aff

I agree with almost all of that, but I find it pretty unlikely that a conference that has members in arizona and california would want to expand their audience into canda.

I'm sure Grand Forks international is going to be able to pull in the big sky, when a two for one deal for NDSU/SDSU couldn't. Give me a break.

Thanks for the personalized message there starcity! I guess I deserve that for trying to look on the bright side of a possible conference affiliation for UND in that last post. Notice I said "Most likely", not going to happen. Either way, next time someone tells me I'm being a downer for UND, I'm going to point to that post as the reason why: Being optimistic gets you blasted. Either way, I found your use of the "sniff test" pretty amusing. First, you take the second part of the sentence "want to expand with programs that make us better", that has to do with geography, and then throw it out because it doesn't fit your scenario. Than you act like that sniff test is gospel. So tell me again how Northern colorado helped the conference to become "better" again? What was it, two D-I basketball wins in the last three years? 3-8 in football? Yeah, fullerton seems real concerned with making the conference better, not geography at all. Because Northern Colorado over NDSU/SDSU speaks loads about what he thinks of competitiveness vs. geography. Then you start in with this crap about Denver wanting into the big sky? Whats the change in attendance at basketball going to be? Maybe 3000 extra at 1 game a season? Yeah, I'm sure thats enough for them to hinge their entrance to the sky on. And if UBC does get in, they'll be bringing another canadian school with them, not UND. So my advice would be to maybe, before you tell me I'm full of hot air, maybe try to use an entire sentence in a quote instead of cutting it off at the part that supports your argument. You know you're stretching when you are modifying the meanings of sentences to support yourself.

That brings up a good point that most UND fans are afraid to think. The big sky may add SUU to the conference, which then could theoretically open up a spot for UND in the mid-con. I think that right now thats UND's best shot at conference membership, even if it isn't the big sky. The worst thing that could happen would be for the big sky to take only denver, or only a canadian school into the conference, pretty much filling up any possible slots for UND in either the mid-con or the big sky.

What was the point of even posting that? I doubt even you can explain what thats supposed to mean. Seriously, think of a response or don't, but if you don't have one, than don't bother posting crap like this. The only thing that showed me was that you're not intelligent enough to have a logical conversation.

Thats an interesting selection of quotes from the article there! Here's a few I found going through it: "The (school) presidents want to expand with programs that make us better," Fullerton said. "Of course, geography and what does a new member do for us politically." "I really hate to mention schools because it sounds like we're considering them, and some we really haven't," Fullerton added. NDSU and SDSU applied for membership the same time UNC did, but were turned down primarily because of their locations and the difficulty of traveling to Fargo, N.D., and Brookings, S.D. Fullerton stated that the cost of travel is always a concern Yeah, sounds like a sure thing to me. Explain to me again why if both brookings and fargo, as a package deal, are to far to travel to, that grand forks by itself is a better deal? I know, I must just be jealous of UND for being rational, and not just picking a half sentence out of a page long article to support my ideas.

What? Is there anything that even says expansion of the conference is going to be addressed in October?

No, a sioux homer pretending to be objective on a fighting sioux board.

Really, what would you call the phrase "Hey aff, here's a thought. If you you think that this line of discussion is "getting real old", DON'T READ IT." That doesn't sound hostile to you? But I guess its alright because "People have a right to discuss ideas without people putting them down, whether the ideas make sense or not.", but I guess that freedom to discuss ideas is limited only to those ideas that are positive to UND, if you point out a flaw in those ideas, I guess you are acting "violently" as you stated in your post. I guess I'm going to have to work on my "violent" behavior and try to get that under control in the future. I apologize for any injuries I've caused with my destructive behavior in the last couple of days. I find it funny that the underlying assumption of all of these posts is that I, a non-UND fan, is somehow trampling on peoples freedom to post positive ideas for UND. I guess there isn't quite enough positive posts for UND on this board yet. I'm one person posting pretty irregularly, and yet somehow I'm holding back hundreds of posters from putting ideas up about how great UND is? Show me one time where I've said that people shouldn't post about conference situations for UND. Show me where I've said people don't have a right to post their thoughts? I haven't, and I have no problem with debate. The problem comes in when all of these freedoms I keep hearing about don't apply both ways. If someone has the right to post a conference situation that makes little sense, and I make a post that points that out, haven't I excercised that same freedom you're telling me that I'm trampling for everyone else? Don't I have a right to post thoughts about conference situations for UND, even if their outcome isn't the best or what posters here would have hoped for? I think the freedom of speech in the constitution was meant to protect the minority and their opinion. The claims I've read here apparently think that one person is making hundreds not post their ideas. The only way that could occur is if the minority was using a logical approach, and perhaps the majority was incorrect? It all comes down to being logical or not. If you post something that doesn't make sense, and I point that out, and you then get embarrased, I don't really see how thats my problem. That would be you're own sense of dignity that you're protecting. I'm not stopping a single person from posting a single idea, and I never will be. You're feelings of looking foolish when you post a foolish idea are what is stopping people from posting. I've always thought that was the best way to get a realistic view of the world. If you only want to hear about postive ideas about UND, maybe you could obtain some moderating tips from countries such as china, iran, or saudi arabia. Nothing but good news comes out of those countries!

