NCC Needs to Expand

[star2city]

The Argus-Leader recently had this article on the NCC meseeking mbers. Last Saturday, the GFHerald included this blurb on NCC expansion:

The NCC also is looking for new members. North Dakota State and South Dakota State will leave the league this season for Division I athletics. With the addition of Minnesota-Duluth, the NCC will have only seven teams.

[bisonguy]

I don't think that any of the schools would currently make a good addition to the NCC. UNK would probably be the best candidate, but they don't want to increase their athletic budget. Whoever can kick their program and funding up a notch (or two) would be the ideal candidate. Winona has made progress in increasing their funding, but they still have a ways to go.

[RD17]

I think the addition of St. Thomas would be the best fit. Granted, they would probably go through a couple of rough years if they went directly from D3 to the NCC, but in the long run they are the best equipped financially and in the best location to be a success in the league. St. Thomas is also a 2nd tier doctoral university (US News and World Report) so they'd be a very good fit academically, also.

[bisonguy]

RD17,

Do you think St. Thomas' facilities are okay? The BB arena looks a little small. Also, unless they drop sports, they will need over 190 scholies to be fully funded in all sports. With the cost of St. Thomas at $20-27,000 a year, that's a lot of money to be handing out.

[BisonMav]

Concordia-St Paul is an up and coming school. They are already at the DII level in sports. I have noticed in recent years they have been getting some quality athletes from the metro area. They look like they could step up to the new NCC level.

[ScottM]

RD17,

Do you think St. Thomas' facilities are okay? The BB arena looks a little small. Also, unless they drop sports, they will need over 190 scholies to be fully funded in all sports. With the cost of St. Thomas at $20-27,000 a year, that's a lot of money to be handing out.

St. Thomas can raise money in a hurry if it wanted to modernize/expand its facilities. However, expansion is pretty much hemmed in by the Summit neigborhood. They raised $250M in less than a year, when the U barely raised $50M in the same timeframe, so money probably isn't an issue and they work their network like magic. There is a great deal of talk around MSP about the Tommies going D1 at some point, and Mark Dienhart formerly of the U is running a good part of the show. With its grad/professional programs it has an enrollment of about 11000 or so. Undergrad is around 5000. I think they'd make a great fit, but I think they'll wait and see how the NCC finally shakes out, e.g., if UND and some others don't finally march off to D1 land at some point.

[star2city]

There is a great deal of talk around MSP about the Tommies going D1 at some point, and Mark Dienhart formerly of the U is running a good part of the show.  With its grad/professional programs it has an enrollment of about 11000 or so.  Undergrad is around 5000.  I think they'd make a great fit, but I think they'll wait and see how the NCC finally shakes out, e.g., if UND and some others don't finally march off to D1 land at some point.

Good info, ScottM.

For UND to seriously consider a Div I move, it has to have a realistic chance of being invited to a Midwestern Conference (a western conference bid is remote, just ask Miller and Chapman ). In order for a midwestern conference bid, a Minnesota school must exist that would be of interest to the conference and, for UND, serve as a geographic bridge to points east. St. Thomas definitely meets that criteria, as well as possibly UMD. If St. Thomas truly had a 6-8 year goal of going Div I, there may be a school in Grand Forks that would mutually benefit from St. Thomas' goal. A St. Thomas move to the NCC, sponsored by UND, would be a logical first step in a long-term symbiotic relationship.

[RD17]

RD17,

Do you think St. Thomas' facilities are okay? The BB arena looks a little small. Also, unless they drop sports, they will need over 190 scholies to be fully funded in all sports. With the cost of St. Thomas at $20-27,000 a year, that's a lot of money to be handing out.

Scott pretty much nailed it. I have never been to St. Thomas' campus, but from talking to a couple of friends that went there, raising money won't be an issue for facilities improvements or increased budgets.

Going from zero to 190 scholarships seems like a tall order, but you've got to remember that many of those D3 schools are already financing a good portion of their athletes' educations- they just can't call them athletic scholarships.

[bisonguy]

ScottM and RD17,

Thanks for the info. I forgot about all the *cough* non-athletic scholarships that are handed out. There was a good discussion about this on another board.

star2city,

Are you speculating UND and St. Thomas starting a new DI conference, or becoming travel partners in an existing DI conference?

[star2city]

star2city,

Are you speculating UND and St. Thomas starting a new DI conference, or becoming travel partners in an existing DI conference?

Certainly not a new conference, but travel partners would be a future possibility. Much as NDSU and SDSU are finding in their frustrating conference odyssey, I have to believe UND's administration have a rather keen insight into the long odds of UND obtaining DivI affiliation today. Kupchella's experience at Southeast Missouri State, which moved from the Div II MIAA to Div I Ohio Valley, certainly gave him an insider's view of what it takes to get conference affiliation. SEMO had 'natural' conference options, so did Akron, Miller's old school. With no mid-major Div I school in Minnesota, UND does not have a 'natural' conference affiliation. Schools such as St. Thomas or UMD, if they have Div I goals, could improve the Div I geographical landscape for UND. What would be a huge Div I gamble today may be a compelling slam dunk move in 2010. I have yet to hear any conference state that NDSU or SDSU would make good geographical fits for their conference.

As an 'investor' in UND, I much prefer management with a patient approach that move quickly when the timing is appropriate, even if it takes a decade or more.

[redwing77]

I think Colorado College should join the NCC and go DII.

[BisonMav]

New NCC member UM-Duluth got it handed to them by Northern St. Looks like Winona St and Concordia-St Paul are the top teams in the NSIC. It could be an off year for UMD, but if they finish in the middle of the pack with MSU-Moorhead. Does that mean Winona St, Concordia-StP and Northern St could be added to make a 10 team NCC? Another possibility would be to merge the conferences, having two divisions.

[UND Fan]

I have been one to agree with UND's stance to wait awhile before making a decision regarding DI. I think it would be great for football - disasterous for all other sports.

However, if the decision would be made to merge the NCC and NSIC, I would immediately be a strong proponent for moving up! I really don't think that will happen anytime in the next 20 years. I do see Concordia-St. Paul continuing to improve their programs and becoming a real power in that conference and a potential NCC team. I am not sure that the funding would ever be there for Northern to be a strong DII school year-in-and-year-out. Winona could probably do it more readily than Northern.