redwing77 Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 This whole goaltender debate is an interesting and perplexing argument to me. The goaltender that got most of our ire is gone (Siembida). This year we had a disappointing Final Five game and a heartbreaker in Colorado, but otherwise we did well. Why did we do so well? Because we had goaltending, defensive, and offensive depth on top of talent. Brandt and JPar constantly fought for starting time and, at the same time, provided an excellent back up plan if things go south. This isn't going to change. In fact, it's an advantage only few teams in the WCHA have (CC, UMD, and UW are the only ones in the top tier who can boast this besides us). Most notably, the Gophers do NOT have this as an advantage. We all saw what JJ can do between the pipes . End point is: Let's worry about the clutch offense and the special teams and stop worrying about our defense. Our defense hasn't changed, it's only gotten better this season. Let's put this debate to bed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 This whole goaltender debate is an interesting and perplexing argument to me. The goaltender that got most of our ire is gone (Siembida). This year we had a disappointing Final Five game and a heartbreaker in Colorado, but otherwise we did well. Why did we do so well? Because we had goaltending, defensive, and offensive depth on top of talent. Brandt and JPar constantly fought for starting time and, at the same time, provided an excellent back up plan if things go south. This isn't going to change. In fact, it's an advantage only few teams in the WCHA have (CC, UMD, and UW are the only ones in the top tier who can boast this besides us). Most notably, the Gophers do NOT have this as an advantage. We all saw what JJ can do between the pipes . End point is: Let's worry about the clutch offense and the special teams and stop worrying about our defense. Our defense hasn't changed, it's only gotten better this season. Let's put this debate to bed. Good point lets hope that our PP doesn't go 1-24 or 1-28 to start the season like it did last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagies Posted September 15, 2004 Share Posted September 15, 2004 Article on Ziggy in the Herald today Ziggy in the Herald Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tboneund Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 "My only deal at UND was that I just wanted the opportunity to play, and I didn't feel I got that, and I don't know why." Um, maybe it's because you were playing behind two goalies with more talent? JPar and Brandt battled for #1 all season, there was no reason to make it a 3 man race. I do wish him good luck at UMD. JPar should continue to develop nicely and give Lammy the time he might need to develop and adjust to the WCHA. Too bad Kollar didn't give Jake the same opportunity. On a side note, I don't think Brandt gets the credit he deserves. Was he a 2nd coming of Karl? No. Putting that pressure on him and keeping in mind that he had somewhat of a trial-by-fire his first year...backing the infamous sieve Kollar, then being expected to lead the team, then being back-up to hopeful Siembida...I think he has done pretty well. No, he isn't an all-star goalie, but an ok goalie is all you need to win if the rest of the tream shows up (MN proved that twice!) Excuse me as I step off my soap box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 "My only deal at UND was that I just wanted the opportunity to play, and I didn't feel I got that, and I don't know why." Um, maybe it's because you were playing behind two goalies with more talent? JPar and Brandt battled for #1 all season, there was no reason to make it a 3 man race. I do wish him good luck at UMD. Exactly. If Ziggy thinks that Sandelin will automatically give him playing time just because he suits up, he'll be in for a rude awakening. Generally, I like, finally, our goalie situation. I've given Brandt a great deal of flak, but he seems like he finally got into his groove. JParise is still solid, and I think will get even better. Lammy seems to have the talent, and drive, to take a spot from either of those two. Couple that with a solid defense, and it should help the forwards get into their games sooner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skateshattrick Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Exactly. If Ziggy thinks that Sandelin will automatically give him playing time just because he suits up, he'll be in for a rude awakening. Generally, I like, finally, our goalie situation. I've given Brandt a great deal of flak, but he seems like he finally got into his groove. JParise is still solid, and I think will get even better. Lammy seems to have the talent, and drive, to take a spot from either of those two. Couple that with a solid defense, and it should help the forwards get into their games sooner. I think that you are underestimating Ziggy. He was offered a 3/4 ride from UMD before he came to UND. Even though he received very little money from UND, it was his lifelong dream to play for UND. He was a very good goalie at RR High School, and had a great career at Lincoln. He made the USHL All Star team, and split time with Lamoreaux at Lincoln. At times, he was the better goalie. He is very capable if given the chance. The difference between Ziggy and Jordan Parise is very small, and in fact, Ziggy was regarded as the better goalie coming out of the USHL. He could play for many teams in the WCHA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIFE-R Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 My sentiments exactly!! If you go back and check out the stats for all of these young gentlemen, you would come to find that in the USHL, "Lammy", "Ziggy"and JP were pretty much toe to toe to toe. I don't think that the level of talent has ever been an issue at UND. My hat goes off to Ziggy for making the mature decision of going where he was wanted and not trying to stay on where he wanted to go!