star2city

Talk about displaying insecurity and projecting it. Fact: NDSU failed to get in the BSC. Very Possible: UND getting into the Big Sky. Strange how an overriding theme in bisonville is: "UND will fail to keep up with NDSU." Their fans want this to be true so badly that they feel compelled to repeat it over and over again, hoping that somehow that will make it come true. The converse of that theme is not prevalent here on Siouxsports. OBTW, you will get in the Gateway and hope you are pleased with it. Furthermore, I do wish NDSU all the "luck" in pursuing their dreams, however little value that has. But here's the difference: I hope and pray UND follows on a path toward a destiny that it was created for.

The only people that are acting cocky on this subject are know-it-all bison fans who think the possiblity of UND --> BSC is absurd based on their own dismal experience. After all, if the brilliant leadership of the demigod Chapman failed to get NDSU into the BSC, what possible chance could a leaderless UND have. But the reality of the situation is this: UND will succeed where NDSU has failed. BTW, in case you're not aware, this is a Sioux forum, and reading and posting are entirely at your option (among other things).

Why listen to me? Listen to your favorite Bison buddy, Steve Hallstrom. He states it gonna happen. If UND's Harmeson states something off-the-record to Hallstrom, even Hallstrom recognizes that Harmeson's word is practically a sure thing. Nothing may happen during this Big Sky meeting, but UND --> BSC is coming down and you can't stop it even by pretending it won't.

Looks like the Mid Continent Conference will give NDSU / SDSU all kinds of cable coverage. Of the MidCon schools, it appears only UMKC has a cable deal. NDSU and SDSU have yet to sign any kind of cable deal, but certainly their AD's have been working on that for a long time. If you have an existing cable network, sure helps to telecast games on short notice. So when the Big Sky added UNC, UNC effectively delivered them the Altitude network. When the Big Sky was considering NDSU and SDSU, neither school could even deliver their own local markets on cable. To repeat, UND's FSSN is a major asset for getting into a conference and give UND conference opportunities sooner than NDSU and SDSU experienced in their transitions.

Manke was interviewed in the post-game, and stated he would be o.k.

From the Sports Economist Blog IMHO, this Coasian Solution approach would have made sense if the NCAA actually had attempted it. Instead, what the NCAA is doing is giving the wealthiest (Florida State, Utah) a free pass, taxing the poor (Southeastern Oklahoma, Chowan), and gouging the middle class (UND, La-Monroe, Ark St., IUP). The middle income group gets hurt the worst because the changes are almost or more costly than the upper class, have less of an income base to pay for changes and can least afford to alienate their smaller fan base. Ironically (and perhaps just hopeful thinking), the NCAA may end up paying much more. The Say Anything Blog has been quoting $2.6 Million in damages as what UND is asking:North Dakota Alleges $2.6 Million In Damages Over UND Logo IMHO, this number is not at all correct as the damages being sought: the $2.6 Million is what it would cost the REA to be retrofitted to another logo in the event we lose the lawsuit. In actuality, if I understand the legal process, a jury would have to decide what the monetary damage that the NCAA caused by capriciously imposing this "hostile and abusive" claim on UND. For example, if the NCAA's actions did indeed cause UND the loss of an annual hockey tournament, the value of that loss needs to be determined. If the average annual gain from that tournament would have been $500,000, the net present value of a loss of an annual regular season tournament is maybe $7 million. Triple the damages for antitrust, and the jury could say damages are $20 million, just from that one issue. The poor media publicity that resulted from the NCAA declaring UND to be "hostile and abusive" could possibly be an even more major $ issue.

GaryP: In a previous posting, I had stated that violence seems much less likely to occur in Christian schools than in public schools. Tragically, this week proved me in error. But it would seem that the events of this week would give you some answers regarding your concerns: York (Pa.) Daily Record

Even money that Nick Coleman has another piece in the Star-Tribune lambasting UND and North Dakota within the week?

