The Sicatoka

Seriously, what's it take to have a good BB team? Three guys? Maybe? Those "three guys" used to be on six or seven guys exclusively on NCC rosters. Now they are going for playing time on NCC and NSIC rosters.

The only place I see those espoused are from posts from GrahamKracker.

Teams recruit for expected needs. UND has four lined up for fall 2006: F: Michael Forney, Chris VandeVelde D: Chay Genoway, Jake Marto There are only two seniors on the roster: forward Mike Prpich and defenseman Lee Marvin. Toss in the potential of early departures of Smaby, Stafford, or Zajac and the class for fall of 2006 seems about right. And don't forget that we may be getting Robbie Bina back and cleared for full contact and play. The only question would be if Jordan Parise left early (where to find another goalie). What the rest of the numbers from Heisenberg's site means is this: The rest of the league will be skating 10 freshmen every night next year. Seeing what Wisconsin's "old men" did to us, I'll gladly take the "old men" role and play teams with 10 freshmen on the ice.

It's a nuance, but he couldn't have "signed". The signing period is in February. He must have verballed.

So close. ... :D

The UND Mafia. Yes, Mafia. Why? 10. We already have Vegas ties. 9. Team captains referred to as "wise guys." 8. Our hockey coaches? Godfather Hak and his lieutenants Brad da Glare and Cary da Squirt Bottle. 7. We could keep the green and black color scheme. 6. Would Denny Gunderson have to join the Teamsters? 5. When our defensemen put a hit on someone, they really put a hit on someone! 4. We'd all get cool white fedora hats (for home games, black hats on the road). 3. Think how sharp the teams would look traveling in pin striped suits. 2. Violin-case shaped hockey bags. 1. Ask John Gotti: There is no Mafia. ---> No protesters!

You all laugh, but my people are much more than just fighters. And look at the stereotypes we battle. (Did I get the GK sob-story tone right? Now someone hand me a tissue. I'm getting weapy again from the thought of that horrible commerical. )

All of these Vikings and Irish. (sigh) A proud Vandal here, thank you.

I think "star2city" covered it before: The more simple answer is: It's all hypothetical right now. UND can't control the BSC. UND can control UND Athletics. You can't live your life worrying about what others might or might not do so control what's yours to control and do what's best for you. (Isn't that what Joe Chapman and Gene Taylor have been telling us? )

The problem is that sci-fi is just that: science-fiction. We live in a non-fiction world. In a non-fiction world reversing what is cause and what is effect doesn't solve problems.

Somebody in UND Athletics has some first-hand experience with lacrosse. If nothing else he'd have a solid grasp of the pros and cons.

I understand folks' points about travel costs. It's an issue. But we'd be trading baseball and softball and M/W golf travel costs (see my previous post about where those teams go) for M/W lacrosse travel costs and be trading up to sports that we might actually "gate" some fans in. (All the numbers are in the thread.) Another thought: Could UND tap into the Canadian (Winnipeg) lacrosse fan market? Canad Inn and UND lacrosse weekend packages in GF?

Why not turn the $$$ into field turf* for The Al and have soccer play in there? Scoreboards? Heck, then you'd have replay boards! * NCAA only allows soccer on natural grass or field turf. The ball never stops rolling on magic carpet.

