JBB

Gopher, Badger, Wolverine, Spartan and BC Eagles are among the 13 true D1 programs playing. UND is part of the 47 pretenders. Naturally, you want acceptance so you take offense for your "peers" that they may be less than D1 because of the overwhelming dominance of non D1 athletic departments populating the sport? You have something to be proud of in hockey. Its too bad you cant allow NDSU to move ahead without perpetuating the constant negative sentiments and forceful propaganda against the decision. When the NDSU Decision is attacked or belittled I have the same feelings you do when the UND D1 hockey program is attacked or belittled. The issue of D1 for UND should be framed around UND and its circumstances. The case against it shouldn't be made by framing it around NDSU, especially when the environment that NDSU finds itself is is very different than unds. By doing this all of the interested parties at UND are not being given a legitimate chance to make an informed and calculated decision. NDSU did not move ahead in a rash or unthinking manner. The decision was studied from every angle with every constituent in the debate. The end result was arrived at only after a belabored and intensive study. I suggest UND do the same if they are interested and do it without mentioning NDSU. NDSU was able to do it without once mentioning UND. If, as it seems, the UND decision has already been made there is no further need to talk about it. I hope it has and UND stays put. With that I also agree to disagree.

The D1 debate has exposed another subtle racist attitude coming from the UND president and the herald. There are many more athletes of color in D1 sports, except for D1 hockey. Among the many reasons given why UND should not move up to D1 is the disturbing "too many criminal problems with D1 athletes". The statement would seem to except hockey players since UND actively promotes its D1 hockey involvement and discourages all other D1 participation. Isn't that in line with the racial and cultural insensitivity the entire UND institution has exhibited with the "naming issue"?

With 47 schools in D1AA football, D2 or D3 or no scholarship football and only 13 true D1A institutions in all sports playing hockey its diffuclt to take "D1 Hockey" seriously as a D1 sport. I also note that D1AA football is labled small time but D2 football is not labled. Doesnt it get a time lable. Like Big time, small time and part time or something like that? I dont want to UND move their sports up with NDSU. I know many people will disagree with this, but I think the areguments UND is making to stay in D2 are right. They wont be able to win, there is no monetary advantage, travel will be too expensive, big deal if the universities name gets scrolled across the bottom of the screen, its too expensive, regional athelets wont have a chance, no more titles, athletes in D1 (not hockey of course) are criminals, the probationary period will be too long, the end of "the rivalry", etc etc. I believe each of these arguments is true for UND and grand forks but not for NDSU and Fargo. I guess that is my frustration with the issue: people at UND and grand forks are unable to separate their understanding of their market with the Fargo market. I think an admission that their arguments against D1 are correct for grand forks/UND but do not apply to the much larger Fargo Metro area and a fast growing Progessive and Prestigious NDSU is in order if there is ever to be any understanding on this issue.

The reception NDSU is getting from the D1 schools and conferences is far different than the picture being painted by the herald. My question is this. Why isn't the view from grand forks ever positive for NDSU and its decision. Why is it always negative and disparaging? I believe NDSU has already explored the many options that may present themselves with the changing rules. In fact I believe NDSU is ready to go it alone unitl that time. Several possible new conference opportunities were explored in depth in the Fargo Forum earlier this fall. Its clear to me that D1 sports and D1AA football are going to present opportunity for schools like NDSU. The middle division will grow from schools like NDSU joining and others moving down. The important thing is to get the clock running on the probationary periods. This was a good move for NDSU. It is creating excitiement and anticipation in Fargo. Now that the decision is made many people that were reluctant or against it are now on board. Its going to make NDSU sports far more marketable and bring a tremendous focus on Fargo and NDSU that is not there now. Its also going to bring most of the talented regional athelets to Fargo as the scholarship money begning to become available.

UND has always seen the relationship with NDSU as a zero sum game. The history of its

Although the official drumbeat against D1 is not changing its easy to see a change in tone from the grassroots represented here. In fact, an uninformed reader might think that UND was actually leading the move rather than languishing in the background trying to put the best spin on a situation that will be disastrous for their D2 sports: losing all top recruits to the plentiful full ride scholarship money pouring out of NDSU and SDSU. Its amazing to see how travel costs no longer figure in to the negatives when the ideal conference for UND is designed. In fact added costs aren't mentioned when the ideal D2 NCC is redesigned. Now that the strategy of preserving an exclusive D1 affiliation for UND in hockey has failed how does the UND administration get out of the anti D1 mode? How are the D2 coaches at UND going to feel when all of their peers at NDSU are getting D1 paychecks just like their peers at the UND D1 athletic department, of which they are not a part. How are you going to keep Dale Lennon here when Sac State comes calling? It might have been simpler for UND to try and be part of the change instead of allowing englestad to isolate you in this fashion, but no sport can have the big spot light except hockey. Has there been any talk about moving all sports except hockey down to D3 like so many of the other D1 hockey schools?

