Awesome Letter

[fourwindsboy]

Yes, that makes sense, since North Dakota in the ancestoral homeland of the Jewish people...oh, wait...never mind. Hate to break it to you, Skippy, but you lost all credibility when you admitted that the real reason you want the name changed is to stick it to "the majority". It's also instructive to note that none of the anti-nicknamers have since posted trying to refute this as a reason to discontinue the name. If this were my website I'd ban a user that posts such racist garbage.

Then why don't you petition to have the name changed to the Fighting Jews if they don't mind? One important point is that the majority will never understand what it feels like to be discriminated against and that is very evident in reading the majority if the posts on this forum. But don't think your words will discourage me from continuing to post.

[DamStrait]

Then why don't you petition to have the name changed to the Fighting Jews if they don't mind? One important point is that the majority will never understand what it feels like to be discriminated against and that is very evident in reading the majority if the posts on this forum. But don't think your words will discourage me from continuing to post.

Try posting something relevant to what you are quoting.

[Goon]

Yes, that makes sense, since North Dakota in the ancestoral homeland of the Jewish people...oh, wait...never mind. Hate to break it to you, Skippy, but you lost all credibility when you admitted that the real reason you want the name changed is to stick it to "the majority".

Amen. I agree.

[fourwindsboy]

Amen. I agree.

Why doesn't "sticking it to the majority" not make sense? You know what bothers all of you about the nickname being changed is that you will have lost to the "Indians" on this matter. And most of you just can't come to terms with that. Think about it, after kickin our a$$es for so long, you'll finally lose one!

[Diggler]

Why doesn't "sticking it to the majority" not make sense?

Being a minority you will never understand why it doesn't make sense and that is very evident in reading the majority of your posts on this forum.

[Siouxfan_inDenver]

Why doesn't "sticking it to the majority" not make sense? You know what bothers all of you about the nickname being changed is that you will have lost to the "Indians" on this matter. And most of you just can't come to terms with that. Think about it, after kickin our a$$es for so long, you'll finally lose one!

You are racist.

[Goon]

Why doesn't "sticking it to the majority" not make sense? You know what bothers all of you about the nickname being changed is that you will have lost to the "Indians" on this matter. And most of you just can't come to terms with that. Think about it, after kickin our a$$es for so long, you'll finally lose one!

[redwing77]

You are racist.

Not at all.

Remember, any minority acting anti-white is just voicing pent up aggression towards the oppressors, the whites. It is perfectly acceptable to be Anti-White. However, if White People were to argue against these statements, THAT would be racism.

It's how things go.

I'd even go as far as to say that the Reservations could hang a sign saying "All White people are racist pigs deserving nothing more than the slop pigs live on" and there's nothing we can do. If the City of Fargo or somewhere posted a sign saying "We don't want any more poor people. Move here and get a job or don't come here at all" they'd get blasted.

It's why I laugh every time I hear Jesse Jackson talk about racial equality. It's a pipedream. There can not be racial equality as long as race is an issue with either side. I don't see African-Americans laying down the race card any time soon. I don't see the Native Americans laying down the victim card any time soon either.

I'm 99.9% positive I'll never see racial equality in my lifetime. I'm pretty sure none of our children will either.

[Siouxfan_inDenver]

Not at all.

Remember, any minority acting anti-white is just voicing pent up aggression towards the oppressors, the whites. It is perfectly acceptable to be Anti-White. However, if White People were to argue against these statements, THAT would be racism.

It's how things go.

I'd even go as far as to say that the Reservations could hang a sign saying "All White people are racist pigs deserving nothing more than the slop pigs live on" and there's nothing we can do. If the City of Fargo or somewhere posted a sign saying "We don't want any more poor people. Move here and get a job or don't come here at all" they'd get blasted.

It's why I laugh every time I hear Jesse Jackson talk about racial equality. It's a pipedream. There can not be racial equality as long as race is an issue with either side. I don't see African-Americans laying down the race card any time soon. I don't see the Native Americans laying down the victim card any time soon either.

I'm 99.9% positive I'll never see racial equality in my lifetime. I'm pretty sure none of our children will either.

Did you just call me a racist? That is kind of what I was getting at, rasicm only exists because people of all colors let it.