I've never seen a post filled with more contradictions in my entire posting career. First you tell me that I shouldn't read anything that I don't like, and then ignore you're own advice and tell me about why I shouldn't post my opinion. How about this, if you don't like my opinion DON'T READ IT. Then you talk about how you like to read about possible scenarios, but I guess that doesn't include scenarios that aren't positive for UND. You should maybe modify you're post to say "Count me as 1 person that likes to read the different HOMER scenarios". You say you're very aware that nobody on this board knows what is going to happen to UND, and yet you seem to have the need to attack a post that isn't positive for a scenario. If you already know that it most likely won't occur, then what was you're problem with what I posted? I was merely stating what you already knew in you're head, right? The truth is that I posted something not positive for UND, and it pissed you off. Next time come out and say that, and don't pretend that you're not being a homer.

I have no problem saying that UND and Denver have a rivalry. But saying that a single mens basketball game is enough to get UND admitted into any conference, with any combination of schools is absolutely ludicrous. I think fans are simply pointing out how crazy a theory that involves a canadian school, denver, and UND sounds. Admitting a canadian school to the big sky does nothing but take away opportunities for UND to join the big sky, because if one goes in, there are several others that could join too that make more sense than UND does from a geography standpoint. Saying that Denver will get UND into the big sky because they will want that extra basketball game with a couple thousand extra fans makes little sense. If denver wants UND that badly, then they will just schedule them out of conference, home and home. Is UND going to refuse that? Absolutely not. The line about "I find it interesting that fans of other schools refute every possibility of conference alignment for UND interesting" is getting real old. Here's a thought that may not have occured to people on this board... maybe these are getting refuted because they defy any sense of logic? Ever think that? Oh no, it must be all of the jealousy of UND and its hockey program, I mean how could it not be.

I'll think about that as soon as the time comes around. On that point, what evidence would you need to actually convince you that UND isn't going to be in the big sky anytime soon? Is there anything that could possibly occur that would lead you to believe something other than UND being the sky in the next 5-10 years? I really want to know, because I can't think of a more cut and dried case of something not happening that UND to the sky. You're basically saying that a single UND/denver basketball game per season is more enticing to the big sky than the entire athletic programs of both SDSU and NDSU? Do you really beleive that?

I have yet to see a reason why the big sky is going to want to expand as far east as UND. Adding a canadian school and denver doesn't really help UND, no matter what the expanded attendance for Denver is. Like it or not, Denver will see the big sky as step down in basketball, and UND playing basketball in the conference as well certainly isn't going to help that perception any. Is one game a year of higher basketball attendance worth moving your entire athletic identity? If canadain schools are going to be added, why would the sky only add one school from canada? If this scenario proves to be right, I've got a million dollars for starcity ready to go.

LOL. I've never seen so many people proud to be associated with a "Third Tier Institution". I know the first thing I'm going to put on a resume is that my degree is from a nationally recognized third tier university!

Yeah, that post is arrogant, from the school who has a campus visit just completed. This from a school who hasn't even started their exploratory year, this post isn't arrogant at all. I think you'll see whos "desperate" when UND is an indy for a couple of years, while their rival is competing for a NCAA berth in all sports. Oh wait, I'm sure UND will get an invitation in their first year of being D-I, thats realistic.

