin and D. Hale will never see minor league ice unless there is a lockout next year. Even then, I'm guessing he is a player that would be considered "locked out". I am worried about a lockout, but I don't know what you mean about "locked out." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagard Posted April 2, 2004 Share Posted April 2, 2004 I am worried about a lockout, but I don't know what you mean about "locked out." Parise being an NHL player, I would think would be prohibited from playing minor league hockey in the Devil's system during the lockout. I really don't have any idea though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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