star2city

Moorhead would play in the Scheels (Urban Plains) Arena. Supposedly, some deep-pocketed business interests in Fargo-Moorhead are supporting MSU-Moorhead's efforts. If MSU-Moorhead ever started hockey, the idea of NDSU starting it would be dead forever. UND and Denver won't tolerate an MSU-Moorhead in the same league, as it would mean Denver and UND would rarely play each other. But what needs to happen is for a "beginner" lower-budget league to form. The one good thing that supposedly should come out of the BTHC is growth of the sport. But the WCHA's membership roles are not attractive to higher profile schools (like Iowa State, or Utah, as examples) that could potentially start a program, because of the presence of low-budget, low-profile schools like Bemidji, Mankato, and Tech. By the same token, lower profile schools like Minot State and Moorhead, are not attractive to the WCHA. In many respects, it would be helpful for the growth of hockey for an anti-Big Ten conference to form, then what's left of the WCHA and CCHA would have to add entry-level programs. With four leagues in the west, all of them would actively be seeking new schools to join.

Exactly. Western Michigan has good programs, including aviation. The point about Lake Superior State, Northern Michigan, and Ferris State is that they are all dual community colleges and Universities. No other Michigan university is also a community college, except for those three. Link: http://www.michigancc.net/cci/cclinks/ Again, Notre Dame didn't have a problem with these three schools when it also meant playing Michigan, MSU, and OSU. Without Big Ten schools as part of the equation, Notre Dame won't stay in that association that includes a community college/university mixture . Where Notre Dame goes, Miami will follow. Where Miami goes, Bowling Green and WMU will attempt to follow.

Probably not soon. Marquette's already committed to starting M&W lacrosse, which will be a significant cost. Wisconsin's university system is going through some cutbacks.

Michigan Tech has tough academic standards, but the demographics and media presence of all the UP schools are atrocious. Upper Michigan has been in economic decline for 120 years. There are almost more people in Cass County than the entire Upper Peninsula. So you are denying that there is academic snobbery? To Notre Dame, UND isn't up to snuff academically. I never stated NMU, Ferris and LSSU were lousy schools, just how Notre Dame views them.

Anastos almost certainly sees the writing on the wall. IMHO, there is no way that Notre Dame, with all the millions it has invested in its new arena, will stay in the CCHA with Ferris, LSUU, NMU, and Alaska. Notre Dame will take its puck someplace else, probably with Miami, and maybe with Bowling Green, and Western Michigan. The northern and upper Michigan schools do not have the kind of demographics, academics standards, DI status or media that Notre Dame wants. Notre Dame tolerated those schools if it meant hob-knobbing with Mich and MSU, but it won't put up with them after they leave. ND's probably lobbying schools like Pitt, DePaul, Syracuse, and Iowa State. If it can't gain those, it would accept some lower profile schools in larger cities (like Lindenwood from St Louis, Robert Morris from Pittsburgh, and Niagara from Buffalo) and begin its own league. Maybe Ferris, LSSU, NMU, and Alaska can add Moorhead St, Minot St, Wayne St (MI) and Grand Valley to make a more regional, lower cost league. Wayne St dropped men's hockey when the CCHA refused to take them in. Grand Valley has to capability to start hockey, but just never had a league to join.

Both the CCHA and ECAC allow 18 scholarships, the maximum allowed by the NCAA. However, the AHA only allows 12, with some AHA schools (UConn) being totally non-scholarship. The AHA is essentially a DIII league in DI clothing, with a few exceptions (like Niagara and Robert Morris and AFA, RIT can't offer scholarships because of it's DIII status has not been grandfathered to allow it). Some ECAC schools also don't offer scholarships (the Ivy's and maybe Union), but they give huge amounts of aid. The ECAC is full of private schools, so those that do offer scholarships also have very high tuition making the costs are very high. The CCHA tuition costs are much lower, as it is a public school conference (except for Notre Dame).

While McLeod may be demanding an either all or none - how long before Mankato goes ahead and schedules UM by itself just because it badly needs the money? What's McLeod going to do to Mankato, kick them out? The idea that there is solidarity behind McLeod is almost laughable.

The Big Ten has no history of ever adding affiliates. The Big Ten would love to add Notre Dame as a full member, but Notre Dame is consistently rebuffed the invitation, which has royally torqued off Delany and embarrassed the Big Ten Presidents who don't forget slights like that to Big Ten prestige. Notre Dame will not get in the BTHC unless it goes in all the way for full membership. Barry Alvarez had been pushing for a BTHC even before Penn State had announced it's hockey plans. Under Alvarez's football-centric hockey plan, the Big Ten would have invited FBS MAC schools Bowling Green, Miami, and Western Michigan to a BTHC. The Big Ten has an existing scheduling alliance with the MAC (with 90% of games at Big Ten stadiums), which helps ensure that middling Big Ten football schools have winning records. Since all Alvarez seems to know is FBS football, that plan definitely revealed his hockey IQ. That plan was squelched.