I think you're missing the idea of "degrees" of speculation here. I can say that I think that I'm going to eat cheerios for breakfast tomorrow, and thats speculation, because it hasn't occured. You could tell me I'm going to have a heart attack tonight, so I won't eat those in the morning. I could also say that I'm going to be the next president of UND. Thats also speculation, but since I'm hardly qualified for that position, its not nearly as "likely" as me eating cheerios tomorrow. I don't think you would simply lable both my breakfast tomorrow, and my presidential aspirations as the same speculation, would you? This situation is similar to the discussion. UND will get into the mid-con is valid speculation. "UND will get into the big sky, because the NCAA is going to allow a school from Canada in, which will create a hockey rivalry with denver, who will want UND in because they will form a rivalry in other sports, so they will force the big sky to add UND and the canadian school into the conference, that they have never shown interest in joining" is bordering on being insane. If this comes true, I'm going to be kidnapping some of you, so that you can pick my lottery numbers in the next couple of months. The point here is that a factor of this speculation has to be the liklihood of it actually occuring. Not all situations have the same chance of happening, and using common sense we can rule some of these out.

Yes, because Sioux Sports.com is full of people telling the God's honest truth about UND. I mean, who would ever think that some homers would be posting about UND and their future success. Thats almost unbelievable. I seriously laughed so hard I had tears coming out of my eyes when I read that last post. You calling my version of events the "alleged truth", while you don't even discuss Starcity's ludicrous posts about the NCAA allowing a school from canada in, the big sky taking denver, denver accepting, and all of this somehow getting UND into a conference too? Yeah, I'm the one with the "warped vision". That scenario is so crazy its almost breath taking that people are able to look at that and think, "yeah, thats a real possibility". I mean, come on, that has as much chance of happening as me spitting a nuclear bomb. For Christ's sake, you're talking about conference affiliation based on something that has never occured in the history of the NCAA, and I simply point that out, and I'm the one with a warped vision? Thats really what you think? Seriously just look that over again, and tell me that it has a chance of happening. Just do it, please, and think about it for awhile, and then come back and tell me that I'm the one with the "warped vision" LOL. FYI, it makes me laugh to read posts like these. Instead of actually debating something, or presenting something even close to a fact, you try to get someone with a desenting view point to simply shut up, because you don't like what they have to say. When I start reading these kinds of posts, I know that the guy on the other side is pretty desperate to keep something going, and that he knows I'm right. If I seem like I'm arrogant, or that I know I'm right, its because I only post on subjects that posters are obviously incorrect on. Its not hard to be smart, when you only discuss situations that someone else is blantatly wrong about. And if you think you can shout me down with crap posts like you've had you're wrong too. If you don't like hearing dissenting opinions.... too bad. Lifes full of them, get used to it.

If thats his real point than why doesn't he state it? Why are all of these exact scenarios being laid out if you don't want to discuss them? I think the problem may be you don't want to hear a view point that doesn't involve everything working out perfectly for UND in this situation.

You know what, it doesn't even matter if they do, so I'm not going to argue about them getting in or not (even though the NCAA consitution will have to be modified to do so). Lets say they get in. How does that help UND? Even if that school gets into the NCAA, its still an almost ludicrous connection between them and UND joining the big sky. This whole theory is so far out of touch with reality that I can hardly believe people are even discussing it. You realize theres a pretty decent chance that on the very small chance they are accepted to the NCAA, that they will go to a conference besides the big sky. And even on the even smaller chance that they are both accepted to the NCAA, want to join the big sky, and the big sky admits them, what is UND going to have to do with that? If they get in, why would the big sky not take their rival, simon frasier in too? Why would UND even enter into the equation? Hockey? Please, the big sky could care less. This whole theory is so completely out of touch, it makes me laugh just reading the posts trying to defend it. I've got a million dollars for everyone of you if this situation happens. I can definitely tell that there isn't a whole lot of confidence in UND finding a conference in the near future from posts like this though.

