How sad are the Twins

[soohockey15]

I'm glad you were in the clubhouse on a daily basis to find this leadership out. With Hunter beginning this season at 33 yrs of age, he will continue to lose that "step" in center. He has an above average arm but has never been accurate which, aside from Shannon Stewart (see super soaker for his arm strength), means just as much.

Yes, he was the face of the franchise but baseball is a business and you DO NOT pay an aging center-fielder that much money for five years and consider it a good business decision. It's a promise that the Angels will be shocked when Hunter resorts back to his career .270 avg. with 20 hr's a year.

I agree that they will lose a good guy and a good player, but at this point in his career resigning him would've been bad business. The front office guys have been running the franchise the same way for the last fifteen years (developing talent then trading for young guys), and Hunter is not going to do anything to change that.

[siouxkid12]

I'm glad you were in the clubhouse on a daily basis to find this leadership out. With Hunter beginning this season at 33 yrs of age, he will continue to lose that "step" in center. He has an above average arm but has never been accurate which, aside from Shannon Stewart (see super soaker for his arm strength), means just as much.

Yes, he was the face of the franchise but baseball is a business and you DO NOT pay an aging center-fielder that much money for five years and consider it a good business decision. It's a promise that the Angels will be shocked when Hunter resorts back to his career .270 avg. with 20 hr's a year.

I agree that they will lose a good guy and a good player, but at this point in his career resigning him would've been bad business. The front office guys have been running the franchise the same way for the last fifteen years (developing talent then trading for young guys), and Hunter is not going to do anything to change that.

His leadership was very well known, you didnt need to be in clubhouse to know...plus I know the equipment manager for the twins and i also have met Torii and had a few drinks with him and Matt Brunson (9th overall draft pick, 2nd infielder taken after A-Rod, drafted same year as Torii Hunter), so I do know what his personality is like. I am not arguing the fact that they should've kept him, I agree with his age and the long contract he wanted it would've been stupid for the Twins to succumb to his demands. There are other outfielders that can take over CF just as good and are younger. That is the Twins motto...give younger players a chance.

I have heard some rumors that Erstad might be in a Twins Uniform next year, hopefully this isnt true because it would be a big mistake just like R. White was!

[soohockey15]

Erstad is awful, I'll puke if he signs with the Twins. He would, however, fit right into their lineup. Can't hit, can't hit for power, and can't get on base, just like four other guys.

[soohockey15]

Nothing is official yet, but this is just what I suspected. A young arm for a good, young hitter.

Twins, Rays looking to deal.

[siouxkid12]

Nothing is official yet, but this is just what I suspected. A young arm for a good, young hitter.

Twins, Rays looking to deal.

its a dead link

[siouxkid12]

its a dead link

IDK if this is the same deal you are talking about but the trade involves...Matt Garza, Jason Bartlett, and Juan Rincon to the Rays for Delmon Young, Brendan Harris, and Jason Pridie.

[soohockey15]

Weird, I just went back to it and it says "Service Unavailable." Anyway, it was Matt Garza for Delmon Young.

Twins, Rays looking to trade

Star Tribune Link

Neither work, maybe I just suck at posting links. Been reported as Garza for Young, could possibly include more players. More analysis coming as the story develops.

Check out ESPN.com or La Velle Neal's blog on the Star Trib. site for further information.

[Goon]

Weird, I just went back to it and it says "Service Unavailable." Anyway, it was Matt Garza for Delmon Young.

Maybe this works

Star Tribune Link

Neither work, maybe I just suck at posting links. Been reported as Garza for Young, could possibly include more players. More analysis coming as the story develops.

Check out ESPN.com or La Velle Neal's blog on the Star Trib. site for further information.

Neither work but if it is true it will come out in the news...

[soohockey15]

Neither work but if it is true it will come out in the news...

I think both of those guys qualify as the news, if that's what you're saying. Nothing is official yet, but both teams are close.

[82SiouxGuy]

You need to learn how to link. This is La Velle E. Neal's Twins Insider Blog. And this from the Pioneer Press says that the deal isn't done yet.

[soohockey15]

The deal is done! Twins, Rays complete 6 player deal I like it from the Twins standpoint, upgrade over Bartlett and get a very promising young player in Delmon Young. Both teams get what they need.

[82SiouxGuy]

The deal is done! Twins, Rays complete 6 player deal I like it from the Twins standpoint, upgrade over Bartlett and get a very promising young player in Delmon Young. Both teams get what they need.

Congrats on the link. You're right, this is a very good trade for both sides. The Twins now have a pretty solid middle of the line-up.

[soohockey15]

Congrats on the link. You're right, this is a very good trade for both sides. The Twins now have a pretty solid middle of the line-up.

Sssssssssssssssank you...should be a solid middle, right now I think it could go Mauer-Young-Morneau-Cuddyer-Kubel. With this move, the Twins have three of the best young hitters in baseball.

They probably got the short end of the shortstop swap, however. Harris is a better hitter, but Bartlett's defense overshadows the advantage Harris has on offense. I would say Harris is in line for a move to second base when all is said and done.

[siouxkid12]

Sssssssssssssssank you...should be a solid middle, right now I think it could go Mauer-Young-Morneau-Cuddyer-Kubel. With this move, the Twins have three of the best young hitters in baseball.