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 I think that you are underestimating Ziggy. He was offered a 3/4 ride from UMD before he came to UND. Even though he received very little money from UND, it was his lifelong dream to play for UND. He was a very good goalie at RR High School, and had a great career at Lincoln. He made the USHL All Star team, and split time with Lamoreaux at Lincoln. At times, he was the better goalie. He is very capable if given the chance. The difference between Ziggy and Jordan Parise is very small, and in fact, Ziggy was regarded as the better goalie coming out of the USHL. He could play for many teams in the WCHA. Obviously Blais didn't think Ziggy was the better goalie, otherwise he would have started. Moreover, if Ziggy was so confident in his abilities compared to JParise and Brandt, let alone Lammy coming in, he probably should have stayed and proved it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIFE-R Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Why would he stay??? Who does he have to prove anything to? Us, as fans? The way we tear these young men down, based only on what we think we know of them, like them or dislike them, they are talented men with their sights set on playing in the NCAA. I am only assuming that you are an intelligent person, but why would you stay on at a place where the chances of you getting to play were minimal? Wouldn't it be a much brighter idea to go somewhere else?? Just askin'!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Why would he stay??? Who does he have to prove anything to? Us, as fans? The way we tear these young men down, based only on what we think we know of them, like them or dislike them, they are talented men with their sights set on playing in the NCAA. I am only assuming that you are an intelligent person, but why would you stay on at a place where the chances of you getting to play were minimal? Wouldn't it be a much brighter idea to go somewhere else?? Just askin'!! Some people cut, and run at the first sign of trouble. And others fight it out and are the better for it. Take your pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarzUND Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 Some people cut, and run at the first sign of trouble. And others fight it out and are the better for it. Take your pick. I don't think I'd say Ziggy was running, should he have kept waiting and never got the chance to play and 3 yrs later say "what if I...? " Who knows if he'll get playing time at UMD, But it was his decision. Now if next year he leaves and tries to find yet another team, then there is a problem. But I don't think he's doing the wrong thing in deciding to play for UMD.From what I've read here, It doesn't sound like Ziggy was given a chance to show what he could do. I don't know how the conversation went, but maybe both the coaches and Ziggy felt it was best to move on. I wish Ziggy the best of luck and hope he gets to finally show everyone what he is capable of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 This whole goaltender debate is an interesting and perplexing argument to me. The goaltender that got most of our ire is gone (Siembida). It will be interesting to see if he actually gets any playing time at the Q this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skateshattrick Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 Obviously Blais didn't think Ziggy was the better goalie, otherwise he would have started. Moreover, if Ziggy was so confident in his abilities compared to JParise and Brandt, let alone Lammy coming in, he probably should have stayed and proved it. What a ridiculous statement. As Steve Johnson tells his players, go where you are wanted. That is what Steve Johnson told Grant Potulny and it worked out for him. The Sioux did not recruit Grant Potulny or want him because Blais didn't like him. As much respect as I have for Dean Blais, his opinions and judgments are not infallible. Obviously, the coaches at UND had Ziggy behind the other 3 goalies. Scott Sandelin sees something that he likes in Ziggy or he would not have offered him a 3/4 ride (Ziggy had a 1/4 ride from the Sioux and JPar had a 1/2 ride). Ziggy is not quitting. He is going where he is wanted and where he will at least get a chance. Barry Sanders was not recruited at Oklahome because they thought he was too small. He wanted to go there because that was his team growing up. Oklahome State was one of only 2 schools that offered him a scholarship, so he went there. Why? Because that is where he was wanted. David Hoosten had exactly one scholarship offer after leading the USHL in scoring, at UND. He turned out to be pretty good. A lot of smart coaches underestimated his ability. Brett Favre wanted out of Atlanta because he was behind 2 other quarterbacks. Do you want some more examples?? Don't cut Ziggy short. He justs wants a chance and should get that at UMD. It is all about opportunity. I wish him the best of luck and I hope he proves doubters like you wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tboneund Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 Josh had more raw talent than Jake, but he seemed to think that was enough...maybe now he'll work a little harder. He's a great guy and I have never seen two people (Jake and Josh) get along so well. Two guys competing for the same job and they genuinely respected each other. I hope he gets his second chance this year up at the Q. