jimdahl

I still disagree with this, as did your consultants, as did SDSU's consultants, as does the SDSU administration. Oien has stated explicitly that SDSU will not move without a conference. Well, this is tricky. As you've pointed out, hockey is a very different sport from football or basketball for schools the size of UND or NDSU that play "big time" hockey but "small time" football and basketball. Take UND: 21 home games this season * 11,000/game = 231,000 through the turnstile For an NCC school to generate that sort of gate from another sport would be hard: Football-- assume 5 home games, average attendance needed: 46,000 (not gonna happen). Basketball-- assume 15 home games, average attendance needed: 15,400 (not gonna happen). That's why UND is so concerned about hockey -- they're getting the gate that a Minnesota gets in football or that North Carolina gets in basketball. No NCC school is going to hit those levels in football or basketball any time soon. That's why NDSU has been so interested in hockey for 20 years (despite lack of an interested fanbase). Further, another profitable sport and relationships with schools such as Minnesota and Wisconsin could actually have made it easier to go D-I. Ironically, those exact benefits are keeping UND from moving (grrrr) because they already feel "big time" enough.

Don't suggest this on USCHO or fear the wrath of some users who will point out (impolitely) that it's been discussed before. It's all economics. Not enough college hockey fans to buy the game.

How absolutely odd. Though Babich did indeed have 5 years coming into 2002 (so add 1 to get 6), I'm certain that Lennon just joined the Sioux in 1999. However, I've certainly got to give you credit, JBB. It was definitely an honest mistake. I also would've quoted the stats off the NCAA web site without any fear of them being wrong. Update: I just figured this out. That years/record is all-time for the coach so they include Lennon's two years at University of Mary.

I know it's heresy, but I think the insidecollegehockey.com power ranking is a better representation of the current relative strength of teams. The polls seem very reactionary to each weekend's results (anyone who lost must plummet, anyone who won must climb). Therefore, a little winning streak (despite against mediocre teams at home) vaults you up in polls. Looking at Mankato's relative ranking and at how much of a challenge they gave the Sioux at home doesn't make it seem like the Sioux are THAT much better. Of course, as kiork said, finding a way to win those games is what makes a championship team. Hopefully the Sioux can ride this momentum into a much more difficult second half of the schedule.

Your "facts" seem wrong in a way that drastically shifts the statistics in favor of your argument. Lennon joined UND in 1999 so has coached 4 seasons. His record over that period is 36-12 (game results tallied from this site): 1999 9-2 2000 8-3 2001 14-1 2002 5-6 Babich joined NDSU in Spring of 1997, so has finished 6 seasons as Bison head coach. His record over that period is 46-23. (cite: http://www.gobison.com/mens/football/coaches/) Using the real numbers it's quite a different picture, isn't it? Lennon, 36-12, 4 years, 1 national championship, 2 NCC titles Babich, 46-23, 6 years As far as this season: if you need to pick on a rival's 5-6 season to make your own 2-8 seasons more palatable, I hope you find a new rival soon, you may need one!

Hmmm... wasn't this tried last year? http://siouxsports.com/forums/index.php?ac...act=ST&f=1&t=68 It's kind of crazy. Apparently we have absolutely no patience to try to develop a goalie, but instead feel the need to somehow immediately put up a championship caliber team. That's a lot of pressure on whoever sits between the pipes.

Nice camera! I've only used older CoolPix, but the old model had a long lag time between hitting the button and image capture. It was also pretty slow at getting ready for the next photo, but that was because I was set at the highest resolution and it used an old Compact Flash card (apparently the new CF cards are significantly faster). My Minolta Dimage uses SmartMedia, which is noticeably faster than the old CF cards. The delay between pressing the button and the capture still seems like forever when trying to capture action shots. I have lots of funny pictures of an empty bobsled track from the Salt Lake Olympics. With bobsleds moving 90mph, I never even managed to get a close shot of one with a film camera (non-SLR).

Well, for Wanless, who as far as I know was unemployed, it was a great opportunity. For already employed coaches, I'm not sure Sac State is actually a better final destination than UND (depends on how much you value nice weather, I guess). However, I definitely agree that any ambitious coach who wanted to end up at an even better school could have a great opportunity to use Sac State as a stepping stone. Rebuilding any sort of a program there would be a fine feather in the cap and help line up better D-I coaching jobs. Some coaches also might relish the challenge of trying to build a new program rather than ride in the comfort of an existing (usually) successful program. I guess it all depends what motivates Dale and what his ambitions are.

Hey, we resembl... er... resent that remark. Fortunately, NDSU managed to save us from actually being worst. We are going to miss you when you're gone Back to the D-IAA move--there's no doubt the transition period will be difficult and have a negative impact on recruiting, but it is only temporary. I think that's a big part of UND's hesitation, they're afraid to go through the years of pain. Thomas hinted at as much in the earlier statement about how if the rules became less punitive, that may sway them.

Makes me wonder if Lennon's chances to move weren't hurt a little by this season? I suspect he appeared on a few D-IAA institution's "short lists" after the 2001 season, but he failed to sell himself this year. However, as dbarker pointed out, I'm not sure everyone would consider Sac State a better coaching job than UND. There's a lot of overlap between D-IAA and D-II, and UND is (usually) considered near the top of D-II and Sac State near the bottom of D-IAA. If he wanted to use it as a stepping stone, it's probably a great opportunity; if he's not that ambitious, it might not be a much better job. Anyway, thanks for pointing this out JBB. I actually hadn't heard it before.

