Sioux in the future!

[darell1976]

THis is my first post here. I am a die hard green and white UND Fighting Sioux all the way guy living in Bisonville. Now that UND has moved to D1 i have some questions for Sioux fans and other fans as well. 1. Is it 5 years til the Sioux will be eligible for playoffs when they start D1-AA so 2013? 2. Is UND going to follow NDSU and eventually move to a better conference example the Gateway or Big Sky or etc. or stay in the GW? 3. Is a UND-NDSU game in works anytime soon?? I miss the hype and a Sioux victory over the Bison. And to add to my first question how long is UND not elegible for basketball? I heard its longer than football isn't it?? Any talk about a conference for UND basketball too. Thanks for letting my join in on this board.

[Delroy Ten Thumbs]

THis is my first post here. I am a die hard green and white UND Fighting Sioux all the way guy living in Bisonville. Now that UND has moved to D1 i have some questions for Sioux fans and other fans as well. 1. Is it 5 years til the Sioux will be eligible for playoffs when they start D1-AA so 2013? 2. Is UND going to follow NDSU and eventually move to a better conference example the Gateway or Big Sky or etc. or stay in the GW? 3. Is a UND-NDSU game in works anytime soon?? I miss the hype and a Sioux victory over the Bison. And to add to my first question how long is UND not elegible for basketball? I heard its longer than football isn't it?? Any talk about a conference for UND basketball too. Thanks for letting my join in on this board.

I think b-ball has to wait at least 7 years. I'm not positive. I think that the conference issue is a little out of UND's hands. All we can do is apply, conferences make a call on what schools to accept. The best best is for more schools like W. Kentucky to move up to 1A to allow scheduling difficuties for conferences. My guess is that the AC will try and play UND within 3 years, basketball even sooner. Are UND and the AC more appealing to conferences as a package? IMO I think that some conferences see this as two long travel dates.

[Hawkster]

I believe it is in the 5th year that they become playoff eligible, so in that case 2012. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong.

You are right, at least according to the way I understand it. First year we are still D2, then four more years of D1. The first year of eligibility would be 2012.

As to conferences, no one has a crystal ball to see out that far. Something will open up, just no use getting excited out it until about 2011.

[darell1976]

Thanks to everyone that responded. Its kinda sad that they have to wait to become eligible for playoffs instead of being eligible right away but maybe the NCAA has a reason to do this. Can't wait to see new Sioux opponents especially in basketball, can we play Florida too or is that invitation just for the Bison . I was excited when the Sioux played Kansas years ago even though i knew the Sioux would get beat they played great against a D1 powerhouse.

[Hammersmith]

1. UND will become fully DI(playoff eligible) during the 2012-13 academic year.

2. Unknown at this point and outside of UND's control.

3. No, and unknown when it will happen. Buning has made some noises about resuming the football games, but Taylor has stopped them pretty cold. NDSU getting accepted into the Gateway has reduced the odds somewhat because, with eight conference games per season, it really only leaves two dates open(assuming one FBS money game each year). There is a real possibility that, when/if the rivaly resumes, it will not be an every year occurence until both schools are in the same conference.

Basketball used to be an eight year wait, but that was changed about the time that the xDSU's began their transition. It is now five years, just like the other sports. Of course, a school moving from DII to DI can select one men's and one women's sport to be playoff eligible in two years(excluding football and basketball). There are some indications that UND has selected volleyball for the women's sport. I haven't heard anything about the men's choice or any official confirmation on the volleyball decision.

[darell1976]

In addition to that, I believe there is also a very real possibility that they might not ever be in the same conference again.

That would be sad. I wish UND, USD, NDSU and SDSU will be in one conference again. Anyone else from D2 moving to D1?? I thought maybe SCSU or Omaha would?

[MplsBison]

SCSU is going to the Northern Sun and Omaha is going to the MIAA.

I will also add that, as far as basketball goes, UND is eligible for the NCAA tournament after 5 years but it takes 13 years for UND to become a "core" member.

