The Sicatoka Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 Bottom line: A pre-game sandwich or another scholarship for the (insert team here) team? Economic realities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm567b27 Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 Bottom line: A pre-game sandwich or another scholarship for the (insert team here) team? Economic realities. For someone taking an outwardly definsive position of the FSC (of which you say you are not a member) I'm curious as to your position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm567b27 Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 I would also like to see if you have the same PC opinion of things if your wallet was suddenly lighter by $1100 annually and you had "perks" taken away consistently every year in which your "dues" went up. Do you belong to a golf club? The situation at the FSC is akin to having your yearly membership dues at a private golf club increased and then having the club restrict your access to the club house and also only allowing you to play a round on odd numbered days. Please join the FSC...then pass on an opinion after a few years of season tickets - it will certainly hold more credibility with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 I do not work for UND or it's affiliates (FSC, UND Alumni) in any way, shape, form, or manner. I am a UND graduate. I have a sizable drive to each home game. I have seats in one of the sections required to join FSC to keep their seats; but I was an FSC member before this came about (to improve my seats in Alerus Center). I understand the economic realities facing Roger Thomas and the UND Athletic Department. They are hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm567b27 Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 I'm not saying what they face isn't hard what I'm saying is they are going about things poorly in terms of maintaining a good relationship with their funding pipeline. Money talks - always has and always will. Relationships are absolutely critical to running a successful "business". People that pay that extra money to join the FSC expect a little more than the guy who walks up to the window and flips out his $17 the day of the game. People who are in the FSC don't expect to stand in line outside the south end club (due to capacity) while fans from the upper bowl and the opposing team socialize behind the closed doors because they happened to get their before the club reached capacity. That is BS......Thats all I'm saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 You realize that the Club Rooms (both) become "open" once the game starts. Yes, that's not "year one" any more, but that's how it is. Plus, they are the SRO areas now. Yes, this is new. Things change. We're complaining about a Club Room. I can't imagine that in 1998 or 1999. This isn't the forum to air the dirty laundry. I said the same to the students not long ago: If you have a complaint, take it to the people who can do something about it, namely these guys. Praise in public, punish in private, right? And hey, I'm glad to see opposing fans spend money in REA. It pays for our sticks. Drink up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm567b27 Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 You realize that the Club Rooms (both) become "open" once the game starts. Yes, that's not "year one" any more, but that's how it is. Plus, they are the SRO areas now. Yes, this is new. Things change. We're complaining about a Club Room. I can't imagine that in 1998 or 1999. This isn't the forum to air the dirty laundry. If you have a complaint, take it to the people who can do something about it, namely these guys. Praise in public, punish in private, right? And hey, I'm glad to see opposing fans spend money in REA. It pays for our sticks. Drink up! There is nothing wrong with any prospective FSC member reading this - in fact I would have loved to have had insight on this prior to putting down my money. As I mentioned I intend to take this up the chain - I have already stated that. Nothing wrong with a controversial subject on this board. This isn't a top secret issue we are debating. Thanks for your feedback but again it isn't as credible being you aren't a FSC member with all due respect of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
engelbunny Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 People that pay that extra money to join the FSC expect a little more than the guy who walks up to the window and flips out his $17 the day of the game. People who are in the FSC don't expect to stand in line outside the south end club (due to capacity) while fans from the upper bowl and the opposing team socialize behind the closed doors because they happened to get their before the club reached capacity. That is BS......Thats all I'm saying. This I agree with. The south end club was supposed to be for FSC members. The only people that should be allowed in the south end club at any point during the game are club seat holders and FSC members, period. That seems to be a reasonable "perk of membership". But to make it worthwhile, maybe they should limit it to coaches club and above so that your country club analogy fits! