The Dakota Student gets it exactly right

[LeftyZL]

I'm getting really tired of having to stand up & let people in & out of my row, while the puck is in play

Need more & better ushers / security & trust me this is where this is headed

Some of the ushers at REA have NO IDEA what is going on at the hockey game, let alone that there is actually hockey game going on. It seems to me that some of the employee's at REA are just there because they are getting paid to watch a hockey game from a good spot in the arena. That bothers me mostly because it's not that hard to stop people from walking down the aisle's when the puck is in play. I can see why it bothers customer's that pay money to watch a game. It's a common courtesy at athletic contests to wait until the play is dead. Some people(mainly the not sober one's) act like they've never been told to stop at the top and wait til the play is dead. The only suggestion I have for you is to find an usher that's running around(usually has a radio...aka...they are the important people) and report a complaint about the usher in your section.

The last point you made, about better/more ushers and security....I guess I don't really know how much more security or how many more ushers REA needs around the building. Once again, I agree with you about the quality of some of the ushers and/or security people working the game. When I am working, I often find security hanging around the arena, almost waiting for a call on their radios about a disorderly fan in the arena. Then they go to work. But they don't seem to go out of their way to find a disorderly fan, they wait for another fan to report it to an usher who then goes and finds a security officer. That's a bad system to follow if you ask me. To me, it just doesn't make sense to implement more worker's into the building, maybe just substitute the bad one's with quality worker's. Feel free to offer any suggestions/complaints on what to change at REA. I will definitely make note of any suggestions.

[redwing77]

Several comments some already stated by others:

1. The DS article comes across as adversarial to me. No one has ever succeeded in something of this kind of thing (relatively minor (if at all) compared to Gandhi or King). We don't have the leverage and we don't have the public support either. Work WITH the AD, not AGAINST him. In emails I've been corresponding with him (slowly but surely) and he's said that moving the student section is a definite possibility. So he's listening.

2. Math classes are good. He should take them sometime

3. LeftZL is right about the usher quality. Most could care less because these are people coming in and leaving that pay the "big bucks" and they don't want to upset them, even if it is supporting the rules. As for security, most of the security are placed around the student section. Debate if that's a good or a bad thing however you wish, but with all the security around the students, shouldn't they be able to do something? And, even if they are, what about the rest of the arena?

[Siouxdonyms]

...the perception here is that North Dakota is the toughest place to play period. The Fighting Sioux are are spoken of with the greatest respect and have an awe and mystique about them that can't be bought.

I like this. Don't know if it's true for everyone out east, but I like it. Read through most of the posts, but not all thoroughly, so forgive me if this has been brought up, but does the 9% going to the Athletic Department go to all UND sports, or all to UND hockey? If it goes to all sports, why would students deserve 9% of the REA or the lower bowl, or whatever that argument was. Personally, I do think the students deserve to be treated with more respect than what they're getting, however, I'm just becoming annoyed with some of the responses I read on this thread.

[BIGSIOUX]

I like this. Don't know if it's true for everyone out east, but I like it. Read through most of the posts, but not all thoroughly, so forgive me if this has been brought up, but does the 9% going to the Athletic Department go to all UND sports, or all to UND hockey? If it goes to all sports, why would students deserve 9% of the REA or the lower bowl, or whatever that argument was. Personally, I do think the students deserve to be treated with more respect than what they're getting, however, I'm just becoming annoyed with some of the responses I read on this thread.

i will agree with what you said, i pointed out that the students arent even getting a fair shake on this board but i think some of it is due to a few students unrealistic line of thought.

See how that works?

I can see both sides of the debate....and dont jump to the "swearing and standing thing" i dont think that is any question, its the respect issue im talking about.