Yeah, thats it. Its entirely plausible that UND is so great that: 1. DU is going to join a conference they think is below themselves. 2. DU is going to want to join only on the condition that they "get" to play a transitional D-II school in conference. 3. The NCAA is going to allow canadian schools into the league. 4. These canadian schools are going to join the big sky. 5. The big sky is going to want to expand all the way to grand forks, even though it has turned down two similar schools for geography reasons in the last couple of years. Of course, since this is coming from a UND fan, the underlying assumption for all of this occuring is that UND hockey is so great, that this whole scenario actually has a real chance of happening. I think if you even asked the conference AD's or fullerton himself (if you could get an honest answer out of him) and told them this scenario, they would have no idea where all of this came from. This may be possible to occur, but I think its about as likely as me stirring my cereal this morning and happening on a solution for cold fusion energy. If you're being realistic here you already know. 1. UND is about the same as the SU's. The big sky didn't expand for one or both of the SU's because of geography, its doubtful they will expand for UND under any circumstances, barring a huge conference movement. 2. DU doesn't want to join the big sky. They are interested in the MVC, or higher profile west coast conferences. 3. Even if DU did go to the sky, they sure as hel! wouldn't require UND to be one of their opponents. The conference RPI is already low enough, I doubt they think a transistional D-II is going to be helping them out any time soon. 4. The NCAA admitting Canadain schools is unlikely, to say the least. I think that this may be a case of UND fans looking like finding a conference is going to be very difficult for them. There is a real possibility of them being independents for a decade after a move, and they know it. Scenarios like this one are a pretty desperate attempt at hope.

Uhhhhh, no, its not a possibility, its a certainty. You're AD is already pushing the idea of a large portion of the funding for a move to D-I coming from these types of games, hence you're priority in getting to 57 scholarships, the minimum needed to play money games against D-I teams. I guess my assumption was that since you were on this site arguing to a bunch of bison fans, and since you never said that you had contacting your AD discouraging him from playing these games, that you weren't in contact with your AD. I'm not really sure how you expected me to know that you were from the always intelligent conversations I've read between UND and NDSU fans. I'm glad to know that you have personally called or emailed the UND athletic department telling them your disaproval of UND playing Minnesota in football. I hope that request is followed by a 300,000-500,000 dollar check to make up the difference. Oh, wait, were talking about UND here, the school of unlimited money and finances. Why would they ever need a money game. Its a well known fact on this site that the only thing holding up UND from any venture/ expenditure is the lack of imagination of the administration. I mean, its pretty obvious that UND has money for: an indoor football practice facility, a womens hockey program that isn't funded yet, a move to D-I, a move to D-I with equivalent womens scholarships (like SDSU did, except in one year), a new lacrosse team, a law suit against the NCAA over the naming issue, and the list goes on. Now we can add to that list, that in order to accomplish all of this, UND doesn't need to bring itself down to playing money games like almost the entire DI-AA division does every season. Noooooo, UND hardly has the same issues as those schools.

If thats how you feel, you should contact your AD as soon as you can. You may not be too happy with the future of UND football.

I hope you're not really serious with this comment, since you're AD's sole mission for the D-I move is getting these games. Funny how UND will be trying to get to that 57 average, before increasing anything else.... wonder why that would be. A D-I UND will be assured of one of these games a season.

Whats the difference now in the womens hockey program? It still isn't fully funded is it? By that logic, this still isn't the right time, unless the building and moving into new facilities was somehow a burden on the coaching staff. What exactly about moving into a new facility was affecting a move to D-I again? I guess if it was that big a deal they could have simply said they were moving, but they were waiting an extra year. Come on, you know thats not true. That nice little explanation doesn't explain your admin's talk about D-I not "really being a step up", or that "UND had no intention of moving" or the "opportunities that were taken away from student athletes because of D-I" or "the corruption of D-I", or the NCC ban on playing the SU's ect. Theres no way you can blame this on the huge burden of "moving into new facilities". I think that UND could have managed to both play their games in a different building, and have some work-study students move stuff, and still go D-I. I was in grand forks several times during this period, and I didn't seem to see mountains of materials that needed to be moved in order to start playing games in those arenas.

What are those basketball records for the last 20 years? Saying UND has had a dominant basketball program for the last 15 years is pretty off base. Its been awhile since UND had some dominant teams in mens bball. I don't see that changing to much with a move to division I. And I commend you for going to three different games in a day, but realistically, how many people are going to be able to do that? Thats quite a time commitment that not too many people can make to UND athletics. Especially if the choice is Minnesota in hockey, or almost anybody else that UND can get into grand forks for basketball. The team names aren't going to be as glamorous for bball as they are for hockey, and your current basketball attendance is likely to suffer from where its currently at. If you need more evidence of where UND's priorities are, just read the article on the other thread where football is getting 21 scholarships, but basketball will be "next in line". I know that getting 57 gives you the chance to play money games, but come on, its 3 scholarships, 4 or 5 if you throw in scholies for girls in the current ratio you have been, but you can't find the money for that? SDSU and NDSU both immediately put mens and womens basketball all the way up, as almost all schools do.