[Chewey]

Why doesn't "sticking it to the majority" not make sense? You know what bothers all of you about the nickname being changed is that you will have lost to the "Indians" on this matter. And most of you just can't come to terms with that. Think about it, after kickin our a$$es for so long, you'll finally lose one!

All I can say is "wow." It would be nice if the Herald printed stuff just like this. Losing to the indians has nothing to do with it and that kind of racist vitriol reveals much about you. When we're saying that most of the NA's would like to keep the name and that it should be placed to a vote, we're really not saying that we have lost to the indians and we're mad about it. Trust me on that, n'kay?

[Chewey]

Not at all.

Remember, any minority acting anti-white is just voicing pent up aggression towards the oppressors, the whites. It is perfectly acceptable to be Anti-White. However, if White People were to argue against these statements, THAT would be racism.

It's how things go.

I'd even go as far as to say that the Reservations could hang a sign saying "All White people are racist pigs deserving nothing more than the slop pigs live on" and there's nothing we can do. If the City of Fargo or somewhere posted a sign saying "We don't want any more poor people. Move here and get a job or don't come here at all" they'd get blasted.

It's why I laugh every time I hear Jesse Jackson talk about racial equality. It's a pipedream. There can not be racial equality as long as race is an issue with either side. I don't see African-Americans laying down the race card any time soon. I don't see the Native Americans laying down the victim card any time soon either.

I'm 99.9% positive I'll never see racial equality in my lifetime. I'm pretty sure none of our children will either.

People need to start holding the Jesse Jacksons and Al Sharptons and RRHTs of the world accountable for their perpetuation of racism. The onus of racism is on them. All we have to do is voice that reality back at them when they pull the race card.

[fourwindsboy]

Did you just call me a racist? That is kind of what I was getting at, rasicm only exists because people of all colors let it.

Are you serious? Wow is that an ignorant statement! That is classic. So your saying all of us NA's, blacks, especially in South Africa, Aboriginies, Maori in New Zealand, etc are letting racism happen? We are letting you be racist. I'm gonna put that in my favorites, I gotta show this to my bro's. You are Stupid, you know that just plain stupid! Go ahead all the rest of you, defend him. I can't wait to read what's coming.

[Chewey]

Are you serious? Wow is that an ignorant statement! That is classic. So your saying all of us NA's, blacks, especially in South Africa, Aboriginies, Maori in New Zealand, etc are letting racism happen? We are letting you be racist. I'm gonna put that in my favorites, I gotta show this to my bro's. You are Stupid, you know that just plain stupid! Go ahead all the rest of you, defend him. I can't wait to read what's coming.

Actually, I think he's saying that you and people like you perpetuate racism. You and people like you are racists. The Jesse Jackson's of the world would be lost without racism because they have no identity and no power apart from the victim mentality. You and Jesse Jackson should read the new book by Juan Williams. What you and people like you are saying, essentially, is that "racism existed and blacks, NA's, etc were persecuted (which they were terribly) so we (the NA's such as you, blacks such as Jesse Jackson, etc.) get to be racist now and we are justified in being racists because look at what happened to our ancestors. In fact, it's not racism because look at what happened to our ancestors." Healthy? Logical? Productive? Will help to end racism? Ah, nope. Racist? negative energy? perpetuation of racial stereotypes? Unhealthy? Serving to further hurt the descendants of those who were persecuted? Yep. The "we get to be racists because our ancestors were persecuted" argument does not wash at all.

[fourwindsboy]

Actually, I think he's saying that you and people like you perpetuate racism. You and people like you are racists. The Jesse Jackson's of the world would be lost without racism because they have no identity and no power apart from the victim mentality. You and Jesse Jackson should read the new book by Juan Williams. What you and people like you are saying, essentially, is that "racism existed and blacks, NA's, etc were persecuted (which they were terribly) so we (the NA's such as you, blacks such as Jesse Jackson, etc.) get to be racist now and we are justified in being racists because look at what happened to our ancestors. In fact, it's not racism because look at what happened to our ancestors." Healthy? Logical? Productive? Will help to end racism? Ah, nope. Racist? negative energy? perpetuation of racial stereotypes? Unhealthy? Serving to further hurt the descendants of those who were persecuted? Yep. The "we get to be racists because our ancestors were persecuted" argument does not wash at all.