[hockey10]

I thought the student section was fine again last night. My only problem with the whole game was 2:18 left 2:00 power play, 2-1 game...seems like the perfect time to get the whole arena standing and supporting the team. The students section barely was cheering. The general public was sitting and watching. Some got into it towards the last 30 seconds, but this was a time the whole arena should have been giving our power play team a boost. (Maybe Oshie wouldnt have heard his teammate calling for the puck and would have shot it and tied it )

[82SiouxGuy]

I had the same thoughts. It seemed like everyone, including the students should have been more into the last couple of minutes of the game.

[hockey10]

I thought everyone seemed to be a lot more into it during the few seconds of overtime. So maybe it just doesnt matter how loud the crowd is....we still lost! That elephant thing they put on didnt do much to get the crowd up and cheering, anyone know the intention of that?

[#1 Sioux Fan]

I still say again ! Take out the Bar on that end & construct a Standing Bleacher section - Both Bars are way over rated & too expensive & a waste of space

& put a Lienies Kiosk that sells Creamy Dark on that end in the upper level

Or reconstruct the the area they are in now & take out the 3 or 4 private boxes & make that area more regular seating - Sure it will cost the Ralph some Bucks - But it would affect a lot less people - I wonder how many more seats it would add to convert that space to regular seating ? - Maybe then convert the Bars to private boxes ?

I love how people feel that if they don't agree with something put something there that they like?? Bar seating draws big bucks, roughly 1000 a seat plus a donation to the Fighting Sioux Club. As far as drink prices, I attend the bar about ever other game and would say that the prices are not that outragous and find it hard to find a place to stand cause there are so many people! I would say leave the bars - I need the mix drinks to deal with the season the Sioux are having- move the students to the corners or ends and get this bickering over with. Everyone that is in the Ralph's lower level is a true fan, whether they scream their head off at games or pay for the scholarships that put the players on the ice, everyone has their part.

[puck swami]

This battle you are describing is happening in college arenas all over the country, not just UND, and it's about more than just who stands, who curses, who drinks and who complains.

What we are seeing here is the by-product of the ever-increasing arms race in college sports, where what was once a simple game in a simple barn played largely for students is now a complicated community event, played in a multi-million dollar sports arena that must be fed by more and more upscale dollars to fill, maintain and make a profit.

As such, administrations are under heavy pressure to keep the balance, and increasingly, they are buckling to those who write the bigger checks. In most places, it's the students who will be squeezed, since they don't have the same financial power. Follow the money, folks. Your six first round draft picks are there becuase they play in a $125 million palace, and that palace is funded (post-Ralph) by full-paying customers, not students on a discount.

That said, the University also benefits from the home ice advantage, and they should be cultivating an atmosphere that encourages student support, including their right to stand and cheer whenever they want. Anybody who buys a ticket should know that they are coming to a hockey game and not a church service, and that as long as a fan isn't drunk, profane, racist, sexist or otherwise threatening, they should be allowed to behave as they wish.

There is a middle gound out there, we just haven't found it yet.

[PCM]

There is a middle gound out there, we just haven't found it yet.

I reject the notion that the students at REA are somehow getting the short end of the stick because they're not allowed to stand for the entire game and engage in profane cheering.

UND students were given prime seating in the arena because they asked for it. They also pay a fraction of the cost to attend games that everyone else pays. Those aren't insignificant benefits.

Nobody I know objects to where the students sit or to their student discount. Nobody I know wants fewer students at the games or expects them to make less noise.

The students are merely being asked to adhere to minimal standards of socially acceptable public behavior, the same standards that apply to everyone in the arena. In exhange for what the students are getting, it's not an unreasonable request. We shouldn't have to bribe students to get them to act civilised any more than I should expect a bribe to remain quiet in a library.

[Diggler]

We shouldn't have to bribe students to get them to act civilised any more than I should expect a bribe to remain quiet in a library.

We also shouldn't have to bribe the general public to get them to act alive, but it's looking like REA might have to.