Basically, in order for a basketball conference to maintain it's automatic bid to the NCAA tournament, they must have 7 core members and 6 core members that have played together for 5 years, the 765 rule if you will.

Or something like that.

Hammersmith has the exact rules I'm sure.

[bincitysioux]

That would be sad. I wish UND, USD, NDSU and SDSU will be in one conference again. Anyone else from D2 moving to D1?? I thought maybe SCSU or Omaha would?

This has been hashed over a hundred different ways, but I'll chime in again with my same old mantra. I feel it would be better for the UXD's in the end to land in a different conference than XDSU's. My hope is (and I know that it is probably a very remote chance) that there will be some membership changes in the Big Sky conference towards the end of UND's transition period that will make eastward expansion more favorable for that conference. IMO, if UND and/or USD were lucky enough to get in within 5 years, having conference games every year in all sports against schools like Montana, Montana St., Weber St., Idaho St., Northern Colorado, and then non-conference games against NDSU and SDSU would make for some really entertaining schedules every year. The XDSU's would be the same great scenario with conference games against schools Oral Roberts, UM-Kansas City, Northern Iowa, Southern Illinois, and big drawing rivalry and regional games against the UxD's.

Having said all that, I think it is far more likely that the Summit League will be looking for members before the Big Sky will. As they begin their 26th season next fall, they will have had a total of 27 different members. I will consider UND lucky to join that conference if the opportunity presents itself. The only downside I see to Summit membership is that will likely mean long-term membership for football in the Great West. The Gateway probably won't look to expand within the next 10 years I feel. The Great West could be a wonderful conference, however when it is officially back up to 5 members in 2009, a minimum of 4 members will still be actively seeking different homes, maybe even 5 Cal-Poly as FBS aspirations like it sounds like UC Davis does.

My prediction: UND will begin Summit Leauge play in the fall of 2012, and will be seeking their fourth consecutive Great West Football Conference Championship.

[bincitysioux]

There are some indications that UND has selected volleyball for the women's sport.

Hey Hammer, any concrete info on this? I've felt that UND will probably make both Men's and Women's swimming and diving the first to move up, simply for the fact that I think these sports could help UND establish early ties with the Summit leauge as possible affiliate members. I believe the Summit will be down to six members this season when Valparaiso leaves. On the other hand, I'm a bit torn because I know Volleyball could actually generate a little bit of revenue during the transition. The problem with that is finding an off-setting men's sport. The only one I could think of is baseball, but I don't think that would be a good idea, since we struggle to compete in DII.

[darell1976]

What is the Summit League?? And i would think Swimming would be the sports for the Sioux would pick first since they have an awesome S/D team. Any chance they could get a better place to play baseball? They either need to really overhaul Kraft or tear it down and rebuild it. They need something like Newman Outdoor Field here in Fargo. Any chance the Engelstad family could donate a new baseball stadium?? I was living in GF in 1996 when they added more bleachers for the GF Varmints minor league team, and I just think they could do more for that field.

[Hammersmith]

To bin: I also figured that S/D would be the way for UND to go for a different reason. S/D is much more an individual sport than anything except T/F/CC. Since everyone is competing for individual championships, it can be very difficult to recruit if you are not playoff/tourney eligible. Shortening that from five years to two can make a big difference. Look at what happened to NDSU's wrestling program. Mass defections to Mankato that first year, but now things have turned around. We would still be waiting to turn things around if NDSU had not chosen wrestling as one of its two year move-ups.

As for the volleyball question, GeauxSioux posted an article from the Saux Centre Herald in another thread about a UND volleyball recruit. There's a line in it that says she will be part of a program that will transition to DI in two years. Now, the most likely interpretation is that it simply means UND will be playing a DI schedule during the second year of the transition. But it's also possible that she was told during her recruiting process that a decision had been made to accelerate the VB program's transition. Still, the first scenario is more likely until something official is heard from the athletic department.