If the re-writing of the policy somehow does not somehow exempt Florida State, the NCAA will have congressional issues. In many respects, the NCAA has already accomplished much of what they intended - of the 18 schools only CMU, FSU, Utah, Catawba, & Mississippi College received exemptions. UND, Arkansas St, and Newberry are the holdovers. P.S. Forgot about Illinois and William & Mary.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/arti...423/1004/SPORTS

Had been unaware of this until reading the complaint:

UBC looks to become first Canadian NCAA member - Will Rock Canadian Sports So which conference will take UBC? Again, the most logical candidates in the near term are the WCC (which is all private and mostly Catholic/Jesuit schools) and the Big Sky. UBC in a league within three years?:

UNC is another vote for UND. When Sac St goes to the WAC, the vote would be, at a minimum, 6-yes for UND, and at most 2-no. DU may well be in the BSC before UND, that would make the vote 7-yes for UND and at most 2-no. UND will be in. The financials of the Altitude/Dakota-wide cable deal may very well switch NAU and PSU's vote if UND membership is not a net liability. Altitude wants an expanded range and would reward whoever (i.e. the Big Sky) can deliver more cable systems. As stated earlier, the relationship between FSSN, MidContinent Communications could well result in Altitude also being on MidContinent Cable if UND --> BSC, effectively delivering two more states to Altitude and the BSC. FargoBison: You are one of the more thoughtful posters around, but I respectfully disagree. The Great West might be a possibility for a short-time, but NDSU will likely be in the Gateway then.

It is actually serving as a cash cow: the REA is paying off the bonds used to finance the Betty. The REA is also responsible for greatly increasing the funding the the Fighting Sioux club. The REA has also made the land around the REA extremely valuable, which is giving the University as a whole a substantial revenue stream from long-term rental agreements that the athletic department does not receive. Nor does the athletic department receive the royalities from the sale of Fighting Sioux merchandise, which have also increased substantially. The utiility costs that the REA pays UND also helps UND by marginally reducing its total costs. Finally, just the presence of the REA on campus benefits UND immeasurably. I would agree that much of the benefits of the REA do not directly help the athletic department as much as it benefits UND as a whole. Practically every major arena and theater in the country sells overprices food and beverages. The REA is no different. The deficit everyone refers to which this athletic department has is because of tuition waivers - no "real" money is exchanged. With UND benefitting as much as it does from the REA, UND should be offering tuition waivers to the athletic program. What's been forgotten since the REA construction is that tuition has been going up by ~15% annually, which means that the scholarship requirements have been climbing at that rate too. If tuition increases hadn't been so steep, the athletic department finances wouldn't be nearly as stretched. The athletic department budget is nearly double what it was five years ago. How in the world would UND athletics have managed if it still only had the Old REA and Hyslop to generate more finances? The AD probably gets more criticism on this board than the REA manager (at least in this thread), so not sure of the last point. Constructive criticism is great, but all too often, that is lacking. Actually, some believe that UND does need to look at what sports offerings are best suited for what our facilities and weather offer. That should be on the table.

Sometimes, I do wonder if I'm stuck in some time wharp relative to 2004, only now the tables are ironically turned. The same kind of "jealousy and wishful" talk was hurled by Bison fans at my preposterous concept that UNC would get a Big Sky bid over NDSU/SDSU because of media/cable issues. Now, being consistent and using those same principles, UND with its FSSN should be obviously be of interest to the BSC. But NDSU fans, now claiming to "comprehend" media issues, ridicule the very idea that UND would be in the Big Sky because of its media capabilities. Never mind that UND with its FSSN has essentially transformed the Dakotas and NW Minnesota into a Sacramento-sized media market. Law of Bison fan conventional wisdom: when Bison fans reach agreement, the opposite happens: Sure things according to conventional Bison wisdom: UND will lose to Northern Iowa, badly. UND athletics is a basket case financially. UND athletics will be stuck as an independent for a long, long time. The FSSN has no impact on conference decision making. UND has absolutely no leadership, and is doomed. NDSU will surpass UND in stature. Grand Forks has nothing whatsoever going for it and is destined to be a hell-hole. The Law of Bison Fan Conventional Wisdom strongly affirms ---> The future is very bright for UND and it athletic program.

Would he see that certain athletic department staffers that post on the internet are driven off, too? This argument is beyond insane. So lets go back to an Old REA and Hyslop and really put UND athletics on the DI map? The state of ND gave a mandate that there would be no tax dollars going to support the REA, including utilities and every other cost. The whining on this site gets unbelievable at times.

