Awesome Letter

[siouxlove]

http://www.angryasianman.com/2008/04/racis...-dartmouth.html

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/city_regi...outh_presi.html

http://dartreview.com/archives/1998/12/15/...ional_media.php

http://www.dartmouth.edu/~thepress/read.php?id=23

Just a few of many. The last one is pretty telling, IMHO>

bump

[siouxlove]

http://daily.stanford.edu/article/1999/6/2...centRacistEmail

FWB also mentioned Stanford. Let's not leave them out.

edit:

Harvard

http://badideafactory.net/disguide/racism.htm

Columbia

http://www.columbiaspectator.com/node/27406

http://www.tc.columbia.edu/news/article.htm?id=6394

Princeton

http://card.wordpress.com/2007/01/22/racis...dent-newspaper/

[SportsDoc]

I really wanted my alma mater to take the high road as an INSTITUTION OF HIGHER EDUCATION and do what the leaders of such prestigous universities like Dartmouth and Stanford did in changing their names.

Wow, the words stretch and reach apply here. keep'em comin, though.

My stretch and reach came right from your post: ... such prestigious universities like Dartmouth and Stanford ... If Yale isn't "like" Dartmouth and Stanford, I don't know what school is. The difference is they never had a NA nickname or logo, really.

[Oxbow6]

So whatever happens at one Ivy League school can be applied to all Ivy League schools? Wow, the words stretch and reach apply here. keep'em comin, though.

Stretch and reach? It this not the same logic you have been using since you started posting here?

Paraphrasing your experiences at/with UND:

I went to UND. White kid(s) discriminated against me at UND. UND is a racist institution. Nickname must go. Stick it to the white man.

By the way, didn't mean to tell you how to teach your class from my last post in this thread. But I did appreciate the succint and direct private message as to your feeings regarding my advice.

[fourwindsboy]

Stretch and reach? It this not the same logic you have been using since you started posting here?

Paraphrasing your experiences at/with UND:

I went to UND. White kid(s) discriminated against me at UND. UND is a racist institution. Nickname must go. Stick it to the white man.

By the way, didn't mean to tell you how to teach your class from my last post in this thread. But I did appreciate the succint and direct private message as to your feeings regarding my advice.

Thats about it in a nutshell. Accepting a Buttload of cash from a Nazi lover doesn't help UND's image. Draggin it's feet when a jewish student is discriminated against doesn't help, either.

[Goon]

Accepting a Buttload of cash from a Nazi lover doesn't help UND's image.

Again Ralph was cleared by the FBI and was ruled not to have any fascist leanings so I am going to trust them or any of the people smearing a persons name excessively. I don't care if Pro-name change people, Left Wing Professors, Little Johnny Hoff or you wants to keep saying that Ralph is a Nazi, it just isn't the case and it doesn't make it true...

[Sioux-cia]

But I did appreciate the succint and direct private message as to your feeings regarding my advice.

C'mon share!

[redwing77]

Stanford's mascot is a tree. So, unless that's a Black Spruce, they're not racist.

Edited May 8, 2008 by redwing77

[Sioux-cia]

So those racist occurrances at those prestigious Ivy League schools cited above really aren't racist because they don't have Native American names/logos/mascots? Racism only happens at schools with Native American names/logos/mascots? Unless of course they have an exemptions from the NC$$.

[Goon]

So those racist occurrances at those prestigious Ivy League schools cited above really aren't racist because they don't have Native American names/logos/mascots? Racism only happens at schools with Native American names/logos/mascots? Unless of course they have an exemptions from the NC$$.

So it would appear these incidents have nothing to do with their sports teams moniker then.

Hum, that interesting.

[Chief Illiniwek Supporter]

I don't think it was wrong for the protesters to do what they did.

Oh, I quite agree. People are saying that they'll withhold financial gifts from the University and others argue "but you're punishing the students". My response is that when I gave to the University of Illinois I was "punishing" Illinois State, Northwestern and a lot of other schools-not to mention many, many other worthy charities.