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm567b27 Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 Sic: They could solve the south end club room issue very easily in my opinion. The south end should never be allow to fill to "capacity" - always allowing for entrance of FSC members upon showing their cards. Thereby keeping it open for general admission during the game but also allowing FSC members to gain entrance at any time. You have a card? You get in any time. You don't? You are admitted first come first served - if it is full and you don't have a card - you wait. Easy enough........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 Thanks for your feedback but again it isn't as credible being you aren't a FSC member with all due respect of course. I think you missed something: ... but I was an FSC member before this came about (to improve my seats in Alerus Center). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm567b27 Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 The reason they opened the south end club to all was that revenue compared to the north end was paltry. I understand that - but don't alienate your previously exclusive customers in doing so. Country club analogy aside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm567b27 Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 I think you missed something: No I didn't...You mentioned not being an FSC member during the new REA...did you not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 Yes, it about revenue. The bills have to be paid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted April 8, 2004 Share Posted April 8, 2004 No I didn't...You mentioned not being an FSC member during the new REA...did you not? No, I said I had seats in a section not requiring FSC membership even though I had FSC membership. I like the high corner view of a game those sections offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WPoS Posted April 9, 2004 Share Posted April 9, 2004 WPoS: Here's the situation. The lower bowl of REA is all FSC Coaches Club or better. $1100 (or better) annual contribution. With that you get rights to four tickets (2 at face, 2 at 25% off). Higher levels (bigger contributions) get you more rights to tickets. The upper last year had four sections that no FSC membership was required. Next year you'll have to join at the lowest FSC level (Century Club, $110 annually) to keep those seats. Last year it was $345 for the 23 game home ticket package per seat. Sounds like economically you'd like to become a Sioux fan. We'll find room in a lot to play some 'darts for you. thanks for the offer, but I'll have to pass... I'll just keep being a "student" as long as I can and keep the costs down! WPoS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Man Posted April 9, 2004 Share Posted April 9, 2004 If I'm not mistaken, this was done at the old ralph as well. you are mistaken I have been a season ticket holder since graduating in 96 and have never been forced to join the FSC, well until now. I wasn't happy when I first read the letter, but I am looking at it from a different perspective now. I liken it to a price increase for the season tickets. Instead of the tickets costing $690 a pair it will now cost $800 but at least since they are calling the $110 increase a donation to the FSC it is a tax deduction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diggler Posted April 9, 2004 Share Posted April 9, 2004 thanks for the offer, but I'll have to pass... I'll just keep being a "student" as long as I can and keep the costs down! WPoS This is my plan until I make enough money to donate and move up the waiting list. I got a pretty good seat for $500 total a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siouxyeahyeah Posted April 9, 2004 Share Posted April 9, 2004 On a more positive note, at least students (who technically should be the brokest of the broke) get an incredible deal for season tickets. So not everything is about money for UND athletics, because if it were there would be no student season tickets available or they'd be a heck of a lot more expensive. Just thought something said that was positive was about due. Carry on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WPoS Posted April 9, 2004 Share Posted April 9, 2004 This is my plan until I make enough money to donate and move up the waiting list. I got a pretty good seat for $500 total a year. I have been doing it for quite a while, every year it gets harder and harder to continue...they keep on finding ways of getting more money outa me...first thing to go was actaully going on a student ticket...this year the guest pass went up to $658... Next they'll take away the student guest passes . Yet we have open seats...ok, I'll let it go. No sense opening that up again! WPoS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm567b27 Posted April 9, 2004 Share Posted April 9, 2004 On a more positive note, at least students (who technically should be the brokest of the broke) get an incredible deal for season tickets. So not everything is about money for UND athletics, because if it were there would be no student season tickets available or they'd be a heck of a lot more expensive. Just thought something said that was positive was about due. Carry on! Not to ruin your positive - but tickets for hockey were free when I was a student in 1989-1993. If I remember correctly UND (at the time) was the only Div 1 college hockey program in the country that didn't charge