UND-FB-FAN

The deal unequally benefits hockey, and UND is behind other regional universities because of it. UND athletics is basically a hockey club at this point - sad. But you’re right, they give lots of money, so they must be saints. Case closed … Ha ! Ha ! Ha! As for facts and figures, it’s not just me, so stop pointing the finger. quite obvious which sport is more popular in this country, and thus, the more obvious investment. Hockey vs football? Basketball vs hockey? Pretty easy answers when looking at the numbers. At least keep hockey on equal grounds with football, not unfairly advantaged year after year.

“Ralph Engelstad Arena, a $110 million gift from her father to the university, was completed in 2001 as the new home to UND hockey. The arena, contracted to be turned over to UND in 2030, was just one topic of many discussed in a wide-ranging interview between McGarry and Forum News Service. McGarry requested the meeting.” “According to her, Kennedy characterized the arrangement made between the university and her father, Ralph, as written to the benefit of the donor at the expense of UND.” “(He said) my dad made a bad deal when he first gave them this gift,” she said, a comment Kennedy said he doesn’t recall saying. The school eventually retired the Sioux name and logo at the behest of the NCAA and now officially uses the Fighting Hawks nickname for its athletic teams. But the Sioux logo still remains in the Ralph, embedded in marble floors, and on seats and other fixtures. Because of that, McGarry said, Kennedy has accused the family of “creating brand confusion” for the school, a charge she views as unfair. source: https://bismarcktribune.com/i-want-to-see-him-do-his-job-kris-engelstad-mcgarry-describes-hostile-relationship-with/article_35608880-d9e5-5293-b78c-231b98677ae8.html In 2018 and 2019, Engelstad spoke publicly about her strained relationship with Mark Kennedy, who at the time was UND's president. The Herald reported in 2019 that Engelstad said the foundation wouldn’t give direct funds to the university until Kennedy was no longer president, though it continued to support student scholarships and the hockey program. Kennedy left UND in May 2019. Source: https://www.grandforksherald.com/news/north-dakota/engelstad-foundation-crosses-500-million-in-giving-kris-engelstad-hopes-to-strengthen-relationship-with-und Kennedy was right. He knew what needed to be done to right the ship and help out football, and quite frankly make funding fair, but he was ousted due to public outcry, stirred up by Engelstad. When called out, though, they would still fund hockey, just nothing else, which is basically the current arrangement now that all is good again for the hockey moguls. You think the Engelstads walk on water too, I see. You’re easily convinced, but that’s no surprise. And I don’t find my desire to improve UND football hilarious, but thanks for posting your opinion, @siouxfan512. And as for numb comments by @jdub27, you think it’s a coincidence Kennedy left for Colorado in 2019? That’s the real hilarious piece in all of this. Ha! Ha! Ha! Why don’t you read up on some facts and get back to us. Thanks. Easily manipulated like the majority of GF was back in 2018-19 … shame, shame, shame.

agreed, but I think we all know how it went and what he would say … … money talks, and gf and the und community still think the Engelstads walk on water

Agreed, but recruiting is connected to, and made easier with, more support for UND football. We all are arguing for the same thing as UND football supporters, which is good, but we just all have a different opinions on how to go about it. We should be thankful complete and utter apathy has not sunken in … yet. As such, I’m just quite adamant that complacency and continuing to bolster hockey is not a solution anyway you spin it.

I agree with you. President Kennedy tried to address this but was ousted when the self-righteous Vegas hockey mogul cried to the press to allow for conviction by the court of public opinion. UND made a deal with the devil due to the dollars, and, as such, non-hockey sports have struggled ever since; particularly with the increased funding needed for DI excellence. Change is needed, and we as supporters and advocates for UND football need to push for it. Chaves is not getting it done as of now, he’s appeasing and not biting the hand that feeds him.

