UND08

I am too...I get that he brings continuity but last year's performance was a major letdown in my book...I like some of the portal additions but there are a lot of questions for me.

I get that you thoroughly enjoy bagging on anyone that might not wear the greenest of green shaded glasses...but the fact that our DC has ZERO years of coaching experience outside of Grand Forks and our OC has one year of D3 position coaching and one year of HS position coaching experience outside of UND is not the strength that you think it is. Danny's done a decent job with his side of the ball, and Joel might too...but that lack of diversity doesn't serve the program very well in my opinion (is it because nobody else wants to come here for what we offer? Nobody wants to work for Bubba? Or are we too closed-minded about doing things "a little differently than we have in the past"?)...but then again I learned everything I know about the game from ESPN, so my opinion obviously shouldn't matter... In my opinion when you consider the body of work...I don't think Joel EARNED the job...that being said he's loyal and the timing of the hire sucks...so he's going to get a chance that he may or may not actually deserve. I hope he does something good with it...because if he doesn't us "detractors" are going to be ABSOLUTELY MISERABLE on this board come fall...haha! And in reference to the bolded part of your post...job performance matters. It matters in the real world...it matters in coaching...and it SHOULD matter in Grand Forks (more than it currently does IMO). Like I said I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt...but I'm not confident. I hope he proves me wrong...

Are they using the Hyslop for anything right now that won't be re-located prior to the demo date??? I love the Hyslop memories as much as anyone else...but it's the product of a bygone era. If it's not practical and supportive of the mission of UND then it should go if they have the funds/plans to do something better with the space. I have loved every new facility that's been built since the Kennedy era at UND...I'm excited to see what they can do with this space.

Nick and PSP have been an absolute godsend for high school sports in Minot and Bismarck. Lots of great content and the production quality is frankly extremely impressive given that it's not a TV provider doing it.

Counterpoint - many fans get frustrated watching schools just down I-29 from us dominate the landscape while we plod along hoping for 7-4 and a first round exit somewhere 800+ miles away. Being in the field does not equal being a contender (I personally wish we had a 16 team field seeded 1-16 but that's another topic for another time). And you are right...we've made some modest/decent strides the last couple of years. That being said the gap between the SU's and us hasn't narrowed much. UND-FB-FAN might be annoying to a lot of you on here...but to some of us the "aw shucks we'll get em next year" mindset is just as annoying. I will say thankfully in my conversations I've had with people in the know the attitude in the locker room/coaches offices is much less "aw shucks" than I would have expected it to be this fall. That's a good thing. Hopefully we can come up with a plan to take the next step and continue to build, and not go backward like we did in 2017.

In a roundabout way my post was agreeing with your line of thinking while at the same time trying to soften the blow for the "ever loyal" folks on here...I was trying to play middleman! Hahaha... I see both sides of the coin...but I tend to come down closer to your camp than all your haters. I want this program to have the best resources possible to compete. We currently lag behind some of our peers (not behind many of them...but the ones we lag are very "visible"). I'm not blaming any stakeholders for where we sit...but it is what it is, and we need to close that gap. That's an organizational issue more than it is a coaching staff issue. We need to do better. And I said it once and I'll say it again...this is D1...not the NAIA. Wins and losses matter. NDSU wouldn't put up with a program that struggles to ascend. Hell I never thought our hockey fans would either...lofty expectations aren't a bad thing in my book! "This is division one football! It's the (MVFC)! It ain't intramurals!... Go play intramurals brother!" ~ Dan Hawkins (mostly) All that said...these are important hires that I hope we get right...especially given the time crunch! Hopefully it doesn't impact our recruiting too badly...but junior days have to be right around the corner!