A non-conference matchup with USD or SDSU would generate a large SD audience. A UND/UM or UND/MSU matchup would be huge in western ND and proportional to an ESPN2 matchup in SD. So having a system like FSSN that gains exposure for all conference schools and a business relationship with MidContinent Communications that would enhance a conference's media package ($'s) will not help attain conference affiliation? What exactly could be fallacious about that? Your argument flies in the face of all conference realignment over the past decade. Media footprint and dollars are what conferences are after.

A news story today in the Sioux Falls paper about Jerome's altercation at a SF eatery: Alleged racial taunts led to fight outside eatery Players find attitude helps adjustment

Have you read the previous posts? So when was the opportune time for NDSU to create its own distribution system? Answer: prior to moving to DI, or secondly, immediately after moving to DI, or third, as soon as possible. We are waiting .... waiting. .... waiting ... waiting ................................. If NDSU athletics had an established media network similar to FSSN, the likelihood that NDSU would have had to go begging for a conference would have been much reduced. Actually, if you ask the people at MidCON, FSSN is more popular than anticipated in South Dakota. Wait til a Montana-UND football or basketball game becomes a regular on FSSN, and NDSU is competing against W Illinois in both. What is going to bring out the most loyalty?

For MidContinent Communications alone, every major ND or SD city except Fargo. Fargo's Cable One airs the FSSN. Other smaller systems like Jamestown area and NW Minnesota cable companies also carry FSSN.

While the future seems promising too:

I disagree. UNC's inclusion in the Big Sky gave the Big Sky coverage on the Altitude Network. That was a huge win. UNC had both geography and market going for it. NDSU/SDSU had neither. BTW, if NDSU had a deal with ESPN, it would be in the Missouri Valley or in CUSA at this moment, never mind the Big Sky. ESPN is the holy grail of the college sports world; conference commissioners would be begging and pleading with Gene to accept invitations. Without a doubt they do change. With the Old REA, Hyslop, and Memorial Stadium, a FSSN would probably not have been possible. The REA (and to a lesser extent the Alerus) changed that. The REA and Alerus both made Sioux sports entertainment events, rather than (to the dismay of pure fans) just the game itself. TV is about entertainment and perceptions. NDSU badlly needs a stand-alone arena to accomplish their longer term goals. A renovated BSA won't help that much with either a cable network or when NDSU wants to upgrade conferences. I actually admire NDSU for placing as much emphasis (and money) on sports like softball, volleyball, wrestling, and soccer, but a new arena is paramount for NDSU's future, IMHO. While I have never been to an NDSU football game in the FargoDome, from all reports it sounds as if the crowd is very uninvolved in the game. Even if the football approaches FargoDome capacity, more enthusiasm is needed to make it more attractive to TV. If adding UND adds to the bottom line of other MidCon schools, UND will have an invite to the MidCon. By the same logic, it also holds for the Big Sky. I believe UND has made a case for the Big Sky schools to benefit financially (largely because of cable issues), while, unfortunately for NDSU/SDSU, they were unable to accomplish that to this date.

As GeauxSioux has already mentioned, if it is so easy, why hasn't NDSU already done this? If NDSU had had a cable network in place, they could have been a more compelling pick as the Big Sky's 10th team. IMHO, there are a number of reasons why NDSU will have a difficult time establishing a cable network: first and foremost - no hockey and the 20-odd dates that go with it, college hockey fans are fiercely loyal viewers while college basketball fans are much more fickle, UND's hockey schedule is very attractive (Big Ten schools) while NDSU's basketball home scheduling has been far from attractive (and won't be that much more attractive in the MidCon with non-hardcore fans), the REA venue gives the TV viewer the impression of an event while the BSA as a venue is not very TV marketable, and NDSU has been reluctant to sacrifice home attendance to build a cable audience. UND, on the other hand, especially in the first couple of years, sacrificed attendance at football and, to a much lesser extent, basketball, to build up the FSSN. The bottom line is: if you are MidContinent Communications, who would you want to associate your company name with, the REA (and top tier college hockey) or the BSA (and third tier DI basketball)? Interesting that MidContinent Communications seems to be expanding their relationship with UND and the REA:

Still, thats practically our current endowment being raised annually. Something is up. And two full tanks of gas at Stop-n-Go!

Interesting quotes from Western Kentucky President Gary Ransdell in WKU football nears vote on Division I-A So does this mean NDSU fan talk of going IA or UND's Harmeson's talk of going to DIA football may be gone?