Just because an article in the Fargo newspaper happens to be about wrestling doesn't mean Star2City can't quote it because he's a fan of a school without wrestling. Absolutely ridiculous. UND has won 7 D-I national championships. How many have SDSU or NDSU won? UND has 4 more sports than NDSU. You're barking up the wrong tree on this one, SDSUFAN. I don't think even JBB is going to jump in to Sioux-bash with you on our sports sponsored vs. NDSU's.

Nope. There are quite a few sports that only one of the schools has exclusively. For men, NDSU has wrestling, UND has swimming & diving, and ice hockey. For women, UND has hockey, swimming & diving, and tennis. I think, also, that when NDSU becomes D-I, indoor/outdoor track will become separate sports.

http://www.adn.com/sports/story/2239923p-2306588c.html Story is about an Alaska walkon, Underwood. The interesting quote is: Nice to see that the arena is starting to provide a bit of an intimidation factor to the opponents instead of to our own team

I agree entirely. Just as you hang out here continuously putting down UND and its affiliates because it's successes make you uncomfortable, there are plenty of UND supporters who do the same. Don't forget, though, that plenty of us are concerned with NDSU's division change because the next step is going to be a groundswell of support from that element for UND to move (a keeping up with the Jones's, if you will). Though I support a UND move (and an NDSU move), I think NDSU did it absolutely the wrong way and hope sincerely that UND learns from their mistakes. 54% of NDSU faculty opposed the move (and that doesn't mean 46% favored it, there were a lot of "undecided"). As you said, it's very important to keep the impact on the entire University in mind. Another mistake NDSU made--ignoring the opinion of the faculty who clearly didn't believe that it would benefit academics/research.

Coincidentally timed, BusinessWeek had an article in the December 2 edition (that I received today) on philanthropy. Ralph & Betty Engelstad are listed as the #39 most generous philanthropists in the U.S. There's no mention of him in the article, so it's basically just the following listing in a table: Ralph & Betty Engelstad Vegas hotel owner gave $100m from 1998-2002 causes: college sports estimated total giving $110m current net worth $500m %wealth donated 22% We're truly lucky to have been associated with so generous a benefactor.

I'm posting coverage as soon as I uncover it on the front hockey page ( http://siouxsports.com/hockey.php ). So far the Forum article has grown a bit (if you saw it early) and a Star Tribune article has surfaced. I suspect we'll see more in-depth coverage and retrospective over the next couple days.

Easy there, killer. I went to the site. If you'd simply scroll up, you'd see that I was the one who provided the link to the site and quotes from the story in first place. BTW-- not reposting copyrighted materials isn't my rule, it's the law of land. I was simply asking if you'd seen the pamphlet that the article indicates she distributes. I've already been bombarded with all the pro-move propaganda that the school distributes, I don't need to see any more of that. I was curious what she had to say, but apparently you've not actually seen it.

SDSUFAN -- Since you seem to have known about this petition and communicated with Ms. Jost in the past, you wouldn't by chance have a copy of this infamous pamphlet that she's distributing with the petitions? I'm curious if the "errors" are things like actually incorrect numbers, or if they're challenges to some of the more controversial assertions (e.g. that the move will aid academics).

I think, rather, that he was saying by tracing the date of publication on the varying schedules, you can figure out which is most current. The 2000 media guide listed the 2003 game as being in Fargo. The 2002 media guide lists the 2003 game as being in Grand Forks. Hence, the game was changed from Fargo to Grand Forks at some point. UND's conference schedule as of the 2002 media guide (minus the UNC game) was 3 home, 4 away. While it's possible that shifts since the publication of the 2002 media guide have resulted in the game being moved back to Fargo, that would have required UND to change at least two other games, sending giant ripples throughout the entire NCC schedule. Since next year is NDSU's last in the conference, leaving that game as-is (in Grand Forks) seems least disruptive. Particularly since taking your schedule, but moving the UND game to Grand Forks, results in NDSU having a 4 home/4 away schedule. To confuse things more. What's up with this (from Oct. 8, 2002)? http://www.grandforks.com/mld/grandforks/s...rts/4239843.htm

http://www.sdsucollegian.com/news/333934.h...tml?mkey=525762 but on the flip side...

I manually scanned the archive of game results here and uncovered the last time UND had back-to-back shutouts was Feb 21-22, 1997, hosting Alaska Anchorage (2-0, 4-0). http://siouxsports.com/hockey/1996/1996.htm (Gives me flashbacks to when the web site had lots of text and not much color Looks like we didn't make the streak for 3, saving me from having to dig out the really old Sioux history books.

My understanding is that the only network DirectTV carries that ever shows Sioux games is Fox Sports North. So that would probably only be the Gopher series and possibly WCHA tournament. The Badger series isn't even being shown in Madison, so isn't likely being produced for any wide distribution.

You're doing a nice job of ensuring that the Sioux get disproportionate coverage. Our game result is the lead story, again. Combine that with a couple features, and the Sioux seem to be about half the coverage on USCHO!

I wondered how long it would take for you to dismiss the statements from SDSU's administration and the conferences that aren't interested in NDSU as propaganda. We're obsessing with the conference clause because it's the key to failure (as pointed out by NDSU's consultants and discussed here ad nauseum). SDSU is playing it smart and trying to make sure they have a conference before they move. I think it irks you because it validates everything I've said (and reiterates the folly of NDSU's rushed move without a conference). I understand your position -- after everything you've posted here you can't admit that NDSU shouldn't have moved without a conference. Why do you keep assuming that we wish NDSU ill despite that we correct you every time you say it? Many of us would love a D-I NCC made up of those teams willing to make the move. The fact remains: NDSU ignored it's consultants' advice that conference affiliation was critical. That doesn't mean things won't work out, it just presents a much more difficult road.