students for seats. So while you have a great deal on season tickets it used to be even better. I wouldn't complain however as the program during my years was not even close to where it is now. Pay for progression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnt Posted April 9, 2004 Author Share Posted April 9, 2004 Can anyone explain to me how any of the smaller schools like Tech or Duluth seem to be paying their scholarship dollars, probably with higher tuitions. I'd be surprised if Tech averaged 3000 fans, and I know Duluth's ticket prices are lower than ours. Bottom line is that it is not about paying bills, it is about the bottom line and making more money, which isn't necessarily bad. Don't make it sound like you absolutely need the money to keep your head above water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm567b27 Posted April 9, 2004 Share Posted April 9, 2004 Can anyone explain to me how any of the smaller schools like Tech or Duluth seem to be paying their scholarship dollars, probably with higher tuitions. I'd be surprised if Tech averaged 3000 fans, and I know Duluth's ticket prices are lower than ours. Bottom line is that it is not about paying bills, it is about the bottom line and making more money, which isn't necessarily bad. Don't make it sound like you absolutely need the money to keep your head above water. Also keep in mind that the REA is PAID FOR!!! Meaning no huge annual bond payments just the cost of running the facility and it's employees (which isn't small I'm sure). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supertrex Posted April 9, 2004 Share Posted April 9, 2004 As I recall, we paid a dollar (or something like that) in 79-83. We'd line up at the student union a day or two before the game and get our tickets...and they were general admission in the student section (again, as I recall). I do know for a fact that the teams we had then were nothing short of GREAT...in the finals all four years...won two national championships...Chorney, Sykes, Murray, Eaves...I can't even begin a list... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm567b27 Posted April 9, 2004 Share Posted April 9, 2004 As I recall, we paid a dollar (or something like that) in 79-83. We'd like up at the student union a day or two before the game and get our tickets...and they were general admission in the student section (again, as I recall). I do know for a fact that the teams we had then were nothing short of GREAT...in the finals all four years...won two national championships...Chorney, Sykes, Murray, Eaves...I can't even begin a list... The teams during late 80's and early 90's produced quite a few NHL'ers (current)...But we never seemed to advance past the first round of the WCHA playoffs..... Our tickets were free as students during my days - all you needed to do was present that cheap a$$ student ID paper thing they game you and you were in. No photo ID on those things - I remember getting into a Gophs game as Stephanie something or other....because I left my ID at Bucks by accident. Back in the day....Of course you endured standing in line at the old Ralph for 2 hours drinking Pigs Eye beer and ducking into East Hall for some warmth on occasion. Times have changed - now it's the South End club before the game and Heinekens...wow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supertrex Posted April 9, 2004 Share Posted April 9, 2004 The tuition is given at no additional cost to the school. It's like an employee taking a ride on a company jet when it has an open seat. The plane's gonna fly and one more person on board doesn't increase operating expenses significantly. Now, I realize that the student with an athletic scholarship does not contribute funds to the organization, but that money is not lost because the student would not contribute the money in any case (he or she would not attend the school). Room and board are another issue, but the tuition waiver does not cost the institution more money...state subsidies may not be granted for the out of state player, but I don't think that changes the fact that the costs are fixed on an institutional basis, especially when considering the total number of students enrolled. UND is not a tech school. It is, in fact, a very large institution. When the debate was on about NDSU's leap to Division 1, I heard reports that athletics do not benefit most institutions, but in fact, actually result in a net cash outlay. Most, if not all, of these "studies" included tuition costs and I do not believe that calculation is correct when it involves 200 scholarships out of 11,000 students. Of course, there are travel and other out of pocket expenses associated with athletics, but I'll bet ticket revenue far exceeds those actual, out of pocket expenses including room and board. Therefore, anytime someone tells you that the tuition waivers "cost" the department money, they are talking about an accounting entry only. For all practical purposes, the institution is whole...that is one of the reasons why athletic scholarships are limited - they are virtually free and very easy to give away...There may be other, justifiable reasons, but tuition cost is not the reason for the increase in ticket prices - those costs do not exist for the institution as a whole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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