Here's the thing that I see on "inbreeding" for what it's worth (and it's not much). There's a lot that goes into coaching that doesn't play out on the scoreboard. Bubba seems to appreciate that and factor that into staffing decisions when looking to hire from within vs an external hire. Many fans (assuming folks like UND-FB-FAN and others) see a team not performing at a level that keeps up with their biggest rivals, and wonders if internal/inbreeding (ie hiring someone with UND connections) is the best idea. I personally can appreciate both points of view. I will say my guess is the internal type hires happen a lot at UND because our salary pool for assistant coaches lags our regional rivals. THAT IS A PROBLEM! It should be a significant priority of the program for the AD. If Bubba is given chicken crap to work with, he's gotta make chicken salad out of it...and I think to an extent he's done a good job of it. That being said...I do wish we could make more external types of hires, as diversity of thought and new ideas would be welcome. Danny did a great job of bringing that as an internal hire when he got the OC job. I don't assume that's going to happen with every hire we make. All that said...position coaches move on often. It's good for them to do so, so that they can coach on multiple staffs and build up a diverse body of knowledge. I think one thing that annoys me is that our RB coach leaves (as is likely to be expected giving what we pay that position) and everyone's first thought is "GREG HARDIN." There are people within our fanbase that don't love much about that era of UND football, but more importantly to me is Greg qualified to coach a position that he's never played with his body of work? EWU didn't exactly light the world on fire in his first year there. I'd hope that we conduct a national search and hire the best qualified candidate, whether it's an alum or not. We've had 3-4 RB coaches in a row that weren't UND alums...and they all did a pretty good job for us. I trust Bubba and his senior staff will make a good decision on this one. Now on the DC side...the timing sucks here. We may have to hire internally...and I'm not sure we have any great candidates on staff, especially given our defensive performance last year. If judging by performance on the field alone, none of our defensive staff deserve a promotion in my eyes. That being said, I'm sure Bubba looks at more than that...and furthermore somebody is going to get that job regardless of if they are deserving or not. That's a big break for somebody on the staff...and I sure hope they take advantage of it! Bubba probably does too...because a step backwards on the field this year will be met with plenty of scrutiny...probably a lot more than some of the fine posters on this forum would like to see. That's D1 athletics...the product on the field at most places directly translates into your job security.

Mary and Minot programs have been pretty bad for the most part since they moved up (Minot more so than Mary)...but Bagnell can coach offense. He'll do well in an offensive assistant role wherever he's going.

Oversight on my part to not include FW-M (I was focused on the classic bedroom community "Big B" schools)...The first Satan (I'm stubborn haha)/Indian matchup that happens there's a 100% chance I will make the trek to Devils Lake in time for the start of the C squad game if I have to in order to get a seat. That was the EXACT matchup I was thinking about!

Williston/Watford comparison works because those teams are of similar abilities right now...but if we went back to the Hennessey/Qvale days of Williston a game against Watford might be convenient but does very little for either side. As these schools continue to co-op and others consolidate, travel will get to be greater and greater and there's not a whole lot that can be done about it. Many of the 3 class supporters come from a "this will give the most benefit to the small schools" mindset. I think the biggest benefactors of this are the AA schools. They gain the ability to play crossover (WDA/EDC) games against teams of similar skill, which will make their programs better. They can also play down a division or across state lines to preserve/renew rivalries or match up with teams of similar talent levels. Likewise they get to kick out the outliers in both geography and competition. A game in Valley City does nothing for Davies, similar to a game in Watford City for Minot. You only get something like 20 regular season games...those teams now have an ability to use them more how they see fit. The middle class will develop into a fun class over time imo as long as programs stay of similar quality (big if). Devils Lake probably has the inside track right away due to having a pretty strong core of younger kids on the boys side currently, but I could see a Rugby/Kindred/CC/Thompson absolutely challenging them (especially in time). Those schools take basketball seriously, and I think a state tourney featuring the best 8 teams in that class would make for compelling basketball, even if the general public interest isn't there right away. The small schools benefit on paper...but they're going to lose "The B" as they know it (really it died 30 years ago). If you remove all the good teams from Class B, you do allow new blood in your state tournament, but you also water down the quality of play at said tournament. I've been a dyed in the wool Class B guy my whole life, but I've watched enough bad small town basketball in recent years to know that this version of Class B basketball does very little to move the needle in my world. But if it saves small town schools from co-oping and gives more kids a chance to play then it worked. I'm skeptical that will actually happen. Is the plan perfect? It's not...nothing would be. There will still be top dogs and door mats in any alignment, and a lot of that goes to program culture and coaching. This will strengthen the top basketball playing programs in the state, and I'm all for that! I'm not envious of the ADs that have to re-schedule everything though!

Williston and Minot too haha!