I'm not racist. I have many friends who are caucasion. I work with caucasions. I admire and respect people like Einstein, Robert Devries, Bobby Knight, Dr. Seabloom and Dr. O'Rielly at UND. I have met many people of different races who I respect. I just feel very deeply that it's time the name be changed. I do not feel honored by the Fighting Sioux nickname. Actions speak louder than words. You say you are honoring me but would you give me the time of day if I asked for it? Let me tell you a story. About 10 years ago I was goin to Bismarck for a meeting. It was in march and the temp was in the 30's. About 5 miles past Steele my pickup gave out. I opened my hood had the flashers on but no one stopped. I walked 5 miles back to Steele without anyone giving me a ride on the interstate! Now I obviously look Native American but come on. Why wouldn't anyone give me a ride? How many of you have been to a rez? Have you ever been in the home of a NA? There are alot of contradictions in this matter. No answers either.

And chewey, you don't know what he was trying to say. Why do you automatically defend his statement? It's a downright ignorant statement and you know it.

[Siouxfan_inDenver]

I'm not racist. I have many friends who are caucasion. I work with caucasions. I admire and respect people like Einstein, Robert Devries, Bobby Knight, Dr. Seabloom and Dr. O'Rielly at UND. I have met many people of different races who I respect. I just feel very deeply that it's time the name be changed. I do not feel honored by the Fighting Sioux nickname. Actions speak louder than words. You say you are honoring me but would you give me the time of day if I asked for it? Let me tell you a story. About 10 years ago I was goin to Bismarck for a meeting. It was in march and the temp was in the 30's. About 5 miles past Steele my pickup gave out. I opened my hood had the flashers on but no one stopped. I walked 5 miles back to Steele without anyone giving me a ride on the interstate! Now I obviously look Native American but come on. Why wouldn't anyone give me a ride? How many of you have been to a rez? Have you ever been in the home of a NA? There are alot of contradictions in this matter. No answers either.

And chewey, you don't know what he was trying to say. Why do you automatically defend his statement? It's a downright ignorant statement and you know it.

No Chewey pretty much said what I tried to with my limited vocab. That is the exact point I was trying to get across.

PS one of my dearest friends is an Ojibwa(is that spelled right).

[LeftyZL]

I'm not racist. I have many friends who are caucasion. I work with caucasions. I admire and respect people like Einstein, Robert Devries, Bobby Knight, Dr. Seabloom and Dr. O'Rielly at UND. I have met many people of different races who I respect. I just feel very deeply that it's time the name be changed. I do not feel honored by the Fighting Sioux nickname. Actions speak louder than words. You say you are honoring me but would you give me the time of day if I asked for it? Let me tell you a story. About 10 years ago I was goin to Bismarck for a meeting. It was in march and the temp was in the 30's. About 5 miles past Steele my pickup gave out. I opened my hood had the flashers on but no one stopped. I walked 5 miles back to Steele without anyone giving me a ride on the interstate! Now I obviously look Native American but come on. Why wouldn't anyone give me a ride? How many of you have been to a rez? Have you ever been in the home of a NA? There are alot of contradictions in this matter. No answers either.

And chewey, you don't know what he was trying to say. Why do you automatically defend his statement? It's a downright ignorant statement and you know it.

I've just been reading this thread without posting on it, but I find it absolutely hilarious that you believe you weren't picked up on the interestate while hitch-hiking because you are Native American.

Could it be that you might be/are a total stranger to the passers-by?

Could it be that people have read numerous horror stories about hitch-hikers?

That story of yours has nothing to do with being Native American, White, Black, Spanish, etc. It's a fact of life. You are not the only one that has hitch-hiked down the interstate before. You are not the only one that hasn't been passed by numerous vehicles on the interstate before. That you only had to walk 5 miles to a town to get help is lucky enough since you could have been out in the middle of nowhere. Many people have walked much, much longer.

[Darth412000]

You say you are honoring me but would you give me the time of day if I asked for it? Let me tell you a story. About 10 years ago I was goin to Bismarck for a meeting. It was in march and the temp was in the 30's. About 5 miles past Steele my pickup gave out. I opened my hood had the flashers on but no one stopped. I walked 5 miles back to Steele without anyone giving me a ride on the interstate! Now I obviously look Native American but come on. Why wouldn't anyone give me a ride? How many of you have been to a rez? Have you ever been in the home of a NA? There are alot of contradictions in this matter. No answers either.