To darell: The Summit League is the new name of the former Mid-Continent Conference(Mid-Con). It's a multisport conference that does not include football or hockey, but sponsors every other sport UND offers. It also admininstrates the Great West Football Conference that UND will be joining in 2008 or 2009. The Summit League consists of Centenary College(Shreveport, LA), Indiana University-Purdue University-Indianapolis, University of Missouri-Kansas City, Oakland University(Rochester, MI), Oral Roberts University(Tulsa, OK), Southern Utah University(Cedar City, UT), Western Illinois University(Macomb, IL), and, starting in 17 days, NDSU, SDSU, and Indiana University-Purdue University-Fort Wayne. Currently, Southern Utah, NDSU, and SDSU are the only schools that play in both the Summit and the GWFC and both NDSU and SDSU will be leaving the GWFC in 2008 to join the Gateway Football Conference. The only other Summit school to have a football team is WIU, and they also play in the Gateway.

As for baseball, I think it's down quite a ways on UND's priority list, but there's a thread in the "Other Sports" section discussing the topic.

[jimdahl]

To bin: I also figured that S/D would be the way for UND to go for a different reason. S/D is much more an individual sport than anything except T/F/CC. Since everyone is competing for individual championships, it can be very difficult to recruit if you are not playoff/tourney eligible. Shortening that from five years to two can make a big difference. Look at what happened to NDSU's wrestling program. Mass defections to Mankato that first year, but now things have turned around. We would still be waiting to turn things around if NDSU had not chosen wrestling as one of its two year move-ups.

At one point, UND thought that since hockey was already playing at D-I that we wouldn't get to move another sport:

11-28-06 IAC Meeting

Multi-classification- Since UND already plays hockey at the Division I level, no other sports will be eligible for DI NCAA Championship play until the fall of 2012.

The argument against those counting is obvious (we play D-I because there is no D-II available), but I can't seem to find a more recent reference that refutes that assumption.

[darell1976]

To darell: The Summit League is the new name of the former Mid-Continent Conference(Mid-Con). It's a multisport conference that does not include football or hockey, but sponsors every other sport UND offers. It also admininstrates the Great West Football Conference that UND will be joining in 2008 or 2009. The Summit League consists of Centenary College(Shreveport, LA), Indiana University-Purdue University-Indianapolis, University of Missouri-Kansas City, Oakland University(Rochester, MI), Oral Roberts University(Tulsa, OK), Southern Utah University(Cedar City, UT), Western Illinois University(Macomb, IL), and, starting in 17 days, NDSU, SDSU, and Indiana University-Purdue University-Fort Wayne. Currently, Southern Utah, NDSU, and SDSU are the only schools that play in both the Summit and the GWFC and both NDSU and SDSU will be leaving the GWFC in 2008 to join the Gateway Football Conference. The only other Summit school to have a football team is WIU, and they also play in the Gateway.

As for baseball, I think it's down quite a ways on UND's priority list, but there's a thread in the "Other Sports" section discussing the topic.

Thanks for the explaination.

[Hammersmith]

At one point, UND thought that since hockey was already playing at D-I that we wouldn't get to move another sport:

11-28-06 IAC Meeting

The argument against those counting is obvious (we play D-I because there is no D-II available), but I can't seem to find a more recent reference that refutes that assumption.

I think I've posted this before, but here's the bylaw:

20.4.1.2 Divisions II and III Members - Classification of a Sport in Division I. A member of Division II or Division III may petition to be classified in Division I in any one men

[MplsBison]

The Gateway probably won't look to expand within the next 10 years I feel.

I wouldn't be so sure on that.

Both Youngstown and Ill State are looking pretty hard at FBS.

IL State has a stadium expansion plan that would increase capacity to over 40k! No way would they stay in FCS at that point.

YSU is already a shoe in for the MAC. They just need a few more facility upgrades before they make the plunge.

That seems to open the door for UND and USD, IMO.