You're "technically" right...but a sharp vote of no confidence from the most active fans of the program looks a lot like a referendum on Coach Sather...and that should carry some weight with the brass. I like Sather...I still think he can coach...but for whatever reason the men's basketball program is in an unacceptable place in my book. I believe he has one year left on his contract. Lame duck status is a bad option that will be used against us in recruiting. I don't like the idea of starting over but I think that's what's warranted, absent a late season run. I will be the first to pipe up about lack of support relative to our peers anchoring the program down, because I think it's a major issue...but this was supposed to be the year we saw improvement...and so far that's not happening.

This is good! If they could find a way to squeeze even 4,500 well-configured seats into the Betty that would be awesome! And the new practice facility will address a critical need for the basketball programs!

My memory might be getting foggy...but if I recall we do have a practice facility for basketball...The Betty! I was in college when it first opened and it was designed to be more of an auxilary type of facility for basketball (primary for volleyball), as most games were played in the REA at the time. Somewhere along the line that changed...and while the atmosphere is much better, it's not designed to be a primary D1 basketball facility. The department needs to come up with a plan to address this if they want to compete in the D1 hoops arena.

We all know that Bison fans get worked up over almost anything and expect nothing less than perfection...but Randy Hedberg had it right. This is the new normal...the portal hit us last year, it hit NDSU this year...SDSU might yet see it in future years. The biggest thing in my mind is making sure you recruit players that "want to be here"...that won't cure the defections completely...but it'll help in my mind. If you recruit somebody that comes to UND or any FCS/lower FBS school because it's their highest offer...they'll leave the minute they show they can play at a higher level. That being said...McFooly sucks...he's such a clown! UNDFootball360 has it completely right about McFooly...to make the argument he did without any comment from any of the players transferring out is so laughable! Hope he doesn't skip shoulder day so he can continue carrying water for the Bison like the fanboy that he is!

I don't think I take it clearly as far as UND-FB-FAN...but I'm not going to speak for him. I tend to agree with you...the frustrating part is a lot of times to people like me it appears that nothing is being done to rectify the issues at hand. Maybe that's because nothing can be done...but if that's the case the program is going to regress further and further behind its peers...and I don't take that kind of thing well at all. That being said...I have no qualms with Coach Schweigert. I might not agree with every play call or scheme, but I'm certainly not qualified to be a D1 football coach, so I'll just complain about them semi-anonymously on this message board haha. Isn't that what it's all about?!? My qualms go to the administration level. If we are going to have a championship caliber football team, then our athletic department needs to give them the horses to have one. I don't think that happens...for lots of reasons. I get that NDSU and SDSU don't have hockey...but we used to beat those guys regularly, and dangit I think that needs to be the goal still (and not just a wish...plan for it to happen/make it happen).

First off...I'm not advocating for any change within the football program. I'd frankly feel encouraged by a sense of urgency that I feel is lacking. NDSU goes FBS and boom we are even further behind. We've done little to close the gap with them on the field...and it bothers me that more of us don't feel that way. I will say that knowing coaches that I've known in the past I'm fairly confident that my attitude is closer to the attitude within the football hq than what is displayed on this site. If it's not...that's unacceptable in my book. The last half of your last sentence is where I think the problem lies and is frankly the brunt of my frustrations. Football needs more resources to succeed. Basketball does too. These are the two most popular sports by far in the country, and we are playing them with one hand tied behind our back. If we don't think we can close the gap to give our programs a chance (or at least give them a fair deal within the athletic department/REA comingled web/mess), then that's a tough pill to swallow for me. I plan on donating to the football priority needs fund today, because I'm not going to complain about something and not put my money where my mouth is. I wish I could add another zero or two to that donation...but that'll come in time. I love this program...nobody who knows me questions that...but I'm not afraid to ask some tough questions either. All that said...I really like what we've done this offseason so far. I'm optimistic that those efforts will pay off on the field in a few months!

I'll give them credit they lost quite a few close games last year...but if they are picked in the bottom half of the Big Sky for 2023 (which I assume they probably will be) then I really think that we should be able to comfortably take care of business at home if we are going to be a "Championship Caliber" team in 2023.

