82SiouxGuy

It's just too bad that you can't understand what is actually said in the agreement, and what that will actually mean for the program. That includes the fact that North Dakota can't sue again unless the one of the sides completely violates the terms, and you can be sure that the NCAA won't go that far since they will be able to do enough damage with the current terms.

According to Dale Lennon we have probably already lost recruits in football. And anyone that had read the settement knew that hosting was going to be out of the question, even at a neutral site like Fargo.

He may be eating lead paint chips or breathing dust from lead paint.

I believe that he was looking for a direct personal connection. How many attended UND, or how many have had children or other family members that have attended? How many believe that they are actually doing what is right for the University because they are really interested in what is good for UND?

There are several small schools that have been allowed to continue using their nickname because they got approval from local tribes. I believe that there are 3 or 4 Division III schools that got approval. Off the top of my head I remember that one of them uses the Choctaw name. I believe another was using a generic Indians name and had to add the local tribe name. UND didn't get approval during the appeal period.

Utah and Florida State had good working relationships with local tribes. Those local tribes automatically told the NCAA that they approved of using the nicknames as soon as the policy was announced. The NCAA used that reasoning to create an out for all schools that got approval from local tribes. Illinois is different. The name Fighting Illini was originally used to recognize war veterans from Illinois. Shortly after that they followed the trend during that period to start using Native American imagery, and there had been a tribe that used the Illini name. That tribe no longer exists so Illinois couldn't get approval. That is why Illinois can no longer use the mascot and imagery. But the NCAA said they could keep the nickname because the original meaning was to honor war veterans. UND could not get any Sioux tribes to give official approval during the original appeal period. UND sued to change the policy. UND and the NCAA settled the lawsuit, and the terms included giving UND an extra 3 years to get approval, but they had to get approval from 2 specific tribes (the 2 largest namesake tribes in the state). UND got approval from 1 tribe during the settlement period, the other tribe has continuted to oppose use of the name. Therefore UND is now on sanctions by the NCAA.

Maybe you don't realize that UND is still in the transition period of moving to Division I. UND is not eligible to compete in NCAA playoffs in any sports other than men's and women's hockey. They are not currently in a league that gets automatic berths in any of those other sports. And they are finishing the process of moving up a level so they are still working on improving the teams. Transitional schools rarely perform at the same level during transition as they do when they finish the transition. If NDSU can be in the NCAA football playoffs, and win the national title, why couldn't UND compete at the same level? UND was competing at the same level in Division II. NDSU was able to win the title in part because they played all the playoff games at home other than the title game. Home teams have a much higher winning percentage than visiting teams, especially in the playoffs. And that doesn't even factor in the negative recruiting effects of not being able to host playoff games. Taking away the opportunity to compete on a level playing field is not good for UND athletics.

Maybe they understood from day one the trouble that was going to result and the slim chance of keeping the nickname. After all, they were much closer to the situation and probably understood the NCAA much better than most of us looking in from the outside.

For you to say that it would be a totally different team if the nickname goes is very insulting to the people on the team. For you to call people racist because they want to change a logo and nickname rather than watch their school suffer sanctions is absolutely insulting.

You have a perfect right to have feelings for UND and be loyal to UND. And I'm glad that you do. I know a lot of people that have similar feelings. I just believe that people who have attended the school have had different experiences than those who haven't. Therefore they have a different connection.

I didn't say that people who didn't go to school at UND couldn't love or support the school. But I firmly believe that people who attend a school, and those who graduate from that school, have a different connection to the school than those who did not have that daily connection. The connection is probably very similar for those that attend and those that graduate. I was referring to those who have not attended the school versus those who had. Since I am a graduate and Dave didn't attend, that was my frame of reference for the comments. I wasn't even thinking about current students or those that attended without graduating. I'm sorry if I slighted you or anyone that attended UND and did not graduate. That certainly wasn't my intention. I will amend my comment to say, "People that have attended the school have a much different connection to the school than those that haven't."

Well said, sir!

People that have graduated from the school have a much different connection to the school than those that haven't. You just can't grasp that.

I'm only wrong in your mind. The conversation goes on here.

I agree with everything you said except one. The NAIA doesn't have hockey, so if UND would ever have to go to the NAIA the hockey program would probably have to go to the club level.

The teams that actually play on the ice and on the gridiron are the University of North Dakota. The nickname is secondary. But the teams will still exist even if the nickname changes.

As long as they are representing the University of North Dakota, the nickname is secondary. It's the institution that counts rather than the nickname. Of course you don't understand that, you didn't graduate from the school.

Exactly! You don't care about the University of North Dakota. You only care about a name and a logo. That is just sad.

Your favorite "team" only exists in your head.

More and more people associated with the University, including coaches and others directly affected by the issue, have come out in favor of a name change. More and more former UND athletes, people that actually played under the Sioux name, have come out in favor of a name change. Many people that have been very active in the Alumni Association have come out in favor of a name change. And yet you denigrate them. On the other hand, very few of the people leading the charge to keep the nickname seem to have a direct connection to the University. Isn't there a disconnect somewhere in that scenario?

What guarantee is there that Spirit Lake wins their lawsuit? How long is it going to take? The short answers are that Spirit Lake is a long shot to win, and the case could go on for years. Only a fool would bet the future of the athletic program on those bad odds. Of course, since you don't care about the program it doesn't matter to you how much damage is done in the process.

I would bet that athletes at almost every school in the country would disagree with that statement. The Fighting Sioux name and logo isn't magic. It's a great logo, but it isn't bigger than the athletes and the school. Dale Lennon, Dave Hakstol, Mac Schneider and many other former UND athletes have said it is time to let the nickname go. Don't you think that they're closer to the situation, and to how the athletes in the program feel, than you are?

Is it a myth that UND can't host NCAA playoff games? NO! Is it a myth that schools have refused to schedule UND because of the sanctions? NO! Is it a myth that athletes have already decided not to consider UND because of the sanctions? According to Dale Lennon it's already happening. The sanctions have been in place for a month. Do you really believe that this is as bad as it's going to get? If you actually believe that you are even more clueless than you appear to be, and even more clueless than Carlson.

A big part of it is numbers. Other players have more points. Votes for awards are often based on points scored.

They don't have to say a lot. Just mention that the school is under NCAA sanctions for any playoffs. That alone is going to scare a lot of kids off because they aren't going to do a lot of research to learn about the sanctions.