Bison06

By all hype I don't mean they weren't talented. All hype to say they were the best corp in the FCS. Hardin is/was legit. Jackson...meh, his size made people more excited about him than they should have been IMO. Golladay may develop more, but was never very impressive to me. We'll see how he does at NIU. Keep in mind, UND's run game was awful and they have been playing from behind in nearly every game for the last 2 years. Stats will look a lot better when you play in an offense like that.

It was just hype IMO. There was never any actual reasons to believe that they would perform like the best in the nation, regardless of who was throwing the ball.

So let's go with 40 times and vertical jumps then. Production is all that matters, the rest is just wasted potential. What argument can be made that they were the best?

What other measure could someone possibly use to say one WR corp is better than another? Saying UND had the best receivers in the nation seems like one of those things that someone said once and every UND fan jumped on board. If they were the best WR corp in the nation, then they were simultaneously the most under-achieving receiving corp in the nation. Making the argument that they didn't have a QB that could get them the ball is not valid if you ask me, because there is no way to know how they would have performed, we only know how they actually performed and it certainly wasn't as the best in the nation.

I am neither defending nor condemning the "millions" comments. But it seems to me, it wouldn't be ridiculous to think that a very large number of people were watching a first round NCAA tournament basketball game and watching NDSU play basketball for the very first time. Is a million too many? I don't know, how many people watch first round games?

I know I'll kick myself for chiming in on this mess, but here goes. Just this week on KFAN they brought up how NDSU gave KU all they could handle in that game. I personally know a dozen KU fans who bring this up every time I see them. I think it actually helps that NDSU beat them and KSU in Football so they have heard the school's name multiple times. I also have never met an NDSU fan who think NDSU beat KU in that game.

In many ways, I believe geaux_sioux has a point. The act of shoveling isn't a problem, it's who gives the order that matters. If the order comes from a person the players respect, then it is looked at as a team building, character building exercise. If the order comes from a person the players do not respect, then they rebel and call it bush league. However, given the climate of today's college football environment and how competitive it is to recruit these fickle 18 year olds, the sentiment of this board on this topic I believe is the correct one. Recruits may see that as a negative when going through the recruiting process.

The reason for NDSU's slump has been hashed out over and on a thousand threads both here and bisonville. No need to re-visit, regardless of where you believe it came from. I'll answer your question with a question. Is it UND hockey or a certain coach that brings success? They have own championships with multiple coaches. Is it Alabama football or a certain coach that brings success, they have championships with multiple coaches. Is it UCLA basketball or a certain coach? See where I'm going? Some schools have a tradition of winning and as others have said building from a position of success is much easier. NDSU football is one of those programs that will always be building from a position of success and even if they have down years, they will always be back.

You seem very young based on your comments, so here's a history lesson. \ NDSU had 8 national championships before Craig Bohl was head coach. Craig Bohl is only part of the reason NDSU now has 10 and is looking to make it 11 in 6 days. Craig Bohl didn't recruit Steve Walker, Joe Mays, Kyle Steffes, Craig Dahl or anyone else in the '02 or '03 recruiting classes that went 10-1 two straight season while ineligible for the playoffs. NDSU is going to be more than fine, don't you worry.

Are you of the opinion that the team with better players is the one who will win? Or do you believe that a coach can be good at recruiting the "right" players for his system? You guys like hockey so here's an example for you. Why didn't Herb Brooks take the highest rated, best players for his legendary Olympic hockey team? The answer is because they wouldn't have accomplished anything near what the team of "lesser" players accomplished. He found the right guys to play his style of hockey and the rest is history. Too many coaches recruit talent, but talent only takes you so far in team sports. NDSU isn't good at recruiting better "football players" or kids who know the game better. What NDSU became very skilled at was identifying the players who would come in and be part of a bigger vision. Players who buy into a system that is proven to win. And say what you may about Coach Bohl and his staff if you like, but there is no denying he is a master at motivating and organizing young mind. Why do you think Sam Ojuri and John Crockett are OK with splitting carries. Why do you think NDSU's receivers are ok with not being an 'air raid' offense. NDSU's defense has some amazing individual talent, but you'd be hard pressed to say one of them is the best. They bring in kids with the right attitude(with rare exception) and they teach them discipline and team. The end result of which is the product we are witnessing.