I would just like to say that in 2005, I was traveling on I-94 from Bismarck to Mpls when I got a flat tire. I'm not even kidding when I write this, but I too was very close to Steele. Anyway, there I was on the side of the road all by myself trying to change a tire. At the time, I was a 27 year old, white female. No one stopped to help me. I was there for almost 45 minutes dealing with this tire and having to unpack my trunk and move stuff around. But alas, I did it all by myself and had to return to Bismarck on a classy little donut tire.

So I guess my point is that there may be an area of I-94 that is like a Bermuda Triangle for vehicle trouble... since no one stopped to help me, it must be because I was a girl... or, maybe people traveling at 75 mph are going a little too fast to properly assess the situation before they have passed it. Just a thought, I'm just saying I don't think everything that may be about race/gender is actually about race/gender. Oh yeah, I will also admit that since that day when no one stopped to help me, I still don't stop to help others. Sorry to anyone if I've passed you by.

fourwindsboy, how many people have you stopped to help while they were either broken down on the Interstate/Highway or walking on the Interstate/Highway? Just wondering.

Oh yeah - I have worked with the Spirit Lake Tribe and the reservation in the past and found the majority of them to be wonderful people. I will admit though, there were cultural differences for which we all had to make adjustments.

[Chewey]

I'm not racist. I have many friends who are caucasion. I work with caucasions. I admire and respect people like Einstein, Robert Devries, Bobby Knight, Dr. Seabloom and Dr. O'Rielly at UND. I have met many people of different races who I respect. I just feel very deeply that it's time the name be changed. I do not feel honored by the Fighting Sioux nickname. Actions speak louder than words. You say you are honoring me but would you give me the time of day if I asked for it? Let me tell you a story. About 10 years ago I was goin to Bismarck for a meeting. It was in march and the temp was in the 30's. About 5 miles past Steele my pickup gave out. I opened my hood had the flashers on but no one stopped. I walked 5 miles back to Steele without anyone giving me a ride on the interstate! Now I obviously look Native American but come on. Why wouldn't anyone give me a ride? How many of you have been to a rez? Have you ever been in the home of a NA? There are alot of contradictions in this matter. No answers either.

And chewey, you don't know what he was trying to say. Why do you automatically defend his statement? It's a downright ignorant statement and you know it.

I am sorry that happened to you and we can all have our interpretations of what was said. I personally do not think it was ignorant or racist but you are entitled to view it as you see it based upon your own personal experiences and I am not going to deny you that. LeftyLZ is correct. In this day and age, you had better rely on your cell phone and AAA whether you're white, black, NA, Spanish or otherwise. A lot of people are just afraid because they've heard stories of criminals impersonating cops and raping women on what appeared to be a routine stop. If one is a man in need of help along side the road, whether one is white, black, NA, etc., you're especially stuck. There seem to be more crazy people on the fringes these days than 20 years ago and people are paranoid.

I know and have known many NAs whom I respect a great deal. A couple even disagree with me on the nickname yet I get along fine with them. Most are like the NAs someone was mentioning here at the Devils Lake bar who were wearing Sioux attire during a hockey game. I'm sure if I knew you, I'd get along fine with you, disagreement over the Sioux nickname notwithstanding. I do think that many on your side perpetuate racism by doing many of the things that I have described. Assuming white people do not give you the time of day perpetuates racism because it fosters feelings of resentment that you already have. Those get expressed to others and cause others to feel guarded and discomfort is spread. What you must understand is that not all white people are card carrying members of the KKK and that the vast majority of white people do not harbor ill feelings against NAs.

My dad teaches in Dunseith where the school is 90% NA. I've worked on a reservation helping the tribal council re-codify their tribal constitution. During that time, I was at Ladot's in Belcourt wearing shorts. One older NA essentially said that I was as white as the snow and looked like a girl with my shorts on and then he asked me what the fu$% I was doing on his reservation. That was a racist moment. I do not hold all NAs accountable and my time on that reservation was great. I even got to go golfing with the tribal council in Rolla. I have worked at several pow-wows too. My point is not to establish NA "street cred." Rather, it is to point out that we all experience racism and that the historical victims of racism can also be and often are racist. We only perpetuate it when we make broad assumptions after we've experienced it. I, too, have said racist things. One time, after bankruptcy court, I went to lunch with the Bankruptcy Judge's law clerk at the time who happened to be Jewish. I was complaining about something being expensive and said that I felt like I got "Jewed." I was an adult when I said this and the law clerk quickly pointed out the stupidity of my remark. To this day, I feel chagrined that I said that. Was I trying to be anti-Jewish? No. I grew up in NW North Dakota and that phrase was simply part of the vernacular along with many other idiotic phrases. At that time, I had been through 7 years of graduate studies and practicing for 4 years and I still did not catch myself.