More personal critique, while skipping over the concerns that have been spelled out several times over. The philosophy - whether implicit or explicit - is to devote majority of time to hockey, conversely limiting the time spent on football. This is obvious in more signifiant scenarios like fundraising, football specific events like watch parties for away games, communication with alumni and Champions Club members to update on goals and inquire on more specific support, package deals for away game tickets or home game tickets, etc. to more smaller yet relevant items like subpar gameday experiences, misprinted/errors within gameday programs or delayed roster update, or lack of media coverage of UND football. Again, these issues are largely confronted as a byproduct of “UND is a hockey school”, but if that is the case, then don’t expect UND football to take the next step. We will be supporting (and donating) to a capped program that will forever live in mediocrity. There are ways - starting with philosophy, vision and effort, and ending with more funding, however - to elevate the program. Sitting on our collective asses and “giving it more time” is the last god damn thing that needs to be done. As for specifics on athletic department dynamics, those are questions to be asked to the athletic department leadership. I’m not the AD, I don’t know the specific structure and assignments because I do not work in the department, I just have observed some details and the subpar results for several years. Ultimately, don’t forget, the devil is in the details.

Time will tell … holy sh*t, unreal complacency is breeding the mediocrity we see; change never being imminent is one of the primary concerns, along with funding and focus. The same folks who run the athletic department and extend a 5-6 coach (career .500) are the ones who do not devote specific efforts toward marketing and fundraising for football. Department does absolutely overlook supporters that collectively could make a huge difference. @nodak651 with a short but true post demonstrating significance of 10k donors. These are absolute realisms. We as supporters need to realize it to start pushing the correct buttons moving forward for UND football to take the next step.

True. More funding, more effort by leadership (AD and his department) towards football, and expectation improvement. As mentioned before, UND doesn’t dare make a change at any leadership positions, including head coach, and it shows in terms of complacency and mediocrity.

I did. I have. Numerous times. Suspect you read on back. The direction and philosophy … again … is of concern. Some of ya’ll are broken, I swear, or on repeat for a ruse.

To quote the entire piece: ”Much of the staff is lazy, clueless, disinterested, when it comes to UND football. They do just enough to get by, not enough to ascend the program. That is not the case with hockey. Hockey is given more time, above and beyond. There are several champion club members (some of 10+ years) that are never contacted or communicated with. If they were appreciated, they would potentially donate more. Why aren’t they contacted? Laziness and/or lack of departmental philosophy/vision; hence those descriptors being used. These “small fish” are ignored just so administrators can make the same phone calls again and again to large donors only to be said no to on numerous occasions. You should be able to visualize the issue now, I hope. Recognize the FB supporters and search for more. ” “much of” certainly does not mean everybody, particularly the specific names that you provided. That is where the misplaced and misinterpreted comments came from. Implying that I am specifically calling out certain individuals is uncalled for. Also, departmental leadership and philosophy is at play here, so don’t hyper-focus on the work ethic piece.

Wow, incredibly twisted and misplaced. Misinterpret much? Again, when you push where it hurts, people start to get personal. Ridiculous, but reaffirms I’m on the right track.

No “just”, still a very important donor category. Back to task at hand, hoping to produce better results for football, with better backing, funding and prioritization, and in turn, produce more following for UND by actually competing with NDSU (not letting them walk all over UND). Focusing on hockey is the “easy button” - NDSU doesn’t even sponsor that.

so you’re aware, I’m not the president, athletic director, nor am I on the AA&F board. So unless you’re one of those folks, or you want to make a Ralph-sized donation, we’re stuck pending the masses voicing their desires collectively. Right now, there’s a ton of complacency so I don’t see that happening without stirring the fire a bit.

If that gift went to football in the late 90s, the entire dynamics of UND athletics (and honestly the entire university) would be completely different, and likely better. It’s not about hearing from me, it’s about moving the overall program and university forward. If all you’re gleaning from this is my dedication and principle belief in this, then you’re not carefully considering the concepts, rather just arguing.

I agree it’s our job. Glad you clarified that. Now, will positive change happen and will leaders lead or will the same ol’, same ‘ol continue as is.

That’s not the entirety of the staff. Not even close. From purely athletics standpoint, UND President and AD are starting points, with trickle down effect from there. From AA&F standpoint, a lot of influences beyond the mere 6 staff members you conveniently listed to fit your agenda.

So now it’s my job?? You apologists are laughable. Your heads must hurt from all the deflecting you do.