Its no more a punishment to change who you support than it was a punishment to not support others in the first place.

I also think the Art Institute Director is right in what he/she said. However, the way the Director went about it was wrong. You don't have to censor art. You just say that the edgy art like the flag idea doesn't fit in with the artistic community in that area, wish the artist well, and there you go. You could call that selective censorship, as you would be refusing to display the artwork in your museum, but not every art piece produced makes a museum.

The person who designed the work of art was a student at the School of the Art Institute, so the director didn't make a direct, overt choice to display this work-but at some level, someone judged that it was okay to be put into the museum.

Bad judgement and that person should have paid a price IMHO.

Stanford's mascot is a tree. So, unless that's a Black Spruce, they're not racist.

No, its not a Black Spruce: I believe its a White Pine so they're okay.

Oh, wait a minute....

[Hammersmith]

When art breaks the law, then it's not art. It's illegal. A flag that touches the ground, IIRC, must be BURNED. It is a token mandated of respect.

Commonly held myth.

US Code, Title 4 (parentheses are mine)

Sec. 8. Respect for flag

(b) The flag should never touch anything beneath it, such as the ground, the floor, water, or merchandise. (If it's on the ground, pick it up; nothing more neds to be done.)

(k) The flag, when it is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning. (It only needs to be destroyed if it's in bad shape; like many flags flying over American Legions. )

While the Flag Code is federal law, there are no penalties spelled out and it is rarely enforced. Think of it as a set of official suggestions.

Carry on.

[redwing77]

Commonly held myth.

US Code, Title 4 (parentheses are mine)

Sec. 8. Respect for flag

(b) The flag should never touch anything beneath it, such as the ground, the floor, water, or merchandise. (If it's on the ground, pick it up; nothing more neds to be done.)

(k) The flag, when it is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning. (It only needs to be destroyed if it's in bad shape; like many flags flying over American Legions. )

While the Flag Code is federal law, there are no penalties spelled out and it is rarely enforced. Think of it as a set of official suggestions.

Carry on.

I guess a flag on the ground that has been repeatedly walked upon would qualify in my opinion for destruction. And good point regarding the American Legion flags.

[fourwindsboy]

http://daily.stanford.edu/article/1999/6/2...centRacistEmail

FWB also mentioned Stanford. Let's not leave them out.

edit:

Harvard

http://badideafactory.net/disguide/racism.htm

Columbia

http://www.columbiaspectator.com/node/27406

http://www.tc.columbia.edu/news/article.htm?id=6394

Princeton

http://card.wordpress.com/2007/01/22/racis...dent-newspaper/

And how exactly is UND better than these universities?

[fourwindsboy]

Again Ralph was cleared by the FBI and was ruled not to have any fascist leanings so I am going to trust them or any of the people smearing a persons name excessively. I don't care if Pro-name change people, Left Wing Professors, Little Johnny Hoff or you wants to keep saying that Ralph is a Nazi, it just isn't the case and it doesn't make it true...

OK now we bring out the big guns. You, me and the rest know that if Ralphy doesn't donate millions of $$ and build a hockey shrine for himself on the UND campus, the school would've changed the name a long time ago. We all now of the threats he made and how much do you want to bet there are provisions in his will if the name was changed. Come on, I was born at night but not last night. I've said it before, money makes the world go round. Ralphy's loaded and the Sioux tribes aren't, bottom line. You can fire away at me all you want but you all know its true!

[siouxlove]

And how exactly is UND better than these universities?

This is what you said. I just wanted to point out that changing a name and logo made NO DIFFERENCE in the racism on those 'prestigous universities'. Changing a name and logo will not change someone's mind set. The 'plight' of Native Americans is not the result of a name and logo. Racism is not the result of a name and logo.

I really wanted my alma mater to take the high road as an INSTITUTION OF HIGHER EDUCATION and do what the leaders of such prestigous universities like Dartmouth and Stanford did in changing their names.