Many NAs and blacks learn to be perpetually angry at white people. We all should be outraged, saddened, sickened, and educated about what happened and I don't think you'd find one responsible, educated, rational white person or any member of this site who would disagree with me on that. Educated people can be racist and I think there are a lot of them in the Sociology, English and Philosophy departments at UND. While you might not agree with the nickname, many other NAs may agree with it. Why not let their voices be heard. To simply say "Because we need to strike one against the dominant culture" is not responsible, in my opinion. That sort of animus is spurred by anger and rage of the type spewed forth by many UND administrators and professors and it is not productive.

Forcibly retiring the nickname will do nothing to redress historic tragedies. Use of the nickname and the respect it is accorded by that fans, alumni and athletes and adversaries are entirely positive things that serve to work against many of the negative things you have stated. I can't imagine that the athletes and fans proudly displaying the nickname and logo would be anything but constructive ambassadors, of a sense, reminding people around the country of the Sioux heritage. They play sports and do not engage in sociological or anthropological debates but the people are made known of the Sioux and they remember the Sioux people every time UND plays. I can not imagine why one would want to squelch such positives and I think many who oppose the nickname like RHHT, David Gipp, etc are just blinded by anger and rage against white people. That is racist behavior. Anger over what happened is a good thing but the desire to punish and seek retribution, rather than educate, admonish and remind and respect, is simply a reaction without the benefit of reason. To decorate it in terms of "it is a racist name/logo" and/or "all who support it are racists" does not change anything.

[fourwindsboy]

I would just like to say that in 2005, I was traveling on I-94 from Bismarck to Mpls when I got a flat tire. I'm not even kidding when I write this, but I too was very close to Steele. Anyway, there I was on the side of the road all by myself trying to change a tire. At the time, I was a 27 year old, white female. No one stopped to help me. I was there for almost 45 minutes dealing with this tire and having to unpack my trunk and move stuff around. But alas, I did it all by myself and had to return to Bismarck on a classy little donut tire.

So I guess my point is that there may be an area of I-94 that is like a Bermuda Triangle for vehicle trouble... since no one stopped to help me, it must be because I was a girl... or, maybe people traveling at 75 mph are going a little too fast to properly assess the situation before they have passed it. Just a thought, I'm just saying I don't think everything that may be about race/gender is actually about race/gender. Oh yeah, I will also admit that since that day when no one stopped to help me, I still don't stop to help others. Sorry to anyone if I've passed you by.

fourwindsboy, how many people have you stopped to help while they were either broken down on the Interstate/Highway or walking on the Interstate/Highway? Just wondering.

Oh yeah - I have worked with the Spirit Lake Tribe and the reservation in the past and found the majority of them to be wonderful people. I will admit though, there were cultural differences for which we all had to make adjustments.

Actually when I was going to school in Bozeman I must have traveled the interstate between Bismarck and there at least 50 times and I stopped and helped motorists twice, both with flat tires and also picked up hitchhikers twice. I kinda made a vow after my experience that I would help stranded motorists.

[redwing77]

A few things:

1. I'll repeat myself again: fourwindsboy cannot be a racist. He's not white. Any anti-white statements he makes or has made is just his lashing out rightfully at the harsh oppressors of his ancestors. I find that laughable because I'm technically first generation American so my ancestors never knew Native Americans even existed while back in the Old Country of Eastern Europe.