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jloos Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 Ziggy was never given a chance at UND. He was a USHL all-star caliber goalie, and split time with Lammy. I find it funny that people think Lammy is the second coming and Ziggy was just around for a practice goalie. I don't fault Ziggy or the coaches. To be fair Ziggy wasn't really rectuited by UND, he came here to play for the home town. However with all the goalie juggling done at UND, you would think Ziggy would at least get a shot in a NC game. I think the only time he played was in the exhibition game against the U18 team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 What a ridiculous statement. As Steve Johnson tells his players, go where you are wanted. [...] Ziggy is not quitting. He is going where he is wanted and where he will at least get a chance. [...] Don't cut Ziggy short. He justs wants a chance and should get that at UMD. It is all about opportunity. I wish him the best of luck and I hope he proves doubters like you wrong. Perhaps if your head wasn't so far up his ass, your reading comprehension would be better. I didn't go after his abilities, but I have little patience for pandering nitwits who fail to see that if their "star" doesn't play it may have something to do with relative talent levels on the squad. I hope he finds his place at UMD, and you can enjoy your travels to the DECC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 The way we tear these young men down, based only on what we think we know of them, like them or dislike them... This might be the most profoundly accurate description of some of the discussions on here that I've ever read. Regarding Ziegelmann, I wish him all the best and I hope he gets his chance. That's all anyone can ask for. Whatever the reason, he wouldn't have gotten it here. I find it laughable that some are labeling him a quitter. I don't remember anyone calling Jason Blake a quitter when he left Ferris State for UND, and he was leaving a situation where he already received ample playing time. Seems like a double-standard to me. At least he gave his dream a shot - playing for his hometown team. It didn't work out, so he decided to change plans early on. You have to admire his foresight. By moving on, he avoids becoming a goaltending version of Tyler Palmiscno or Mike Possin, a guy who kind of wilts away on the bench, all the while probably wondering what might have been... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmidtdoggydog Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 This might be the most profoundly accurate description of some of the discussions on here that I've ever read. Seems like a double-standard to me. At least he gave his dream a shot - playing for his hometown team. It didn't work out, so he decided to change plans early on. You have to admire his foresight. By moving on, he avoids becoming a goaltending version of Tyler Palmiscno or Mike Possin, a guy who kind of wilts away on the bench, all the while probably wondering what might have been... One clarification: Mike Possin actually transferred to St. John's of the MIAC, which is near his hometown of St. Cloud, and had a fairly successful college career at that level: SJU's Possin Named Hockey All-American COLLEGEVILLE, Minn. -- Saint John's University senior forward Mike Possin, St. Cloud/Cathedral HS, was named to the 2001-02 JOFA/AHCA College Division All-American Team, which was announced on Thursday, March 14. Possin, along with sophomore goalie Dan Melde of Gustavus and Tony Lawrence of St. Thomas, were the three Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference players named to the West Region First Team. Possin, an assistant captain for the Johnnies, started 25 of 26 games this season. Possin has 15 goals and 28 assists for 43 points, which led the team in assists and points. Possin led the MIAC this season in assists with 18 and tied for the lead in points with 28. Possin, who transferred to SJU last winter from the Univ. of North Dakota, had 26 goals and 38 assists for 64 points in 44 career games at SJU. Possin is the seventh SJU player in school history, and first since Matt Erredge in 1999, to earn All-America honors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skateshattrick Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 Perhaps if your head wasn't so far up his ass, your reading comprehension would be better. I didn't go after his abilities, but I have little patience for pandering nitwits who fail to see that if their "star" doesn't play it may have something to do with relative talent levels on the squad. I hope he finds his place at UMD, and you can enjoy your travels to the DECC. What a mature response. When someone disagrees with you, you resort to swearing and name-calling. I would hate to see you when you are arguing about something important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 What a mature response. When someone disagrees with you, you resort to swearing and name-calling. I would hate to see you when you are arguing about something important. Can you imagine how bad it would be if we weren't on the same side? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Posted September 18, 2004 Share Posted September 18, 2004 One clarification: Mike Possin actually transferred to St. John's of the MIAC I'm aware that Mike transfered - but it should be pointed out that he didn't transfer until Blais cut him in-season. The point I was trying to make was that if you look at some players who spent more time on the bench than on the ice, all the while waiting for their "shot," then it really isn't fair to label a player like Ziegelmann a quitter. He saw the writing on the wall, and rather than spend the next four years as a practice body, he decided to go in a different direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan_Parise_FREAK! Posted September 18, 2004 Share Posted September 18, 2004 Which he thought was a good choice, and who knows, he might play a lot more at UMD. I hope he does well there. I agree 100% with you, Canuck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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