[Fetch]

What a Crock - Just cause we don't act like students - Give me a break

Sit down & watch the Game & chant or Bang a Gong or what ever turns your Crank - Just leave the rest of us real hockey fans alone

[southpaw]

What a Crock - Just cause we don't act like students - Give me a break

Sit down & watch the Game & chant or Bang a Gong or what ever turns your Crank - Just leave the rest of us real hockey fans alone

Just like the select few students who feel they are entitled to the world... this type of attitude is just as non-productive. it's this attitude that makes the students feel like they're back in 3rd grade being told what to do by their parents and teachers. just because you're old enough to have watched hockey for 50 years doesn't mean that you are any more of a hockey fan the me, who has watched and played some form of hockey for all but the first 3 years of my life.

PCM, I want you to realize something, hopefully this will help. You should take the standing problem and the swearing problem and separate them. to me, standing is a cheering issue, swearing is an appropriateness issue. i know there have been some bad apples who willingly throw f-bombs left and right, but it's not just students. anyone in their right mind knows that students dont have a right to swear. obviously, you can't expect no swearing period, because there are just some people, students and public, who feel the need to swear. it's the organized chants that need to stop. agree with that whole heartedly.

Now, to the standing issue. My first year of college was the last year in the Old Ralph. I "sat" in the same seats for every game, I was there at least four hours before every game standing in line to get those seats. Part of cheering for me, was standing and pounding on the glass. At high school games prior to college, I would stand with all of the other students and cheer. So obviously, those first couple years in the new ralph, it was tough to swallow the "sit down" pill. It's still natural for me to stand up when something exciting starts to happen. It's natural that you cheer louder when you're standing. The number of students who were used to standing in the last years of the old ralph and the first couple years of the new ralph is diminishing... but there are still a lot of people, like myself (i'm out of college, but still make it up for about half of the games) who stand up to cheer or see exciting things.

I don't think i have a "right" to stand, but I think any reasonable person who goes to a hockey game, whether they pay $70 for season tickets or $1,000, should expect people around them to stand and cheer. Not throughout the game, but during exciting times. With three minutes left in a one goal game, I'd like to think most of the arena would be standing and cheering their heads off. That's not the case. If you ask me, that's an appropriate time to stand and cheer, but if you ask the average person in sections 107 and 110, I bet they say it's not. Thats the big difference, is that for some people it's appropriate, for others it's not. Who is to decide what's appropriate? Just because I paid less for my ticket, does that mean I can't stand and cheer for my team? Again, it's not because I'm standing because I have a "right," it's because I'm standing to cheer on my team during a tense part of the game.

Sorry, it got so long, but that's the difference between the swearing and the standing problems and why you can't just lump them together. The occasional f-bomb will slip out, but cheers with swearing shouldn't be tolerated. Standing for the entire game shouldn't be tolerated, but I think the students should have a little lee-way with when they get to stand.

[Fetch]

Maybe when you were in H.S. a Mosh pit was great fun - But you have to learn to grow up - This is not a Punk Rock Concert, it is a Hockey Game - Where real Fans want to see all the action all the time

[SiouxTupa]

Just like the select few students who feel they are entitled to the world... this type of attitude is just as non-productive. it's this attitude that makes the students feel like they're back in 3rd grade being told what to do by their parents and teachers. just because you're old enough to have watched hockey for 50 years doesn't mean that you are any more of a hockey fan the me, who has watched and played some form of hockey for all but the first 3 years of my life.

BULLSEYE

[Fetch]

Quit acting like your still in Grade School

[SiouxTupa]

Aside from being a tad defensive, what part of Mory's response sounds like he's in grade school?? Maybe I did when I said bullseye, but I think he was pretty fair in his response, so I agree with it.

I think what he said is accurate. Just because some people don't want to stand at all, does that mean that nobody should stand at all to risk blocking someone's view?

I completely agree with Mory that swearing and standing are two very separate issues. Some appropriate standing should be tolerated, while most swearing (especially group oriented) should not.