2. Siouxfan in Denver - Are you arguing against fourwindsboy? If yes, then, yes, you are a racist.

3. Chewey is right. When life holds me, Jews, or Christians down, we pick ourselves up and try to right the ship. If we were wronged along the way, we correct the wrong by attacking the person or company that performed the wrong. We have to look at things rationally. Perhaps there is something we did to provoke it. Why did I lose my job? Was it because I'm Jewish? I have lost jobs in my past, but in no way was it because I was Jewish. I somehow doubt many who are a minority would see a white guy firing them as not a racist move. I have been told to my face that I am going to Hell because I'm Jewish. I have been told that I (not the Jewish people) killed Jesus Christ. I have been told to my face that the Holocaust never happened. I've heard people say the phrase, "Don't Jew me, pal." Well, so what? Those people were idiots. I will not hold an entire ethnicity, nationality, or religious organization accountable for the actions of those idiots. The Native American activists can't seem to handle that idea.

We do not hold an entire race or country accountable for the actions of one company or the actions of a few representative of a country who are A) no longer in power and B) long since dead. For example, I do not plan on attacking blond haired German nationals over the Holocaust. Racism is perpetuated by the victims of it. They cannot see that the actions of a select few are just that, the actions of a select few. They hold the entire race responsible. They hide behind their perceived oppression to the point where people who may be distantly related to those who were oppressed feel themselves having been oppressed. How many black people alive today know slavery? The truth is, they don't. Their great-grandparents or great-great-grandparents might if they are still alive, but they don't. A great example of this attitude in black culture is this R&B/Hip Hop singer Rhianna (I think her name is) who claims Gangsta rap doesn't exist and wears an ak-47 necklace to represent the Black Panther movement's violent tendencies. I can find more direct quotes if you want, but there is NO WAY IN HELL she was alive for even a portion of what the true Black Panthers went through.

I never owned a slave. I did not participate in driving Native Americans from their homes. I have never chanted any derogatory remarks towards any Native American or minority persons, yet I'm lumped in with the entire ethnicity because I'm Caucasian. Well, so be it. Better to be a racist for false pretenses than a holier than thou bigot who cannot see his or her own flaws despite him or herself.

[Sioux-cia]

Sioux: Embrace Culture

This thread was started because a Native American wrote a letter in support of the Sioux name and logo. I think it's time to revisit it.

We are the descendants of the greatest culture ever to have walked these Plains, and it's time to start acting like it. The self-pitying attitude that many have adopted has reached its apex.

[Siouxfan_inDenver]

A few things:

1. I'll repeat myself again: fourwindsboy cannot be a racist. He's not white. Any anti-white statements he makes or has made is just his lashing out rightfully at the harsh oppressors of his ancestors. I find that laughable because I'm technically first generation American so my ancestors never knew Native Americans even existed while back in the Old Country of Eastern Europe.

2. Siouxfan in Denver - Are you arguing against fourwindsboy? If yes, then, yes, you are a racist.

3. Chewey is right. When life holds me, Jews, or Christians down, we pick ourselves up and try to right the ship. If we were wronged along the way, we correct the wrong by attacking the person or company that performed the wrong. We have to look at things rationally. Perhaps there is something we did to provoke it. Why did I lose my job? Was it because I'm Jewish? I have lost jobs in my past, but in no way was it because I was Jewish. I somehow doubt many who are a minority would see a white guy firing them as not a racist move. I have been told to my face that I am going to Hell because I'm Jewish. I have been told that I (not the Jewish people) killed Jesus Christ. I have been told to my face that the Holocaust never happened. I've heard people say the phrase, "Don't Jew me, pal." Well, so what? Those people were idiots. I will not hold an entire ethnicity, nationality, or religious organization accountable for the actions of those idiots. The Native American activists can't seem to handle that idea.

We do not hold an entire race or country accountable for the actions of one company or the actions of a few representative of a country who are A) no longer in power and B) long since dead. For example, I do not plan on attacking blond haired German nationals over the Holocaust. Racism is perpetuated by the victims of it. They cannot see that the actions of a select few are just that, the actions of a select few. They hold the entire race responsible. They hide behind their perceived oppression to the point where people who may be distantly related to those who were oppressed feel themselves having been oppressed. How many black people alive today know slavery? The truth is, they don't. Their great-grandparents or great-great-grandparents might if they are still alive, but they don't. A great example of this attitude in black culture is this R&B/Hip Hop singer Rhianna (I think her name is) who claims Gangsta rap doesn't exist and wears an ak-47 necklace to represent the Black Panther movement's violent tendencies. I can find more direct quotes if you want, but there is NO WAY IN HELL she was alive for even a portion of what the true Black Panthers went through.