What is also being assumed here is that the Big Ten will stay at six teams, when numerous reports indicate that at least two other schools are considering hockey. If and when the Big Ten goes to 7 schools, that means 24 conference games. With 8 schools, 28 conference games, like the schedule the WCHA formerly had. Nothing that the Big Ten is "offering" will ever be subject to long-term contracts. Even for the short-term, why is the WCHA demanding that all it's teams play Minnesota. Wouldn't it be better for CC, Denver, UAA, and MTU to play Wisconsin, while the Minnesota schools and UND play UM? Here's the status of Indiana's new arena, which is planned to be hockey capable:

The "caring" thing for UND to do is join the CCHA, as they badly need programs with fans. Or offer the gophers and sconnie WCHA spots to Alaska and UAH, which would greatly help those programs. Should UND athletics write a check to the Lake State, Tech, and NMU departments to help keep them going? If Notre Dame and Miami leave the CCHA, are they more villainous than Mich, Mich St, and Ohio St? The Big Ten Hockey Conference formally closed the the Father Knows Best 1950's hockey era. It's practically been eons since Michigan Tech was always competitive. Each school helped create its own present circumstances. The case could have been made long ago that the Michigan DII teams need to form their own small dog league, which would at least give them a chance of winning and gaining a NCAA slot with an autobid.

BT commish Delany seems to be disagreeing with you.

The Big Ten Network is still ramping up, especially in advertising dollars, but even in cable/satellite fees. Each school will get at least $1 million more per year for the next several years according to some projections. (I'll try to find a link) Is Big Ten hockey going to make them huge dollars? Certainly not immediately.. Minnesota will actually make less on hockey, but the Minnesota football program adds so little to the BTN that the Big Ten forces them to sacrifice their hockey cash cow at the alter of the BTN. In exchange, Minnesota football can remain atrocious but still get the same payout as Ohio State. By Minnesota withholding hockey, Ohio State and Penn State viewed that as a gross injustice considering how much value they add to the BTN. When Lucia is finally gone, Minnesota will make a statement that they are committed to restoring Gopher hockey, much like they did with Gopher basketball when they paid Tubby $3.3 mil / yr (which was ridiculous too).

In women's basketball, it is even more difficult to get top talent than in men's. Reason: women's basketball allows 15 scholarships versus 13 for men's. Essentially, there are nearly 200 players in BCS conferences that don't play, that in men's basketball would be on mid-majors. Green Bay and Northern Iowa are probably the programs that we can best approach. What's been hurting is that NW Minnesota hasn't had the talent come out of that area that it had 10 years ago. Seemed like Iowa State used to have a huge fraction of its roster NW Minn and ND. That type talent just seems to have dried up.

It's not for hockey itself, but for the whole BTN. Content is extremely important, and college hockey will gain more viewers (and advertisers) than women's basketball or wrestling. The impact of Penn State's program on Pennsylvania, for example, is underestimated by most on this board. Big Ten schools will be capable of doing things (facilities / scholarships / salaries) that even a few years ago the have-nots in the conference (Indiana, Northwestern) didn't dare dream. College hockey will never be as big as college basketball, but it at least will be comparable to the NHL's popularity in non-traditional markets (like Dallas, Raleigh, San Jose, where the NHL is actually prospering). When Minnesota pays it's next hockey coach $750,000, alarm bells will be ringing everywhere in the WCHA.

The mastermind behind the whole BTHC is Jim Delany, who is widely acknowledged as the most powerful man in college sports. The Big Ten Network he envisioned is now a money-printing machine. No other conference will even approach the Big Ten's take from broadcasting, and the gulf is just getting bigger. Delany plans to nationalize college hockey, with the Big Ten as a king pin. It will start with small changes, like college hockey scores on the ESPN ticker. Later, it will become major changes - like Wisconsin, Minnesota, and Michigan paying two or three times the going rate for a top line coach. Delany has basically declared a financial arms war on the rest of the college hockey world, which is ill-prepared to battle the way the Big Ten can. The change in environment may lift all boats, but the Big Ten boats will be lifted higher and higher, while most of the rest of college hockey will see tides, and likely some rip tides. People kind of laugh at the idea that Illinois or Indiana will start hockey, but when those schools will soon be pulling in $30 mill / year just from broadcast rights, that pays for a lot of expenses and new facilities. If Minnesota wasn't handicapped with Maturi and Lucia, everyone in the WCHA would be alarmed. But guess what: those two won't be around by the time BTHC starts play. UND needs to be pals with the Big Ten's nemesis: Notre Dame. Notre Dame isn't going to waste the huge investment it has made into hockey. Notre Dame also has the capability of gaining some major hockey recognition on national TV (on a Big East network or elsewhere). Moreover, UND needs to help play the Canada card with UBC's entry into the WCHA. It's also not beyond the realm of possibility that a major wild card school could start hockey. Look at Texas, which will be starting it's own network and will be in desperate straights for programming (new sports) and ways of spending the huge amounts of money coming it''s way. A Notre Dame/Texas league with a few others like UND would be a true anti-BTHC. The Big Ten may look like a harmless lizard now, but has the genes (and money feed) to grow into a dragon. We need to think big to slay the Big Ten monster.

