Bison06

Saying Indiana state is a playoff caliber team, was a bit much I agree. Much improved from previous year we'll say.

Fine, I'll play along. I say that Montana has dominated the conference and now they are down this year, making them easier to beat. UNI isn't down this year based on the team I have watched. Yes they have a poor record, but I hope we can agree that is due to the tough schedule. Especially if you actually watched those games instead of just looking at the box score.

Anyone who follows FCS football knows Illinois State got screwed out of a playoff spot last year. Again, what does this have to do with my comment that the Big Sky is down?

13 teams vs. 10 teams. Doesn't take an MIT grad to figure that one out.

Quote my post where I said that.

Shows your ignorance about the MVFC these past few years. I also find it humorous that I didn't make one reference to NDSU, the MVFC or the MVFC being better than the Big Sky. Only that the Big Sky is down this year. And instead of trying to explain why the Big Sky isn't down you guys chose the very weak argument of attacking NDSU's conference, when that has nothing to do with the conversation.

Don't try and pigeonhole what I've said into fitting your argument. I didn't say this logic applies to all conferences everywhere, all conferences are different. Historically Montana is the only consistent playoff contender from the Big Sky. There isn't another conference anywhere that has been dominated the way Montana has dominated the Big Sky. They are without a doubt the class of the conference and nobody even comes close to them. The MVFC is very different, especially in the past few years. Illinois State is a playoff caliber team, Indiana State as well. UNI is a damn good team with a crappy record because they have played an extremely difficult schedule. YSU also looks to be making a resurgence these past few years. I know you guys are mad because it is a Bison fan pointing it out. But have a look over at AGS, I am not the only one who feels the Big Sky is down this year. Everyone, including Montana and Montana State fans are talking about it.

I'll save you the trouble of waiting until the season is over. If Montana is "down" the Big Sky is "down" and Montana is "down" in a big way right now.

I agree, this is definitely a game that I am interested in. UNI has certainly had our number since moving into the MVFC with our only win coming at home last year. They are used to being top dog in the MVFC and I am not sure that playing NDSU scares them much at this point. If we beat them a few more times in a row, NDSU will start to be a team they won't want to see on the schedule, but we aren't there yet. I don't think NDSU is in a situation where they will overlook UNI though. This has become a fierce rivalry very quickly and there is absolutely no love lost between these two squads. Even the coaches don't get along. This is a game I have been excited about all summer.

All fair points, however, I would like to use hyperbole to make the point that strength of schedule has to play a role in ranking teams. Can you honestly say that you would regard a 1 point overtime loss to Alabama the same as you would regard a blowout loss to a non-scholarship NAIA squad when determining if a team deserves to be ranked or not? All other things being equal. After all they are both losses.

What is your obsession with bisonville? I don't speak for all Bison fans or anything that is said over there. If you want to make a comment in general on the thread like this fine, but don't quote my post and then reference things I have never said and in fact things I have explicitly stated I don't buy into (ie moral victories). All I have said is SOS plays a role in ranking teams as well as it should. Did you take more pride in the close loss to SDSU this year or your close loss to USF a few years back? Don't say you took equal pride in them because they were both losses. Regardless of what other Bison fans have said regarding moral victories, there is nothing wrong with a fan taking more pride in playing well against a quality opponent. It doesn't equal a victory, but it doesn't mean you can't take positive things away from a close loss to a good team.

I agree, the only explanation I can come up with is as of right now is they are being rewarded for two things in the eyes of the voters. Not me, the voters. Strength of schedule /level of play during those difficult games and the good will that a decent playoff run and a history of being a powerhouse brings with it. Beyond that I don't see any justifcation for putting UNI in the top 20. Looking at some of the teams in the low 20's though, I personally would still rank them ahead of them. But, I also watched the two FBS games they played and am basing my opinion on how they played in those games, not on the outcome of the game.

What are you basing this opinion on? Seems like an odd thing to say.

It will all work itself out in the wash. I honestly don't understand the emphasis people are putting on the rankings in week 3? A large portion of people vote in the first half of the season based on the past season as well unfortunately. No doubt UNI is enjoying the good will they built for themselves at the end of last season right now. Ultimately the only time that rankings matter is come playoff time. Is NDSU really the #1 team in the country right now? Who the hell knows we haven't beaten anyone in the FCS worth a damn yet. Nobody has earned their ranking in week 3 or week 4 I guess it would be. There just isn't a large enough sample size to make good decisions so people are voting with last season in mind.