They probably got the short end of the shortstop swap, however. Harris is a better hitter, but Bartlett's defense overshadows the advantage Harris has on offense. I would say Harris is in line for a move to second base when all is said and done.

You wouldnt put Mauer as your leadoff guy would you? I would put him at maybe a 3 spot in the line-up with some speed at the 1-2 spot then work your way down with mauer, young, morneau, cuddyer, kubel, however you want them guys.

[siouxkid12]

So still some rumors about Santana going to the Red Sox, I dont know who all the players would be but one name keeps popping up is Coco Crisp. With the new addition of Young to the Twins would it be stupid for the Twins to add Crisp? What about adding a new 2nd baseman and move casilla over to SS?

[soohockey15]

The rumored deal is Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Bowden or Masterson.

This actually wouldn't be a bad deal. Although I'd would much rather have Ellsbury and Bucholz, the Sox probably aren't going to give either of them up (Bucholz the more likely of the two).

The Twins would also get Jed Lowrie, who can play short but is still a downgrade from Bartlett, but will probably need to move due to his below average range and inaccurate arm. A good switch hitter, he won't hit many homers and has decent gap power. He works the count well and takes his walks. Prototypical 2 hitter.

Lester will be a good #2 starter, but he won't be as good as Bucholz long-term. There probably will be a void at the top of the rotation until Liriano can regain his former stuff.

Crisp probably has more range than any centerfielder in baseball, but he's a well below average hitter who doesn't take any walks, therefore can't hit leadoff.

Masterson is probably a tick better than Bowden, but both of those guys will be solid bullpen guys who will be able to step in somewhere in the middle of the year (Masterson before Bowden).

This is probably the best offer they'll get, unless Anaheim offers a package or the Yanks offer Cano.

[CDog]

I really hope they aren't considering adding Crisp. Very weak, slap hitter.

[soohockey15]

I really hope they aren't considering adding Crisp. Very weak, slap hitter.

A weak, slap hitter? He'd fit right in there with Punto, Tyner and Casilla!

[siouxkid12]

A weak, slap hitter? He'd fit right in there with Punto, Tyner and Casilla!

weak slap hitter? i dont care what anyone says, as long as you get on base and let your big hitters get you home i am happy with that. You would think though with Santanas track record and age the Twins could command a little bit more out of a team, thats my opinion.

[soohockey15]

weak slap hitter? i dont care what anyone says, as long as you get on base and let your big hitters get you home i am happy with that. You would think though with Santanas track record and age the Twins could command a little bit more out of a team, thats my opinion.

The career OBPs of Crisp, Punto, Tyner, and Casilla - .329, .314, .314, .263. League average OBP is about .340-.350 varying on the year, and the lowest OBP of any qualified leadoff hitter was Rafael Furcal at .338. None of those guys get on base.

Regarding Santana and his value, you have to consider that Haren, Blanton, and Bedard are on the market with more years on their contract as well as cheaper. Haren and Bedard give you about 90% of the production that Johan gives you for less money and more years. Sounds like common sense to not sell the farm for Johan.

[siouxkid12]

According to Ken Rosenthal the Twins are currently shopping Joe Nathan and the Astros look to be the leading contenders, do the Astros have talent to land Nathan? diffently not major league ready talent but the Twins wouldnt need major league talent right away because they already have a closer (Neshek). I know the Twins scouts are really good at finding talent at the single A and AA levels but do the Astros want to give up that much talent for a closer when they are probably a few years away from contending again and by the time they contend Nathan will be older!

[The Sicatoka]

No Hunter; no Santana; no Nathan.

I swear I've seen this movie before. I think it starred Tom Berenger, Charlie Sheen, and Corbin Bernsen. And I seem to recall Rene Russo and Wesley Snipes.

[siouxkid12]

No Hunter; no Santana; no Nathan.

I swear I've seen this movie before. I think it starred Tom Berenger, Charlie Sheen, and Corbin Bernsen. And I seem to recall Rene Russo and Wesley Snipes.

well so far only 1 of the 3 are gone but in the movie you are speaking of they went on to the playoffs!

[soohockey15]

No Hunter; no Santana; no Nathan.

I swear I've seen this movie before. I think it starred Tom Berenger, Charlie Sheen, and Corbin Bernsen. And I seem to recall Rene Russo and Wesley Snipes.

Yeah, they're just giving these guys away, not getting any value for them. By letting Hunter sign with the Angels, the Twins now have two first round draft picks, and the first pick after the first round (sandwich pick). If Santana and Nathan are traded, the Twins will get back four to five players who will have very inexpensive contracts and very high upside. The Twins can keep the guys they have this year and try to make a run in an extremely difficult division, or have a little downswing and be very good in two years, and three years when the new stadium opens. I'll take option B.

[Smoggy]

I'd hold onto Nathan until the trade deadline. Teams always are looking for closers at that time.

Hunter was my favorite Twin and I wish he wasn't asking for so much. I don't think he's worth what he got.

Santana voiced his displeasure with the organization last year. He didn't have a great year. IF he gets traded the Twins must get a major league ready player or two. Third base and starting pitching being the obvious.