Huntsville Times: Big Ten hockey may benefit UAH's conference search Strange how UAH's coach talks about "new conferences", and not necessarily the CCHA. Miami OH, Notre Dame, and Bowling Green are all closer to Huntsville, AL than to Marquette, Michigan. The CCHA may have to add Moorhead State and Minot State to its Michigan DII schools just to survivie.

Randball: The thought of the Gophers not being in the WCHA is just plain weird

One of the big unknowns: Will Greg Shepherd bolt to the BTHC as its new Supervisor of Officials, and take his Shepherds with him?

When Michigan Tech was in the CCHA, the McNaughton went with it.

The issue is that the huge demand for Gopher and Badger game tickets at the Ralph help create demand for other games. In order to assure Gopher tickets, one almost has to buy season ticket (and also donate to the Fighting Sioux Club) . Without the Gophers or Badgers on the schedule, there's a chance that people will buy tickets for only 4 series or so, instead of season tickets. Moreover, Gopher single tickets cost twice what non-conference tickets cost. There will be a direct effect on UND's budget, and with the WCHA no longer gaining $'s from sold out playoff games at Mariucci and the Kohl Center, the WCHA will return much less to member schools. UND will now be the main cash cow for the WCHA, instead of it being a shared responsibility. I do however find it interesting that Hakstol led the charge for the Fighting Sioux name, even at the apparent risk of losing the Gopher and Badger rivalry. Perhaps that risk isn't as great as some would have us believe. Gopher fans will turn on Maturi and their administration when they realize the stupidity of their own university's decrees.

A TSN contract wouldn't happen overnight, but at some point it would be feasible. Canadians will watch practically any hockey if it means having the ability to follow future NHL stars. Once UBC makes the NCAA tournament, it's possible the whole of Canada will be tuned in. Canada practically defines its national pride by hockey, and having a Canadian NCAA team to follow may alter it's whole view of college vs major junior. IMHO there is a reason for UND to be scheduling games in Winnipeg: creating goodwill if and when UBC happens.

With the ability to attract NHL-bound players, the whole dynamics of UBC will change. Nobody in Vancouver cares about washed up major junior players now. Air Force offers little (the WCHA already has Colorado Springs covered), especially considering AFA has limited recruiting capability (i.e. no Canadians and NHL-potential players). Moreover, Air Force wants to continue its rivalry with Army, and maybe even Navy joins up.

No Clay Jenkinson, it is about the power of the majority of both "anglos" and Indians to tell elite leadership that Indian symbols are meaningful symbols that bridge cultures. The media and so-called intellectuals like Mr Jenkinson keep repeating that the nickname is divisive, when the opposite is true: Nothing has bridged the Indian and at-large communities more than the nickname issue. It is minority groups in both communities that are demanding a scorched earth policy and desire ill-will between the communities.

We should know within a couple of months if British Columbia will be in the WCHA, as that school could be a game changer in the way college hockey is viewed in Canada. The WCHA would essentially be THE league for Canadian recruits, as many of the games would likely be broadcast on Canadian cable (TSN). The WCHA would then be: UBC/UAA UND/UNO Denver /CC UMD / SCSU BSU /MSUM College hockey's dream of a west coast division with Washington, Oregon (with Nike money), and Stanford might be somewhat closer to possible. Without Wisconsin or Minnesota, MTU would almost certainly head back to the CCHA with LSSU and NMU. Tend to see Notre Dame, Miami, Bowling Green, and WMU sticking together and joining up with schools like Niagara (Buffalo market) and Robert Morris (Pittsburgh market) to form their own league. With it's new arena, Notre Dame isn't going to tolerate playing DII Michigan schools without gaining games vs Mich and Mich St. If couple higher profile schools like an Iowa State or DePaul (or even Missouri or Oklahoma or Texas) could somehow start hockey, then a superleague of select WCHA/CCHA teams would be more likely, IMHO.

Betting he is speaking with UBC (see Penn State thread).