Tribes vote for NCAA, against UND

[willistonsioux]

that article dident help ,e understand this situation more

[redwing77]

Regardless of the governing structure and whether there was a vote or not, there has been enough "noise" out of Bismarck this week, that I can't envision the NCAA taking UND off the list.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yup. I wonder if they'll announce it on Monday and get it over with or will they wait longer and drag it until December 31st (if they could)

[GrahamKracker]

Can't wait for GK to come on here and act like a three year old!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

lol....I can only assume you hang out w/ many 3yos diggler....and it warms my heart to know that you think about me when I'm not around.....lol.

[GrahamKracker]

This council is probably quite similar to the one out of SD that, in 2001, endorsed UND's use of the Fighting Sioux name. Only that one was tossed aside as "irrelevant" and was likely full of those awful "hang around the fort" indians.

I'm sure this "council" will be looked at by 'GrahamKracker' as "official".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

lol....the beloved "council" is comprised of many UND Alumni, go figure. And which council are you referring to on campus? The last one I participated in did anything but endorse the FS name.

[PCM]

Finally, two days late, the Fargo Forum has a story about the decision made by the United Tribes of North Dakota. There was no story about this in today's Herald.

[url="http://www.in-forum.com/articles/index.cfm?id=102602

[iramurphy]

lol....the beloved "council" is comprised of many UND Alumni, go figure. And which council are you referring to on campus? The last one I participated in did anything but endorse the FS name.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey Kracker,

Welcome back. How was Bismarck? The board wasn't as much fun without you. We missed you.

You guys did a good job of "politicing" and pressuring everyone to fall in line with the hardliners. I would have taken you up on your offer to ride to Bismarck but I had to work. We could have had a good time debating. You forgot Hockey Mom, she wanted a ride.

Would the tribal council people have let me speak? I am a UND faculty member among other things and work with Native American kids on a weekly basis. (most of them are "rabbit chokers").

Didn't seem like it was a good atmosphere for any open discussion. I was disappointed Kuppy didn't address the group on the logo issue but I don't think he was up to standing up and listening to the bull$%!# part of the argument. He got that the next day anyway. The comments about the parade floats in the 1960's and trying to make people think American Indians are getting beat up on a regular basis at UND is crap. The police blotters over the years do not support that claim. I wonder if the attacks on American Indians was down in GF while you folks were in Bismarck? There was no one here to get after the half Indians or hang around the fort Indians while you and Leigh were in Bismarck arm twisting the others to become "real Sioux".

I see Jeonotte thinks the NCAA will cave in. I am not so sure. Kuppy was meeting with one of the other UND alumni (net worth well over $500,000,000) and told him he thought the NCAA would give UND an exemption. I guess we will see. Jeonotte also seems to think the UND response is full of mistruths. The "minority report he was part of had very little truth so I am not sure he would be a good judge of what the truth really is.

Rob Bollinger had planned to set up a committee to work with the states American Indians on the name issue had he been selected AD. He may try to get Buning to do the same thing. Do you know reasonable people who would be willing to work together to either make the name acceptable to more AI folks or change the name if that is going to happen or are we stuck now with the abrasive I can holler louder than you folks (on both sides). Who is the go to person on campus and do they have any authority to communicate on behalf of the tribal officials?

Anyway, have a good weekend and get your homework done. You don't want to break Quilly's record for years spent at UND as an undergraduate.

[HockeyMom]

I am a UND faculty member

Would you have been fired if you had directly contacted the NCAA on the nickname issue?

Just wondering, I think some members of the faculty should be for doing it.

[Sioux-cia]

Would you have been fired if you had directly contacted the NCAA on the nickname issue?

Just wondering, I think some members of the faculty should be for doing it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Why?? While I don't agree with the name change group and hope that they will not prevail, I support their right to disagree including their right to contact the NCAA. I abhore employers including State and Federal employers dictating to their employees what they can and cannot do in their personal lives. Unless of course that is one of the agreed upon by terms of employment. I agree that this is not something they can do as 'representatives' of their employer or that it is something that they can do while 'on duty'. But they have the right to say, "As an employee of UND, I disagree with the use of the Sioux name and logo". The rest of us can also contact the NCAA and say "As employees of UND/North Dakota/Specific Tribe/Federal government/etc, we support the use of the Sioux name and logo."

[HockeyMom]

Why?? While I don't agree with the name change group and hope that they will not prevail, I support their right to disagree including their right to contact the NCAA. I abhore employers including State and Federal employers dictating to their employees what they can and cannot do in their personal lives. Unless of course that is one of the agreed upon by terms of employment. I agree that this is not something they can do as 'representatives' of their employer or that it is something that they can do while 'on duty'. But they have the right to say, "As an employee of UND, I disagree with the use of the Sioux name and logo". The rest of us can also contact the NCAA and say "As employees of UND/North Dakota/Specific Tribe/Federal government/etc, we support the use of the Sioux name and logo."

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

On behalf of the University/or part of the University?

[fightonsioux]

I wonder how much money this convention, or whatever it was, in Bismarck raised for the hurricane victims. I'd also like to know how much money the 10 tribal council members gave themselves to the hurrican victims.