I'm not sure what you are trying to say with "doesn't fit because all-sports conference counts it." Baseball and softball don't fit in the Big Sky. What would the SUs or UND do if an offer came along? I say you can't worry about that. The goal in my thoughts is a program that comes closer to "gating" its costs, and that stands a better chance of being nationally competitive, than the programs that are in place now. About your point/question 6, why not M and W lacrosse: They'd self-neutralize Title IX concerns (like M/W hockey). I'm thinking replacement, not addition. Now for some random observations and ("sudo"-)analysis by me. (Very scattered, sorry.) Drivers behind thought process: Going to sports with potential to be revenue neutral (v. negative, and positive is probably a dream). Reshaping UND's athletic department to facilities strengths. Reshaping UND's athletic department to climate realities. Align UND Athletics to Strategic Plan II goals and objectives. (see star2city above) Known data: UND Baseball averaged 261 per home date in 2004. UND Baseball had 2347 fans in total attend games in 2004. Denver has maxed out their stadium (3300) for lax matches. Baseball and softball facilities are wanting. Baseball and softball consistently lose home dates in April due to weather. The Al is sized to be able to hold lacrosse, and has a roof. Assumption: Golf (M and W), softball, and tennis did not surpass baseball in home attendance. Data with high believability (strong source, but unverified independently): UND Scholarships (limits and actuals) Sport DI DII UND Baseball 11.8 9.0 2.4 Golf (M) 4.5 3.6 0.2 Softball 12.0 7.2 5.5 Golf (W) 6.0 5.4 1.0 W Tennis 8.0 6.0 2.5 Potential scholarships available in a reshaping: M: 2.6 W: 6.5 to 9.0 (depending if tennis survives my analysis) NCAA Lax scholarship limits: M: 12.6 W: 12.0 Travel costs? DU's Recent Lax Schedules -- 16 to 17 dates. Normally two games per weekend. Four home weekends; four or five travel weekends (each > 500 miles). This season's UND travel schedules: Softball -- to FL, to UNO, to USD, to MSP, to Duluth, to (somewhere in MN). Baseball -- to Emporia State (KS), to Washburn (KS? MO?), to FL, to Brookings, to Upper Iowa, to BSU, to Mankato, to UMC, to Duluth, to UNO. Golf (W) -- to Detroit Lakes, St Paul, Marshall, Omaha, Vermillion, Mankato Golf (M) -- to Moorhead, Bemidji, Fargo, Sioux Falls, Vermillion, Mankato, Lincoln. Tennis -- five road trips (all to MN or SD) I see at least five >500 miles travel weekends in there. I guess I come to this conclusion: UND, short of a domed baseball stadium or a warmer season schedule, won't ever come close to gating costs of the baseball program (or softball, or golf, or tennis). Lacrosse at other schools has much better gates than what UND is getting today in baseball (et al). Lacrosse would have some basis for appeal to UND's demographics (recruiting areas, fan base) as well. I know there are many other fish to fry first (Buning's Day Planner thread), but it's still an interesting bull session with the folks here.

Hey, I'll admit that. But baseball and softball have proven to be pure red ink. I'd be happy with something that'd have even an outside shot at paying its own freight. Denver put 1200 in a lacrosse stadium in a snowstorm last year and filled their 3300 seat facility more than once. For comparison, in 2004 UND had 9 home baseball games with a total attendance of 2,347 (average: 261). I'd pay to see UND guys with sticks beat on Denver guys another month or two in the spring, even in The Al.

The University of Idaho (Vandals) is allowed to mock and stereotype Germanic people. Van

No, PCM. More like,

The black jersey they wore in St. Cloud nearly a year ago: (yawn)

Question: Which has a better chance of "gating" its expenses: soccer or lacrosse? I'm interested, if a sport were added, in adding sports that have a chance at paying their own freight.

Who knows which way facts and figures will sway people. What I see is this: Dale Lennon, Head Football Coach and Danny Gagner, Student-Athlete. The FB coach who's been known to favor DI-AA and his star safety. Dave Hakstol, Head Men's Hockey Coach A guy who already is a DI coach. Gene Roebuck, Head Women's Basketball Coach A guy who's already said he'd play a particular DI WBB school. What sport did Ken Vein, President, Letterwinners Association, play? (I don't know.) Folks will see what they want to see in anything. What I hope is these folks (the total list) can take facts and information and come to objective decisions.

Yup, and yup. I don't believe in this climate baseball and softball will ever "gate" enough fans to be self-sufficient (without a domed stadium). I believe lacrosse (in The Al) would stand a better chance.

Got a link to the story? (Try "history" on your browser.)

I was reading "SIOUX ILLUSTRATED" last week, the new BB focus issue. It alluded that Rich was very close to being the all-time wins leader as a UND coach. Is he hanging on to get that and then .... ?

Like 'star2city' said, a couple programs that are sure "red ink" would have to go before lacrosse could be added. I like baseball and softball, but we either need the NCAA season moved to a warmer part of the calendar in ND (not going to happen) or a dome. "star2city" puts out a solid list of pros and cons (at Post 9, above). We have the field resource already. I just believe that lacrosse has a much better chance of making it at the gate than baseball or softball, in large part due to the climate we live in. Field lacross in the Alerus takes weather off the list of concerns. And another excuse to tailgate is never a bad thing.