I never owned a slave. I did not participate in driving Native Americans from their homes. I have never chanted any derogatory remarks towards any Native American or minority persons, yet I'm lumped in with the entire ethnicity because I'm Caucasian. Well, so be it. Better to be a racist for false pretenses than a holier than thou bigot who cannot see his or her own flaws despite him or herself.

You're alright for a Dead Wings fan, as I sit here in Denver and watch the Aves lose this game too.

[Siouxfan_inDenver]

This thread was started because a Native American wrote a letter in support of the Sioux name and logo. I think it's time to revisit it.

Sorry if I was the one that threw this conversation off its course, but those who live in glass homes.......

[fourwindsboy]

A few things:

1. I'll repeat myself again: fourwindsboy cannot be a racist. He's not white. Any anti-white statements he makes or has made is just his lashing out rightfully at the harsh oppressors of his ancestors. I find that laughable because I'm technically first generation American so my ancestors never knew Native Americans even existed while back in the Old Country of Eastern Europe.

2. Siouxfan in Denver - Are you arguing against fourwindsboy? If yes, then, yes, you are a racist.

3. Chewey is right. When life holds me, Jews, or Christians down, we pick ourselves up and try to right the ship. If we were wronged along the way, we correct the wrong by attacking the person or company that performed the wrong. We have to look at things rationally. Perhaps there is something we did to provoke it. Why did I lose my job? Was it because I'm Jewish? I have lost jobs in my past, but in no way was it because I was Jewish. I somehow doubt many who are a minority would see a white guy firing them as not a racist move. I have been told to my face that I am going to Hell because I'm Jewish. I have been told that I (not the Jewish people) killed Jesus Christ. I have been told to my face that the Holocaust never happened. I've heard people say the phrase, "Don't Jew me, pal." Well, so what? Those people were idiots. I will not hold an entire ethnicity, nationality, or religious organization accountable for the actions of those idiots. The Native American activists can't seem to handle that idea.

We do not hold an entire race or country accountable for the actions of one company or the actions of a few representative of a country who are A) no longer in power and B) long since dead. For example, I do not plan on attacking blond haired German nationals over the Holocaust. Racism is perpetuated by the victims of it. They cannot see that the actions of a select few are just that, the actions of a select few. They hold the entire race responsible. They hide behind their perceived oppression to the point where people who may be distantly related to those who were oppressed feel themselves having been oppressed. How many black people alive today know slavery? The truth is, they don't. Their great-grandparents or great-great-grandparents might if they are still alive, but they don't. A great example of this attitude in black culture is this R&B/Hip Hop singer Rhianna (I think her name is) who claims Gangsta rap doesn't exist and wears an ak-47 necklace to represent the Black Panther movement's violent tendencies. I can find more direct quotes if you want, but there is NO WAY IN HELL she was alive for even a portion of what the true Black Panthers went through.

I never owned a slave. I did not participate in driving Native Americans from their homes. I have never chanted any derogatory remarks towards any Native American or minority persons, yet I'm lumped in with the entire ethnicity because I'm Caucasian. Well, so be it. Better to be a racist for false pretenses than a holier than thou bigot who cannot see his or her own flaws despite him or herself.

Those are some pretty good points redwing. Best I've read since bein on here. Again, I don't feel I'm a racist. I have many freinds who are not NA. I just feel it's wrong to have UND use the nickname because we as natives do not feel honored and there is a significant % that feel as I do. I'm not gonna get into the argument of %'s and so on. I assumed that people on this board would be open minded to my beleifs, but apparently if I am against the nickname then everything i write is hogwash. Which I guess is OK, I never expected to be welcomed with open arms. One major point i want to make is it seems that most on here are making assumptions about present day NA's without really knowing any NA's or experiencing life on a rez. There's alot of I heard this and my friend told me that, etc. I'm an educated person and I know I can live anywhere in the USA I want but choose to live here on my rez because I am happy here and like serving my people. It isn't anywhere near as bad as you think it is.

[Sioux-cia]

Sorry if I was the one that threw this conversation off its course, but those who live in glass homes.......

No problem. I'm not complaining about the way this thread is going. I just wanted to bring the reason for the thread to the forefront again because it is an 'Awesome Letter' written by a Native American who supports the Fighting Sioux name and logo!