[Sioux-cia]

On behalf of the University/or part of the University?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Those aren't terms I used. 'As an employee' does not state them either. I am saying that a UND employee has the right to say that while he/she may work at UND, they don't agree with UND's stance on the use of the Sioux name or logo. The same as stating that while I may work for the Standing Rock Sioux tribe, I don't agree with their stance on the use of the Sioux name or logo by UND. No where does my previous post state "on behalf of the University/Tribe or part of the University or Tribe".

They are stating their opinion 'on behalf' of themselves who are employed by an employer who has an opinion with which they do not agree.

Edited September 11, 2005 by Sioux-cia

[iramurphy]

Would you have been fired if you had directly contacted the NCAA on the nickname issue?

Just wondering, I think some members of the faculty should be for doing it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi Mom,

I would not have been fired. I am part time and get only a stipend for mostly volunteer work but do hold a faculty position and do get a check. ( I donate it to UND athletics). I would not have spoken on behalf of the University.

I did contact the NCAA web site when they first came out with their ruling. I asked for similar clarification that UND is asking for and also asked why they wouldn't give a grace period before enforcing the new ruling. Budgets for new uniforms etc. are already approved for the year and even if they were going to enforce the ban, another year to comply with the time to budget for change would have been less heavy handed. I got the canned response and when I asked for futher clarification, I got the same canned response.

I do not agree the other faculty members should be in trouble for stating their position. I have a problem with how they misrepresent the truth. I also have a problem when they introduce the subject in their classes and the kids who support the use of the name seem to struggle to get the grades the had been getting. That may be a separate topic. If Grahamkracker wants to study with me, he will get an A if he earns it and maybe some extra credit for the entertainment value. His stance on the Sioux name wouldn't be an issue. I have read one of the papers graded by a marketing instructor and she was rude and inappropriate to the kid who documented some of the hostory and took a pro name stance.

By the way, cute kid. Has she signed with Coke yet to do commercials?

[HockeyMom]

By the way, cute kid.  Has she signed with Coke yet to do commercials?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks. Nothing yet, but she will grin from ear to ear if you look at her and say chug.

[Diggler]

Thanks.  Nothing yet, but she will grin from ear to ear if you look at her and say chug.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sioux Crew should make her their official mascot.

[PCM]

Sioux Crew should make her their official mascot.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

A human mascot? Have you no shame?

[Diggler]

A human mascot? Have you no shame?  

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do I really need to answer that?

[PCM]

Do I really need to answer that?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No. I feel embarrassed having asked.

[HockeyMom]

She loves the Sioux more than anything else I can think of.

I think it's one of the first words she learned how to spell, it was written on the driveway with sidewalk chalk one day when I got home from work.

[PCM]

She loves the Sioux more than anything else I can think of.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And you still have the best avatar on the board.

[HockeyMom]

And you still have the best avatar on the board.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If I would have been a little quicker on the draw I'd have the Coke chugging avatar.

[siouxjoy]

I do not agree the other faculty members should be in trouble for stating their position.  I have a problem with how they misrepresent the truth.  I also have a problem when they introduce the subject in their classes and the kids who support the use of the name seem to struggle to get the grades the had been getting.  That may be a separate topic.  If Grahamkracker wants to study with me,  he will get an A if he earns it and maybe some extra credit for the entertainment value.  His stance on the Sioux name wouldn't be an issue. I have read one of the papers graded by a marketing instructor and she was rude and inappropriate to the kid who documented some of the hostory and took a pro name stance.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can list of a few times that I know of where this has happened...really, really wrong.

[Diggler]

I didn't write a paper in my Intro to Philosophy class because of this. I knew I'd get a lower grade on it because of my opinion on the subject. Though I should note that I probably got a lower grade anyways because I used words that had upwards of four syllables in the paper, thus confusing the professor. How this woman became a professor is absolutely beyond me. I've always assumed she stole one of Bill Cosby's honorary doctorates, crossed his name out and somehow convinced UND that the University of Phoenix does indeed use red crayons on Doctoral Degrees.

[Sioux-cia]

[iramurphy]

[Sioux-cia]

It is a pet peave of mine.  When I was a freshman,  my Comp 101 grade dropped from an A to a C for writing a paper about Vietnam war protestors which was not in agreement with our leftist instructor.  He was a grad student and wouldn't discuss the grade with me.  I wasn't smart enough to challenge his attitude.  (I don't think the drop in my grade had anything to do with the trips to Judy's bar or Frenchies).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Freshmen are so busy being freshmen that they don't know about 'due process' and, unless they have a mentor, aren't 'smart enough to challenge'. I got a C in speech because Dr. Fischer said I should have been able to get rid of my Chicago 'nasal twang' by semesters end.

I'm sure you're trips to Judy's and Frenchies had nothing to do with your grade. The people I met there during my few visits (per week) all seemed to be highly intelligent, motivated, persons of high quality. Granted, my character evaluations were made after I saw the bottom of my Frenchies mug a time or two.