The Division 2 fighting sue soxers are routed by a team they thought they were going to kick around, say average guess 45-21. What a laugh. What a dose of reality. And then turning on the SDSU fan because of your frustration. Dont forget SCSU used the 3 step against you too and you barely got out of there. Well Im sure Kelby is nursing his golden arm for next week and your return to glory. In the meantime Craig Gorder had a better day than your Harlon Hill hopefull. But I dont think kelbys chances for the Harlon are gone. all you have to do is win out and put up some great stats. can you get the fighting golden Eagles back this year? You guys looked good. Just read your posts about that effort! Maybe that would be a good nickname for you guys if you ever decide to change? Well, back to 7,500 next week.

The NCC has been held back by the D1 hockey schools. They have seen hockey as a "cheap way" to get into D1 and gain all the benefit. Not one Hockey school is interested in moving and some have been actively campaining against the decision NDSU has made. Everything in the Post above is true. Its been a long year listening to all the misinformation from those that are desperately trying to hang onto a formula that has really hurt the NCC over the long haul for the benefit of a few. I dont know what those schools plan on doing, but NDSU is moving up. I doubt the big Sky is in our plans. We dont ofter recruit to the west. Most of our outstate recruiting is east. We are working on a home/home with Western Ill. and both Montana Schools. Montana and Cal Davis are already on the schedule next year. we will need a full D1AA schedule for 2004. Its going to be very interesting to watch it develop. There are going to be a lot more people in the Fabulous Fargo Dome as the "new Blood" begins to role into town. I think the conference question is already answered for NDSU and will be revealed in the near future. Basketball, contrary to what some think, is going to fare better than football. There is a lot more room for improvement both in talent and fan interest. Averaging 5,000 is very doable in the next couple of years. Fixed costs are much lower in basketball and new profits will be generated.

The Fabulous Fargo Dome authority has been talking about the midsized arena for a while. In order to build it NDSU has to sign on as a major tennant. It will have ice, and if its built NDSU will have hockey. No vote is needed. I think plans are to renovate the BSA for basketball, I have seen plans for a bubble over the old Dacotah Field. Another arena is being planned for womens hockey. This would seat about 3,000 and is being paid for by private donations. Its very funny watching as the Division 2 sue soxers wring their hands over this. Also, watching many of you start to come around and even laugh at the anti D1AA arguments that have been flowing out of grand forks and were once considered the gosple truth. Now I see many of you making the case for why you can go. Its all so laughable. 6 months ago all I heard was why NDSU shouldnt/couldnt go. Truly a coordinated effort to maintain the D1 hockey monopoly was undertaken and now has failed. But the paint seems to be drying in the corner your painted into. The collapse of the D1 hockey/D2 all other sports monopoly must be anguishing.

Well you guys have a good football weekend up ther in bugtussle and we will enjoy our game here at the Prestigious Fargo Dome.

Ive never seen a UND hockey game. I don't even know who you play. I think you won a title a couple of years back but last year I think you stunk. I really don't know. I really don't see anything wrong with a limited D1 sports slate. I just prefer a full range of D1 competition. your hockey is cute. its really amazing how Grand Forks can do it, isn't it? Delaware State or Youngstown are a lot better games than the feared crookston golden eagles. Next up Central Washington? We wont win every regional recruiting battle but we will get the cream of the crop. It wont be because we are D1, it will be because full ride scholarship money will win out over sharing 36 or maybe 21 with 100 or so players. Ill take the best players on the BISON and sue sox any day and be competitive in D1AA ball. but a limited D1 sports slate is better than no D1 sports. Even though I wont see you at the ice sheet maybe there will be an article someplace, or a score across the bottom of the screen? The NIT. Lot bigger tournament than the the D2 regionals which don't even get radio coverage if your home team isn't in. Try to keep things in perspective. The difference between Gopher and NDSU football scholarships will be about the same as that between NDSU and UND. you will be on our preseason schedule if you decide to play.

The Presitgious Fargo Dome has about 6.000 more seats. Youll be at a $60,000 per home game disadvatage.