I'll say this...I expect us to curb stomp NAU at home to the point where I can relax for the entire 4th quarter. Something like 36-17 sounds about right. That SHOULD be the expectation of this program if it wants to go where we all think it's going to go. If that's not what happens I'll be sorely disappointed... That being said...I have 9 years of a body of work to fall back on that tells me that what my expectation for that game is likely won't happen. Not saying we won't win...but it'll likely be a 4th quarter game. We were pumped with a last second come from behind win last year, and the Skydome is a tough place to play...but NAU went 3-8 last year and hasn't had a winning season since 2017.. If we want to be a perennial contender we have to take care of those 3-8/4-7 type teams handily. Sorry if ya'll disagree with that assessment. Why does it feel like it's against some kind of unwritten law within the UND fandom to want more from a program then you're currently getting?? That seriously bothers me...and it happens across many, if not most of the programs. I get it...we were the 3rd best team in the mighty MVFC last year...that's pretty good! Also we made the playoffs and finished in the top 25...that's in the top 20% of FCS! Problem is...we are 5 rungs on the ladder below the two closest FCS programs to Grand Forks, and some of our most core supporters aren't willing to look holistically at the program and ask what we can do to close that gap! I'm not advocating for any particular change...but just once I'd like to see us have 1/3 of the drive that the NDSU fanbase has! They're off their rockers 50-60% of the time down there, but they always want more from their programs, and would never settle for Top 25-ish. I hate them so much but I respect them for that. I wish some of that would flow upstream.

Agree 100%...I really like what we've done this offseason so far. Hopefully we can see it pay off next fall!

I get what you're saying...but I will say I don't view NAU as a "huge" game. I view it as a game that we should physically dominate at home and win going away. If we lose that's a sign of a much bigger problem in my eyes...it's time to expect to win games like this one going away. On that...I will say that I actually agree with UND-FB-FAN.

But is he wrong though??? I get beating the dead horse is annoying to some...but NAU at home is a game that good teams win handily. Will we do that? I hope so...but knowing this program's knack for close games against teams that maybe shouldn't be close I won't hold my breath...

Normally I'd be all in on comparing the two coaches...but one has had to deal with the portal...one didn't have to. It's not quite apples to apples in my eyes. Would Jones have been able to hold his best teams together if the portal was available? I kind of doubt it...to be fair that's not a critique of Jones either. He just never had to deal with that as a head coach.

At Northern...absolutely! At Hills I think it was a different story...If you can win there...you can win just about anywhere. Interestingly enough their current coach Ryan Thompson has done an absolutely unreal job with the Jackets...he has them at 12-0 and #3 in D2 (after a D2 final four appearance last year). They also draw significantly more fans than we do. If you build it fans will show up, I guess. And if you can do it in Spearfish, SD...then you sure as heck should be able to do it in Grand Forks imo!

I'll preface this by saying I went into this a huge Sather fan...and I think I still am. If UND makes a move after the end of this season, I won't be the least bit surprised to see Coach Sather go and have success at another school. You don't just elevate a program from nothing to National Title contender (BHSU) and then take a successful program and push it further (Northern) if you don't know how to coach. That being said...the portal (and how we've handled/adapted to it) has been a significant detriment to this program. I see one D1 and one D2 transfer into the roster, and a bunch of juco guys. Compared to what's transferred out, the talent deficiency is significant. Of course...if you were a transfer portal D1 talent...is UND a school you'd want to play at? It's cold, isolated, not overly successful and posessing very average facilities. This becomes an issue of if you cut bait on Sather, who are you going to get to replace him that's any better, based on the resources being put into the program? I wouldn't hold my breath for a miracle worker, because Sather had a pretty good resume coming into the job. Maybe he was just a "D2 coach" as some say...but I'd argue that Northern supports basketball at a higher level than UND does. They have a nicer arena, much better fan support, and a high-profile coach for a D2 school. This seems to be similar to the discussion on the football side with Bubba. Difference there in my opinion is that we support football at an average to above average rate in the FCS from an institutional level (although we lag far behind NDSU and SDSU so it doesn't feel that way). I don't think we come close to even average at the mid major level when it comes to institutional support for basketball, and we are "getting what we paid for" at some level. If I was evaluating our AD, this trend in perhaps the two most popular sports in this country would be a major issue. Can it be fixed? I don't know...hockey gets so much emphasis I'm not sure there's a stomach for anything more. But when I see the impact that building a solid mid-major basketball program has had on other schools in this country...it sure is awfully sour tasting to see us not even attempt to get there.