It has to do with being respectful in this debate. It's going to be a compromise, and snide comments from either side are very counterproductive.

[PCM]

We also shouldn't have to bribe the general public to get them to act alive, but it's looking like REA might have to.

Once again, you are connecting two issues that aren't connected.

[Diggler]

No, I'm not. They are two seperate issues, but it would be nice if both could be solved. Also sorry for trying to have fun with this issue, I realize it is life and death for some.

[PCM]

PCM, I want you to realize something, hopefully this will help. You should take the standing problem and the swearing problem and separate them.

I agree.

it's the organized chants that need to stop. agree with that whole heartedly.

We are in total agreement on the swearing issue. I know that there's no practical way to stop random swear words from popping out of peoples' mouths at hockey games. It's the organized cheers that are way out of line.

I don't think i have a "right" to stand, but I think any reasonable person who goes to a hockey game, whether they pay $70 for season tickets or $1,000, should expect people around them to stand and cheer. Not throughout the game, but during exciting times.

Right. Heck, when I go to Sioux football games, I stand and make as much noise as I can when it's third down for the opposition. I stand and cheer for crucial situation. I stand and cheer for exciting plays. I've cheered myself hoarse for more Sioux football games than I can remember.

So we're in full agreement that there are times when it's appropriate to stand up and cheer. But standing just for the sake of standing isn't going to fly because the Ralph, unfortunately, wasn't built for it.

I suspect that most non-students who go to Sioux hockey games will stand at the appropriate times. Those who don't want to can't reasonably complain because that's what naturally happens during sporting events. People stand up when something exciting happens or there's a crucial situation on the ice. As far as I know, neither Tom Buning nor the REA are telling students that they can never stand.

[dropTHEgloves]

Maybe when you were in H.S. a Mosh pit was great fun - But you have to learn to grow up - This is not a Punk Rock Concert, it is a Hockey Game - Where real Fans want to see all the action all the time

So what is wrong with watching a great hockey game while showing a little pride in your team and cheering for them? A loud atmosphere helps out the home team and gets in the road teams head. I dont think anyone at Duke University is telling the students to be quiet and not to stand. I also like to watch the hockey game but believe with 3 minutes left in a one goal game that I should be able to stand up and would hope that the rest of the arena would follow.

[bigsioux21]

I reject the notion that the students at REA are somehow getting the short end of the stick because they're not allowed to stand for the entire game and engage in profane cheering.

UND students were given prime seating in the arena because they asked for it. They also pay a fraction of the cost to attend games that everyone else pays. Those aren't insignificant benefits.

Nobody I know objects to where the students sit or to their student discount. Nobody I know wants fewer students at the games or expects them to make less noise.

The students are merely being asked to adhere to minimal standards of socially acceptable public behavior, the same standards that apply to everyone in the arena. In exhange for what the students are getting, it's not an unreasonable request. We shouldn't have to bribe students to get them to act civilised any more than I should expect a bribe to remain quiet in a library.

Students pay less because they are the STUDENTS OF THE UNIVERSITY OF NORTH DAKOTA not some random person that lives in Grand Forks and pays money for season tickets/single game tickets!!!

[PCM]

Students pay less because they are the STUDENTS OF THE UNIVERSITY OF NORTH DAKOTA not some random person that lives in Grand Forks and pays money for season tickets/single game tickets!!!

Thanks for clearing that up! I really appreciate it!

[Pluckem]

You guys on here need to learn to let everything Fetch says go in one ear and out the other. There is no middle ground with him. He has been banned from so many forums he had to start his own so he could say what he wanted without the mods kicking him off.

[SiouxTupa]

Just know that the price of student tickets could go up EASILY and by a lot, and it would still be lower than UofM students pay.

Maybe someone can back this up, but I hear that the students there pay over 200? That's a MAJOR difference!! And they are the STUDENTS OF THE UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA too!!