UND cant go D1 because of hockey, and lack of potential football revenues. The Alerious is too small. They are going to have to live with the limited visibility of the D1 hockey/D2 all other sports, just like the rest of the D1 hockey/D2 other sports teams in the NCC. Its just too big of risk to fund those large programs and make the move. NDSU doesnt have that problem. NDSU is going to enjoy a full range of visible division 1 sports teams. Hockey will come and with it a lot more revenue. The best regional athletes are going to flock to NDSU for full scholarship rides. In the future NDSU wont lose many regional recruiting battles. NDSU will renew old rivalries in D1AA football to sell out crowds including Northern Iowa, Grambling, Delaware State, the Montana Schools, Cal Davis, Youngstown State etc. Our new rivals like Western Illinois are going to be a lot more interesting than SCSU or Agui, god bless em. That's part of the problem with football attendance in Fargo: too much domination over too many regular D2 rivals. Not much drama in the Prestigious Fargo Dome when the average margin of victory is something like 45-14. Maine was going to sell the place out. They were going to be our first "no name" sell out. We will in time find ourselves in the Metro Dome against the Gophers. It is already being talked about in the sports boards at the Star Trib site. In basketball we will sooner rather than later be in the NIt tournament. We will eventually appear in the NCAA. The Prestigious Fargo Dome may be a regional tournament site. All of this means revenues. NDSU will generate at least $500,000/yr in football alone just from the home games. Who knows what kinds of guarantees we will get when we go on the road. That's something that doesn't happen to many D2 ball clubs. Now start adding up the basketball revenues. Its going to develop into something huge over the next 10 years. I just hope UND follows their own advice and stays put with the rest of the D1 hockey/D2 all other sports crowd.

hey Northern Iowa, I would love to get some inside from you, especially on the feeling about NDSU joining the Gateway, or maybe even NI leaving to join a new conference. Also what do you think the chances are of the Gateway becoming a full sports conference? Is there any room on your schedule for your old foe the NDSU BISON?

D2 is getting watered down because as the division has changed the rules governing the division have reflected the attitude of the new members. There used to be 60+ football scholarships allowed in D2. I dont see that happening in D1 or D1AA. It certainly wont be the result of institutions like Cal Davis, NDSU, SDSU and GVSU moving up. I also doubt that the NCAA is going to change the rules because UND doesnt want to move its sports up to the D1 level. I also dont think NDSU is going to wait around for anybody. The BISON havent announced what conference they will join but I have a pretty good idea there are ripe opportunities available. The announcement wont come until SDSU makes its decision public. After that I think things will happen fast. UND and the other NCC D1 hockey schools have been against this for a long time, since the 70's for some of them. In the meantime those schools have been the benefactors of that D1 affiliation. The newcomers have seen D1 hockey as the perfect compromise to going D1. Keep the other sports small and cheap and move into the D1 hockey neighborhood. That approach has severly limited the opportunities of schools like NDSU. As a minor sport this loophole has allowed certain schools to enjoy at least a limited D1 status and they find that limited exposure beneficial. Now, other schools like NDSU have waited as long as they intend too. Although hockey may be in the future plans for NDSU the administration has decided that full exposure to the benefits of D1 membership are worth the cost and the risk. One of the big reasons NDSU can make the move is the fact that they dont have the expense of a big hockey program. That can be added later as the shcool adjusts to the new cost/revenue structure. Costs are going to go up in D2 just like everything else but revenues cannot be enhanced. NDSU is now first in line to solve that dilemma. They are embracing all sports at the D1 level, accepting the risks and also prepared to reap the rewards. I would like UND to stay right where they are. The reasons they have cited for staying, and the criticism they have leveled at NDSU and its fans are legitimate, at least for Grand Forks. Things are different in Fargo. Over the years, as this unfolds, that will become glaringly apparent.

Heres a positive look at the D1 move by NDSU: The thing to remember is nothing lasts forever. It wasnt that long ago that UND football was in the tank. NDSU and UND have been pretty evenly matched over the past 5 yrs with UND getting the upper hand, especially last year, but NDSU is young and coming on again with a new team and a lot of talent in the wings. Next year or the year after, or maybe even this year, your team will be second or third. Then what happens to your attendance? Where does it go when you are an average team in an average league with your big game coming when SCSU rolls into town. what if D2 downgrades even further? What if the NCC adds Kearny or Montana State-Billings? Travel costs will be up and revenues down in all D2 sports. An intergal part of the D1 move at NDSU is to add ice hockey. When that happens NDSU will be D1 in all sports. we will also be competiting for hockey players and fans. The quality of athletes coming to UND will probably decrease. Our 63 full ride scholarships are going to be looking pretty good when compared to sharing 36 or maybe 21. As D1AA grows and D2 shrinks the D1AA national fan base will grow as well. Same for basketball in Fargo. Scholarships will be up, competition will be better. This morinings Forum has some insight into the future of the NCC. SDSU is expected to announce its intentions this fall. If they go the domino effect will certainly come about. The NCC is going to change dramatically and the big fish/small pond isnt going to be what it used to be. combine that with the certain exodus of other great programs from D2 including Davis and GVSU, etc. The old formula of D1 hockey D2 in all other sports isnt going to be as profitable as it once was. There is no way to increase revenues in D2. I think that future is watching all sports but hockey go down in intensity and interest. With competition from NDSU hockey may also stagnate. .