I thought I was a moron. Pull yourself together. You think NDSU wins because they have better players? Never have never will. Kansas State, U of M, countless teams NDSU has beaten over the years had better athletes. Back when I played, we had one of the best defenses in I-AA(when it was called that). Routinely, I lined up against players that athletically and physically could run circles around me and pick me up and throw me through a wall. I was able to compete and win in those one on one match-ups because I was better coached and a hell of a lot more disciplined than them. NDSU has been doing it for years and they are still doing it. Why do you think that when every opposing team looks at NDSU's film they "aren't impressed"? Because on film it doesn't look special, it looks boring in fact. NDSU beats you because they are a better team than you, not because they are better athletically.

And there are plenty of 'Great' NDSU football players that would have played special teams if they played for the Gophers. It's a different level of competition for a reason.

And? Have you ever met an athlete? They always think someone is "disrespecting their skills". Listen to NFL players in interviews sometime. Players just use it as motivation. Players thinking they have been overlooked certainly doesn't mean that NDSU is winning games because of one coach's recruiting ineptitude. Did the Gophers miss on Billy Turner? Who knows. Maybe he goes to U of M, get lost on the depth chart for his first two years and doesn't develop the confidence to be such a star. Maybe Marcus going up against better receivers in practice everyday and not getting all those picks because of better competition causes him to not garner any NFL attention, which remains to be seen in the upcoming draft. This is a phenomenon that has been termed by Malcolm Gladwell as a "desirable difficulty". Maybe the reason they became so good in the first place was because they felt "disrespected" and had they been recruited to U of M may have not stood out the way they did.

Mcfeely is a self important talking head who will say anything to get people to read his blog. Not a good source of information. Using Grant Olson as an example of a recruiting "miss" shows his ignorance. Don't misunderstand what I'm saying Grant is an absolute stud, and an amazing leader. He may be the best who's ever played at NDSU, . But athletically, he couldn't compete in the Big Ten and that is why he wasn't offered by the Gophers. Knowing how his career turned out at NDSU, I still wouldn't recruit him to play middle linebacker in the Big Ten.

You guys are hilarious. Name one player on NDSU's roster that should be playing in the Big Ten or that Minnesota "missed". Billy Turner maybe. Marcus Williams, was not an academic qualifier. Outside of those two who did Brewster "miss" on? NDSU isn't winning games because they have better players than the other teams. In fact, athletically we are over-matched in a lot of cases. NDSU is winning because the players buy into a system that works and they play together. As proof of this, NDSU hasn't put any more players in the NFL than usual over this run than they did in the past.

NDSU has enjoyed more national media attention than any other FCS school ever this year. NDSU has had a great run, but as I've pointed out, NDSU is also a product of their time. Disagree if you would like to, I'll disagree with you we can go around in circles forever.

It didn't take you pointing that out for me to know they aren't the only FCS team to have their helmet on his show. But as another poster pointed out, he has had the helmet on his show many, many times throughout this year.

He does that for every FCS team, don't get excited.

Why is everyone so hung up on that term? All that is meant by that is they have consciously decided to give NDSU more attention this year, which you are now not disputing. Admittedly, NDSU has a distinct advantage over any other FCS team in history as well and that is the age we live in today. Social media, internet magazines, 24 hour news cycle etc. Networks like ESPN and others are having to branch out a bit to find interesting stories to fill the time. No other FCS school, who has had the success that NDSU has had, has had the opportunity to have that success in this media environment.

Being delusional would require me to hold a belief despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary. It seems for you to call me delusional, the burden of proof is on you. So if you can show me that any other team in the history of FCS football has received as much media attention nationally in a year as NDSU has this year. I'll allow you to call me delusional.

My point was that no fcs team has ever received as much media attention in a year than ndsu, which I stand by.

As far as the rest of the fcs is concerned, the 6 teams in those games aren't even a part of the subdivision, no playoffs. So technically, yes, they are fcs. Good job.

If you say so. You say Gameday doesn't give NDSU the nod, I say that is the exact point that shows NDSU has received more attention than any other fcs program in history. Not sure how one goes about measuring such things. Given both of us are in positions of bias, I would say we are at an impasse. Enjoy the offseason.

Appalachian state still better known? Agree to disagree. Michigan is a far more stories program than k-state. That win gets more attention because of michigan not app state. As far as being a "media darling" don't make this out to be a straw man, because I'm not biting. I said espn has decided to make NDSU relevant this year, relatively speaking. I completely stand behind that comment.

So, there is another fcs school in the history of fcs football that has gotten as much attention as ndsu has this year?