Tuition free, dinner extra!

[The Sicatoka]

I see headcounts.

I see dollars.

But aren't US heads (resident tuition) lower cost than Foreign (non-resident tuition)?

I'd like to see the breakdown of dollars going resident/non-resident, or what's ND getting for local v. outside talent.

[MplsBison]

I see headcounts.

I see dollars.

But aren't US heads (resident tuition) lower cost than Foreign (non-resident tuition)?

I'd like to see the breakdown of dollars going resident/non-resident, or what's ND getting for local v. outside talent.

I have to imagine that the number of grad students at both NDSU and UND from North Dakota, in majors that matter (sorry L.A. grad students), are pretty low.

[Oxbow6]

I see headcounts.

I see dollars.

But aren't US heads (resident tuition) lower cost than Foreign (non-resident tuition)?

I'd like to see the breakdown of dollars going resident/non-resident, or what's ND getting for local v. outside talent.

Exactly, and what true "economic benefit" is ND getting from bringing in all these out of state and foreign students. I totally get the need for grad programs and research, but at the tune of $10M of free tuition alone last year at NDSU, I find it hard to believe it's even a wash. Not to mention that all these students we are talking about will not stay in ND to put their education to use.

[star2city]

Exactly, and what true "economic benefit" is ND getting from bringing in all these out of state and foreign students. I totally get the need for grad programs and research, but at the tune of $10M of free tuition alone last year at NDSU, I find it hard to believe it's even a wash. Not to mention that all these students we are talking about will not stay in ND to put their education to use.

If NDSU didn't have deficits which were in part caused by tuition waivers, there wouldn't be an issue. Legislators don't seem to have a problem with Dickinson State, which gives a partial tuition waivers to a huge fraction of foreign and out-of-state undergraduates. But the key is, Dickinson State is staying within budget.

Running deficits are an invitation to more oversight and micromanagement. NDSU leadership has clearly failed in this area and needs to relearn how to manage budgets. With balanced budgets and no cost overruns, the so-called anti-NDSU propaganda claimed by persecution-complex bison fans will dissipate.

[MplsBison]

Exactly, and what true "economic benefit" is ND getting from bringing in all these out of state and foreign students. I totally get the need for grad programs and research, but at the tune of $10M of free tuition alone last year at NDSU, I find it hard to believe it's even a wash. Not to mention that all these students we are talking about will not stay in ND to put their education to use.

Well that's a little more of a reasonable stance.

Yes, the programs need to be studying to make sure there isn't an "unreasonable" amount of money being thrown at foreign students to boost enrollment numbers "any way possible".

But you last sentence still reeks of protectionism. Think of it from the university's point of view: so what if they go back to their home countries? They are still UND/NDSU alumni! The schools can still hit them up for donations. And it probably gives those graduates an even better chance to start their own companies back in their home countries. Which in turn allows for bigger donations, more opportunities for future graduates to get jobs and more opportunities for UND/NDSU to recruit new students in those countries and form partnerships with businesses in those countries.

Stop being such a typical provincial/protectionist American. Please?

[The Sicatoka]

Stop being such a typical provincial/protectionist American. Please?

"That's stereotyping. And stereotyping is wrong."

{sip off scotch}

{long draw off cigar}

[/Ron White]

[Oxbow6]

Stop being such a typical provincial/protectionist American. Please?

Your liberal Pollyanna-ism mentaily doesn't fly around here. You ever get the feeling that you are on an island with your views?

Protectionist...maybe. As one of the few, and becoming fewer, responsible and accountable persons in society, I'm getting kind of tired of "free" for every one but me. Seems like I, and those like me, wind up paying for everyone else's "free".

Seems to me a few people in liberal Mass. feel the same way!

[MplsBison]

Your liberal Pollyanna-ism mentaily doesn't fly around here. You ever get the feeling that you are on an island with your views?

Protectionist...maybe. As one of the few, and becoming fewer, responsible and accountable persons in society, I'm getting kind of tired of "free" for every one but me. Seems like I, and those like me, wind up paying for everyone else's "free".

Seems to me a few people in liberal Mass. feel the same way!

I know for fact I'm not on an island with those particular views.

Or haven't you noticed how every single major capitalist entity in the United States has expanded globally?

Global is the new defacto standard.

I bet the people who work in the 1+ billion dollar Hyundai assembly plan in Montgomery AL don't really care that their value add goes back to Korea, because the people of Korea turn right around and buy iPods with Samsung flash memory in them.

[Csonked Out]

I know for fact I'm not on an island with those particular views.

Or haven't you noticed how every single major capitalist entity in the United States has expanded globally?

Global is the new defacto standard.

I bet the people who work in the 1+ billion dollar Hyundai assembly plan in Montgomery AL don't really care that their value add goes back to Korea, because the people of Korea turn right around and buy iPods with Samsung flash memory in them.

I am in no way disagreeing with the importance of waivers as your basically hoping that while they are on campus their work will lead to more money for the University in the form of grants and joint ventures with corporations (ie. the unmanned space program grant that UND received). UND got this directly because of waivers given to certain students who did research while at the Univeristy.

The reason this is a big deal is because you have to know what your budget is and how much you can spend. One of the major goals at NDSU was growth (which they accompolished), but they failed at the budget behind the growth. They simply didn't take into account the lost income from the amount of tuition waivers they were handing out and that is the problem with all of this. It has nothing to do with foreign or local grad students, as monetarily Research and Development gives you long-term fiscal gain in the form of grants and corporate dollars coming into the University which take a period of several years to do research on.

[MplsBison]

I am in no way disagreeing with the importance of waivers as your basically hoping that while they are on campus their work will lead to more money for the University in the form of grants and joint ventures with corporations (ie. the unmanned space program grant that UND received). UND got this directly because of waivers given to certain students who did research while at the Univeristy.

The reason this is a big deal is because you have to know what your budget is and how much you can spend. One of the major goals at NDSU was growth (which they accompolished), but they failed at the budget behind the growth. They simply didn't take into account the lost income from the amount of tuition waivers they were handing out and that is the problem with all of this. It has nothing to do with foreign or local grad students, as monetarily Research and Development gives you long-term fiscal gain in the form of grants and corporate dollars coming into the University which take a period of several years to do research on.

Don't mistake my other posts on this thread as giving NDSU a free pass to grow at any level they see fit. I agree much more with controlled, planned, steady growth vs. the virus-like growth NDSU has experienced lately.