Dartmouth gave up their Indian mascot in the 1970s, following occurred in the Fall of 2006

In an e-mail sent to the student body Monday, President James Wright delved into the school

[Oxbow6]

C'mon share!

Don't really need to throw FWB under the bus any more than he has already done himself.

[fourwindsboy]

Don't really need to throw FWB under the bus any more than he has already done himself.

Sticks and stones, baby!

[Oxbow6]

Sticks and stones, baby!

Ummm...didn't you send the pleasant private messagae to me? For me to share your venom surely isn't going to put you in a "better" light to anyone on this site. You'll just keep digging your own hole without any assistance from me. Keep it up and you'll be a bigger embarrassment to your own people than you already are.

[siouxforeverbaby]

Thats about it in a nutshell. Accepting a Buttload of cash from a Nazi lover doesn't help UND's image. Draggin it's feet when a jewish student is discriminated against doesn't help, either.

This is going to annoy me so, RALPH WAS NOT A NAZI LOVER. THE FBI CLEARED HIM!!!!!! I appreciate your concern, but I really don't see what Ralph has to do with an incident on campus happening how many years after his death between two people unrelated to him. For that matter since that nonfact keeps being brought up as a reason to change the name, i have no clue what he has to do with the nickname.

It is something that was solved years ago, so it doesn't need to be brought up continuely.

End of my rant.....Have a nice day.

[fourwindsboy]

Ummm...didn't you send the pleasant private messagae to me? For me to share your venom surely isn't going to put you in a "better" light to anyone on this site. You'll just keep digging your own hole without any assistance from me. Keep it up and you'll be a bigger embarrassment to your own people than you already are.

Startin to feel better now? Thats it, get it all out. I have way, way more self esteem than this forum can take out of me.

[fourwindsboy]

This is going to annoy me so, RALPH WAS NOT A NAZI LOVER. THE FBI CLEARED HIM!!!!!! I appreciate your concern, but I really don't see what Ralph has to do with an incident on campus happening how many years after his death between two people unrelated to him. For that matter since that nonfact keeps being brought up as a reason to change the name, i have no clue what he has to do with the nickname.

It is something that was solved years ago, so it doesn't need to be brought up continuely.

End of my rant.....Have a nice day.

So he has a gala at his casino to celebrate the Nazi's and he isn't a Nazi lover? Am I missin something here?

[Oxbow6]

Startin to feel better now? Thats it, get it all out. I have way, way more self esteem than this forum can take out of me.

Self esteem: (n) an inordinately or exaggeratedly favorable impression of oneself.

Yeah... go ahead and roll with that one.

[siouxforeverbaby]

So he has a gala at his casino to celebrate the Nazi's and he isn't a Nazi lover? Am I missin something here?

AGAIN IN ALL CAPS SINCE YOU SEEMED TO HAVE MISSED IT THE FIRST TIME.....HE WAS CLEARED BY THE FBI.....CLEARED AS IN WAS FOUND TO NOT BE A NAZI SUPPORTER....and as for his parties, he APOLOGIZED FOR THEM including the one that was not proven that it was him hosting it and not his staff. but I am done arguing about it and back on ignore for you.

[Sioux-cia]

... but I am done arguing about it and back on ignore for you.

He has proven time after time that his sole purpose on this forum is to goad members into arguments. Very likely hoping that someone will say something inflammatory that he can take to 'his people' to prove we're the racists. He posts clearly show he is the racist; prime example of the pot calling the kettle black. I think everyone should put him on ignore. I've said it before he isn't adding anything to the name/logo discussion. He just wants to 'stick it to the man'. People post responses to his ridiculous and erroneous posts to show his errors/misconceptions which once proven he's wrong (again), he ignores their responses.

I have him on ignore but read his antagonistic responses when others respond to his posts. His descent into his mire of racism shows everyone, pro- and against the name and logo what a little man he is. He can't use logic or valid examples to support his stance so he resorts to insults and antagonism. Ignore him.