UND92,96

I can't disagree. And frankly it's inexcusable for that to happen.

Two more commitments for 2010: link

UND actually beat Mesa State by a combined 131-14 in the two games at the Alerus in 2002 and 2004. The 2003 loss certainly was a choke, but I guess the fact that it was on the road, and the fact that I believe Mesa actually made the dII playoffs in 2003 made it more palatable to most fans than the Sioux Falls loss is.

Columnists and opposing fans are going to be riding this horse for all its worth for years. Here's the first shot from the Heraldo's own Ryan Bakken:

Here's a blog from Wayne Nelson about the loss: http://www.areavoices.com/waynenelson/

So I guess what he's saying is, we'd be a pretty good NAIA team this year. So we've got that going for us. Which is nice. (*in best Carl Spackler imitation*)

I can't really articulate exactly why, but I'd actually have preferred to finish this season 2-9, having defeated Sioux Falls (and S. Oregon), than to finish around .500, but with a loss to Sioux Falls. Losses to established FCS programs are just far easier to rationalize. The UNO loss you mentioned certainly bothered me, but I didn't have the "sky is falling" feeling I have now. Regardless of how good of a team Sioux Falls is, the stigma of losing to an NAIA team with a fraction of our resources is going to take awhile to get over, at least for me. I admit it, I have a very hard time getting over the NAIA label, not to mention all the other advantages we have relative to a tiny private school.

Lennon used to say the same thing at the dII level. Unfortunately, although our recruiting class of 2009 may have reversed the trend, we've had some trouble recruiting really good linebackers in recent years, too.

O.K., I've solved the mystery of the poor late season/playoff attendance--it was Dale Lennon's fault. How can I say this? Easy: 2008--Southern Illinois season attendance avg.--9055, BUT 11-15 SDSU 5829 11-29 New Hampshire 5461 (playoffs) 2007--UND season attendance avg.--9887, BUT 11-17 Winona St. 5370 (playoffs) Case closed (and no, I'm not serious )

I think the administration deserves some criticism in that that they didn't see this coming, and offer some sort of ticket deal to help boost attendance to an otherwise somewhat unattractive game. It seemed a lot of people knew in advance that student attendance (and probably overall attendance) were going to be down, but nothing was done to help the situation. Also, with regard to the student sections, how is it handled? Do you have to pick up tickets in advance? Are the sections reserved for students even if only a fraction of the tickets are picked up? It seems to me that some sort of system could be set up so that unsold student seats can be sold for $5 or some other discounted price on game day. Isn't that what used to happen with unsold student hockey seats (the availability to the public--not necessarily the discounted price)? Maybe it still is. Do what you need to do to ensure that some of the best seats can still be filled should the students choose not to use them.

I have to admit that I had previously thought that having football and hockey on the same weekend was actually something of an advantage, due to having even more UND sports fans in town than normal. But now, at least with regard to students, I see that it's probably anything but an advantage. As to why so many non-student hockey ticketholders do not regularly attend football, I don't know.

While it's all water under the bridge now, and I certainly don't begrudge Lennon for taking a big raise, the timing of the whole thing in retrospect is unfortunate. Buning was already gone when Lennon left, and Kupchella's impending retirement was roughly a month away. Looking back in time, I can only wonder what might have been had Lennon demanded a big raise (hey, it worked for Chapman ) , and coaxed Bubba back for the dI move. Lennon as head coach...Bubba running the defense...Mussman running the offense..sign some juco's to fill in the holes from all the early departures, and oh, what may have been...

When something like this happened to the men's basketball program, it resulted in fan apathy, which hasn't really been overcome since. That's my concern. We can all debate what, if any changes need to be made, but if the public loses faith/interest in the program, it becomes difficult to get back, and it costs the athletic department a lot of money in lost ticket sales. It may be a big problem in both Grand Forks and Fargo next season unless things improve quickly.

Good question. While our linebacking talent certainly isn't great right now, I question whether it's being utilized correctly. The 3-4 is clearly still working for Bubba at SIU right now. Heck, it's apparently even working better for Sioux Falls than it is here, and I doubt their overall talent level is any better than UND's. I'm afraid the problem is that few programs were using it, so when our d-coordinators have left, we've almost been forced to promote from within. Sometimes it has worked. Unfortunately, sometimes it hasn't. I hope Mussman consults with Lennon and Bubba after the season. I'm sure they could give an honest assessment of the state of our defense, and who may be out there who could improve it. Frankly, although I'm very unhappy with our defense, if the two coaches who built this system say that the coaching isn't the problem, I'll believe them.

I completely respect your opinion, and agree that no judgments should be made until the end of the season. But I can't blame anybody for being critical, and I'm not sure any posts have really been over the line all things considered. It was pretty tame compared to what would have happened had the hockey team gotten swept by a dIII team. This is likely the most humiliating loss by a UND team in any sport, ever. I am far more bothered by this than the string of losses to DAC teams by the men's basketball team in the mid-2000's. I think the offense gets a pass this year due to youth and unexpected personnel losses at running back the past two years. Plus, Mussman knows offense. But the defense? Barring a miracle turnaround the last five games, that's an area which must be addressed after the season. Enough is enough.

Dale Lennon hasn't lost his touch--SIU won at Northern Iowa today.

And on the other hand, NDSU's classes immediately after a couple of 10-1 seasons weren't overly good. You just never know. I'm not really as worried about recruiting as much as X's and O's right now.

I'm pretty sure we'll beat S. Oregon. But I've resigned myself that 4-7 is the best we can do. Hopefully we can just avoid being embarrassed in the remaining FCS games.

At least that will mean NDSU can't recruit, either.

One other thing I forgot to mention about Mussman--he was a good offensive coordinator, and a good o-line coach. That's why I'm not as concerned about these areas as I am about the defense. Both areas need to be improved, but I have faith that he will make sure it happens.

I think Mussman did a good job salvaging what could have been a disastrous 2008 class (given Lennon's late departure), and by most accounts the class of 2009 is looking good. Mussman can recruit. But I think the defense is broken right now--completely broken--and it wouldn't surprise me if Faison makes some decisions for Mussman that may be quite difficult to make if they were completely up to Mussman.

There's plenty of blame to go around for the state of the program. For example, although there's probably not a bigger Dale Lennon fan than me, let's remember he was in charge for the recruiting classes of 2005, 2006 and 2007 (all sub-par), and he made the decision on the replacement(s) for Tim Tibesar. The defense has gotten progressively worse every year since about 2005. The numbers don't lie.

I lived through something like this once before as a UND football fan, in the mid-1980's. The difference was, I was just a kid back then and it didn't bother me anywhere near as much that we were horrible.

What a trainwreck. And there are still five games to go.

For whatever it's worth, UND had three rivals 2-star recruits last year--Binns, Finley and Goodman. Demler is also a 2-star prospect.