Wondering About Assists

[redwing77]

I think that the HB is just like the Heisman. Nice award but it is meaningless. Just because you win the HB doesn't make you a great player. Look at Weinke! Look at Heupel? OH! Look at Ryan Leaf.

The HB is meaningless. NCs mean everything. Murray isn't scoring as many goals as Bochenski, but look at how many assists he has already. Great players are not always the ones who score the most goals. They are the players that make their team unbeatable (or close to it). Panzer didn't win the HB. He won the NC. Whoopee Doo on the HB. Obviously Peter Senja recieved the same glory Panzer did right? Nope. Sure, he won the HB, but he doesn't have an NC to my knowledge.

Sure, I'd love to see Hobey come to GF, but I'm not going to cry if it never does. I want to see double digits in NCs first. Take down Michigan's record first, then worry about Hobey.

[MinnesotaNorthStar]

Good point...but on the flip side...look at Ryan Miller, Chris Drury, Paul Kariya, or Neal Broten. Both Hobey winners who had/have had pretty decent (to say the least) NHL careers. I think most fans see at as a respect issue. When a program like UND only has one Hobey winner and Harvard has 2 or 3...it is clear that you need to have an obvious choice (a la Hrkac) to have them get the award.

[TC_transplant]

Are the WCHA officials bribed to give extra assists to Sioux players?

The people who give assists are hired by the University of North Dakota...they are not hired by the league. Same as with every other school in the WCHA.

[The Sicatoka]

I don't see how anyone can claim "phantom assists" exist in any particular rink.

Why?

Rule 5, Section 8.b.

Both schools should participate in any changes involving scoring.

If there are "phantom assists" in a particular rink everyone (meaning all the opponents) have to be "in on it."

What this really is is a great hockey "urban legend" to toss out when you don't have anything real to "go negative" with.

[DamStrait]

The people who give assists are hired by the University of North Dakota...they are not hired by the league. Same as with every other school in the WCHA.

Hey Joe McShane, shouldn't you be surfing Pried Off Ice instead? If you love the yellow vermin so much, why come to this board where you're sure to see something you'll hate?

[PCM]

The people who give assists are hired by the University of North Dakota...they are not hired by the league. Same as with every other school in the WCHA.

Are you saying that the universities -- not the WCHA -- pay the referees? Because according to the NCAA rules, it's the referee who determines the goals and assists.

SECTION 3. The duties of the referee(s) are as follows:

e. Announce to the official scorer or penalty timekeeper all goals and assists legally scored...

It's clear from reading the rules that while there is some flexibility built in to help make certain that players are properly credited for goals and assists, they're also designed to minimize the possibility of cheating.

As has been pointed out, any changes made to the official scoring must be agreed to by representatives of both teams. In addition, the rules state that the official score sheet must checked and signed by the referee.

Furthermore, the video technology built into the new Engelstad Arena makes it one of the most difficult arenas in the league in which to hide cheating on scoring. Certainly it's a simple matter to check replays of the goals scored during the North Dakota-Minnesota series to see if there's anything to Woog's claim.

Unfortunately, as TC has already pointed out, "right or wrong," everybody knows this happens in Grand Forks. I'm sure that when TC and many other Gopher fans read Wong's comment about Panzer's phantom assists, they accepted it without question because "everybody knows" it happens at UND. Why let facts get in the way?

Here are the facts about Panzer's 2000-2001 season during which he scored 26 goals and had 55 assists for 81 points. Of those 55 assists, 33 (60%) were scored on the road. During that season, the Sioux played 46 games, 19 (41%) at home and 27 (59%) on the road. Obviously, Panzer received no special treatment or "phantom assists" while playing in Grand Forks.

And remember, that was the last season in the old Engelstand Arena where very few games were televised. It would have been much easier then to award "phantom assists" than it is now.

Edited November 12, 2003 by PCM

[sprig]

Wooger's was mostly a "phantom" comment, as the assists on the goal when he spoke were more than obvious. But then a fair amount of what he says are distorted by what one sees on the TV

He's funny in a bumbling sort of way, but it's obvious he's got it bad for the Sioux, probably a result of how well the Sioux did against the Gophs and in the nation when he was feeling the heat from Gopher fans just before he "quit".

[yellowdog]

Wooger's was mostly a "phantom" comment, as the assists on the goal when he spoke were more than obvious. But then a fair amount of what he says are distorted by what one sees on the TV

He's funny in a bumbling sort of way, but it's obvious he's got it bad for the Sioux, probably a result of how well the Sioux did against the Gophs and in the nation when he was feeling the heat from Gopher fans just before he "quit".

Woog was an idiot then and he is one now. I see no relevance to this discussion. The sioux do not make up assists to make their players look better. I can see some relevance to the hobey argument, but that shouldn't matter either. When comparing the sioux to the gophers, the gophs have more hobey's but the sioux have better pro players. I would trade the hobey for a good pro career anyday.

[7>4]

What, I agree with yellowdog? Somebody's wearing a parka in hell about now.

[Smoggy]

The hobey is a political battle between minny and whatever the east puts up. When I was in Albany watching the announcements, the BC (Gionta) and UND (Panzer) fans just turned to each other with a dumbfounded look. Ryan Miller!? Did he have a great GAA. Sure, but teams averaged less than 20 shots against him. The excuse we heard was that they didn't think another goalie would ever be up for the award. WHAT?!

The point is that many "western" voters don't vote Sioux. We all know that the east won't.

[schmidtdoggydog]

Wooger's was mostly a "phantom" comment, as the assists on the goal when he spoke were more than obvious. But then a fair amount of what he says are distorted by what one sees on the TV

I just watched the tape of last Friday's win over the Gophs and listened to Woog say that UND historically grants phantom assists and that only once this season (pre-Gophs) had the official scorers at UND given a single assist on a UND goal.

I then took a few moments and went through UND's boxscores from this season courtesy of USCHO. Through nine games played at UND this season (not counting Concordia), the Sioux have scored 43 goals. Of the 43 goals goals, 22 have been officially scored with a single assist. In other words, over 50% of UND's goals have resulted from a single assist.

With regard to the Gopher series, SIX of UND's 12 goals involved a single assist.

On the flipside, UND's opponents have scored 21 goals at REA this season. Of those, only seven resulted from a single assist. Of course a few were unassisted, but the majority were officially recorded with two assists.

What does all this mean, well it means that UND may very well grant phantom assists, but if this season is any indication, apparently the phantom assists are being granted to UND's OPPONENTS!!!

[PCM]

There ya go, using facts that are readily available to anyone who wants to do a bit of research. By doing that, you'll only make Woog and certain Gopher fans more confused.