So the distribution of UNDAA&F development staff signifies all? That’s a random metric that falsely projects, or at the least doesn’t prove anything, and it certainly does not answer my questions. The athletic director would be where to start, since philosophy is just as important as number of work-hours put in, but I guarantee you’ll get a canned non-candid response. Hockey pays the bills, due to a Vegas gift, and therefore all other sports are second fiddle with a signifiant drop off.

Relatively speaking, a few golf outings is not enough. Not nearly enough.

I know little about Erick Paye, but he definitely was at UND FB camp with GFC, and thus staff decided to offer. He is raw for sure, but he has the measurables you can’t teach and he’s a local kid. An absolute must in terms of offering given the potential and the fact he’s a local student-athlete. Hope he commits to UND, and hope other programs don’t go sniffing around.

Start by asking what are the discrepancies in staff size when you consider staff dedicated to hockey vs FB? What are the hours per week dedicated to each? How many hours are spent organizing football alumni / CC member functions and events around the states of ND and MN? Are CC members even attempted to be contacted to inquire on interest in donating to specific football projects? These are basic questions I’ve already posted. Compare and contrast budgets of hockey and football; any potential change to either upcoming? Any potential changes to leadership for CC, AA, or other staff positions? You’ll quickly find out the administration either doesn’t want to answer those questions (perceived interrogation), or, they simply will reveal to you how little they care about football. Both likely replies are beyond disappointing and are futile within the overall landscape of collegiate athletics. There’s plenty of time to be proactive this time of the year, hence the assumption of laziness. But again, philosophy also plays a role.

What a bunch of misdirection malarkey. None of what you said acknowledged the real issues I discerned with UND athletics and UND FB. I can provide my credentials, but on this forum, there is absolutely no requirement for me to do so. UND football and the UND athletic administration are failing. Something needs to be done. I’ve outlined several potential solutions over the past couple days on here. I obviously could waste more of my time trying to change the current administration’s mind, but they’re set in their ineffective ways, so it seems. And may not all be due to laziness, because the overall philosophy (as outlined previously) is something I don’t agree with. You could do something about it, as well, since you’re apparently so well connected with- presumably- pristine credentials. I, however, will have the decency to abstain from probing on such meaningless information within this medium.

Already stated numerous times within the past couple days.

Did you not just say that we need to take action into our own hands? But now this is a waste of time? Apparently both you and the University of North Dakota athletic administration thinks this is a waste of time, and the lack of results shows. At least your vision is consistent with that of the universities, but they’re both inferior.

1. Ignoring NDSU is a foolish approach, in my opinion. Keep your friends close, your enemies closer. Not to mention NDSU is the gold standard for all of FCS football right now, never mind the regional implications for UND. 2. Much of the staff is lazy, clueless, disinterested, when it comes to UND football. They do just enough to get by, not enough to ascend the program. That is not the case with hockey. Hockey is given more time, above and beyond. There are several champion club members (some of 10+ years) that are never contacted or communicated with. If they were appreciated, they would potentially donate more. Why aren’t they contacted? Laziness and/or lack of departmental philosophy/vision; hence those descriptors being used. These “small fish” are ignored just so administrators can make the same phone calls again and again to large donors only to be said no to on numerous occasions. You should be able to visualize the issue now, I hope. Recognize the FB supporters and search for more. 3. Hockey is indirectly the problem. Sure, hockey “is where it should be”, but it is over-allocated on resources and time. There is only a finite amount of time and resources, which I’m sure you know, and football gets slighted due to the degree of emphasis on hockey. It’s just the reality. Good luck raising UND football to the next level with the current degree of hockey emphasis - it just won’t happen. What are the discrepancies in staff size when you consider staff dedicated to hockey vs FB? What are the hours per week dedicated to each? We all know they aren’t equal or even close to equal. That is a part of the issue. 4. Want names? Get a copy of current champions club members. Look at the members that have season tickets for FB. Some of these folks may not have current investment in UND’s beloved over-hyped sport of hockey; are they thus being purposely overlooked when it comes to outreach? There are several FB only donors that are not reached out to. It’s apart of the failure of the Champions Club and Alumni Association, as well as the exemplification of the failed philosophy of Chaves’ department. Bottomline, all non-hockey sports are and have been treated like a red-headed step-child and it shows on the field and courts. But, but, but … there’s always ice ….