I think UND should be ranked, but 12 seems a bit high at this point IMO. I would say 21-23 sounds right.

What rhetoric? I am speaking in generalities. I too don't think UNI should be ranked in the top 15, top 25 still, but probably not top 15. All I have said is SOS needs to be a consideration when ranking teams and come playoff time. Anything else that you concluded from my posts in simply you projecting your own preconceived notions onto them. For the record, I would argue the same thing for any other team who had run the gammut that UNI has these past 3 weeks. Also, let's not do the thing where we pretend that since they are a poor FBS team that it isn't a quality game or a quality win if you pull off the win. As UND fans can attest to, regardless of how "good" an FBS team is, it is quite the accomplishment to win those games.

So strength of schedule doesn't play into a discussion about playoffs, or rankings? It's interesting that to be a playoff counter that they must be a D-I team if strength of schedule doesn't play into the playoff committee's decision. Moral victories don't count, I never said they did. But let's not pretend 1-3 equals 1-3 regardless of who you play in the minds of the poll voters. Also, why so defensive man? I never said anything about UND. Would you be more impressed with a 4-0 UND team who played USF, Drake, SD Mines and PVAM. Or a 2-2 team, with one of those victories against San Diego State?

There is a difference between a fanbase taking pride in a "moral victory" and pollsters taking into account strength of schedule when determining where a team should be ranked.

Agreed, I know polls are based on an entire body of work, but in that same vein, how in the hell can a coach justify putting a 1-2 SHSU above a 3-1 Central Arkansas team that just beat them. I swear some coaches don't even look at who is winning these games. That's crap.

It's not a theory homer, GT has openly stated that is his goal. I am not privy to the information that lead him to stray from that formula in those years. Also, if NDSU ends up 7-4 either of those years and is left out of the playoffs, there will be a lot of second guessing about getting away from the way things are currently done.

They have only played one FCS game and it happened to be against a pretty good team. You are right that they likely won't make the playoffs, but IMO it is because their strength of schedule was ridiculous to try and get the athletic department out of some financial woes. Yet another example that makes the case for having too difficult of a schedule isn't a good thing.

Fair enough, SD Mines was a poor example because they are not a DI counter. But plug in some other DI team of equal talent from the east coast and you will see them on UND's schedule in the near future. My point is that football scheduling is not a contest to see who can have the hardest schedule year in and year out. In fact, in the FCS the team with the hardest schedule rarely makes the playoffs. I realize it was likely done for financial reason, but look at UNI this year. If they don't have the most difficult schedule in FCS it has to be pretty close to it. They might be eliminated from the playoffs after next weekend. How do you think the fanbase is going to respond to that? Scheduling is a balance between challenging games and giving yourself an opportunity to make the postseason and add revenue to the athletic department. Adding another high quality opponent on a consistent basis is not in the cards for NDSU due to the difficulty of the conference schedule.

Again, scared isn't the right word. If it makes you feel better to think NDSU is scared of UND go right ahead. In reality it is prudent scheduling with the ultimate goal of making the playoffs in mind. As I have said many times and it has beaten to death, our conference schedule already has us playing 3-5 ranked teams per year. UND will most likely become a team that is ranked in the top 25 year in and year out. With the strength of schedule we already have in place, why would NDSU add another high quality opponent, whether it is UND or someone else? Every team on the freaking planet schedules this way, hell UND schedules this way. Why do you think South Dakota Mines was on the schedule this year? Its good to have 1-2 easier games to prepare yourself for the difficult conference schedule. Looking at it from the state's perspective and revenue, why would the state want UND and NDSU to meet in the regular season each year with the possiblity of eliminating one or the other from the playoffs? It would be better for the state if both NDSU and UND made the playoffs and were able to both host home games.

You referenced the NCC, but you implied that to use possible playoff implications as a reason to not play the game today doesn't hold water because they used to play every year when playoffs were just as much on the line then as now. What you failed to point out was the major difference between then and now, UND and NDSU were forced to play due to the conference schedule. Thanks for your concern about my reading comprehension.