engelbunny

And don't forget, your experience at North Dakota will be the last time in your life that you get to be part of a team and a program that you chose to play for, and with teammates that made that same choice. There is something special about that. While it is hard to pass up the money, and the NHL is the ultimate dream, it will still be there in a year or two. Don't be in a hurry to grow up! You have the rest of your life to be an adult, but only the next year or two to remain a kid. The preceeding message also applies to TJ, Taylor, Ryan, Brian, Joe, etc, etc.

There are 4 of us also staying at the Drury Plaza. 4th & Market Street. 11 blocks from the arena, close to the arch. It took some doing, but Taz Boy will be with. Go Sioux, bring home #8!

Sorry, I was reading an earlier post where 3 was still available. I'll change to #23. Ralph would have enjoyed that Gopher / HC hockey game!

I'd Like #3.

That is just plain and simple a stupid and unfounded rumor. Ralph's trust has no control over the arena anyway.

Is this Heaven? No, It's North Dakota!

$16 is the actual face value of the tickets. ($355 per ticket package / 22 games = $16.13) Obviously that does not take into account the FSC donation, but I don't know if NDSU has a similar arrangement for their tickets, so I did not factor this extra cost in. In any event, the actual cost of the Sioux Hockey ticket is of course much higher, and therefore leads even more credence to my argument. People are more willing to shell out the bucks for Sioux Hockey as opposed to Bison Football.

To make an argument about the popularity of D-1 Hockey vs D-1AA football as a whole based upon attendance statistics is tough becuase there is such a wide range among institutions. For example, in 2003-04 hockey (attendance figures used in an above post) the team with the highest average attendance (UW) had 269,123 fans with a per game average of 11,701. The lowest team was American International with a total attendance of 2,267 and a per game average of 161. But the statement made by Bohl was not about the sports as a whole, but specifically Bison football vis-a-vis Sioux Hockey. Current year stats: Bison Football: Total Attendance 84,962 - 6 Home Games - Avg per Game 14,160 FargoDome Capacity 18,500 Percent of Capacity on Average 76.54% Ticket Price $16.00 Sioux Hockey: Total Attendance 239,230 - 22 Home Games - Avg per Game 10,874 REA Capacity 11,406 - Percent of Capacity on Average 95.33% Ticket price $16.00 Bison football resides in a much bigger local market area than Sioux Hockey, has only just over 25% of the games, a similar ticket price, and yet can only get the building 3/4 full on average. Which is more popular?

Wow! What is with all the whining? A little muse on student's drinking: (I'm talking about drinking of the more casual variety, not chronic alcoholism, so don't soap box me.) Yes, drinking is a part of the college life. Some students drink too much at times. Some of those students also go to hockey games, but not all the students that attend the games are drunk. And from my point of view, I could really care less if they were. Whoop-dee-do. Drink all you want, as long as you walk back home. I'll have a beer at the games, but can't get liquored up because I have to drive. If I didn't, I might. Who cares? It is not the drunk part that is annoying. Many people who get drunk are good natured and funny. But then again, many get belligerent or obnoxious. That is where the problem comes in. Nobody likes anyone who is obnoxious, whether they are drunk or not. The constant standing came across as obnoxious and belligerent. The fact that some of those students were also drunk, while inconsequential to the crux of the matter, just adds more fuel to the fire. Last week-end the students sat and were widely commended on this board. I don't recall anyone even bringing up anything about alcohol consumption. All of the student's could have been completely wasted, and most people wouldn't have noticed, because they were not being obnoxious or belligerent. Now, a little about standing, which I have always maintained is the only real problem. It would be great if the arena had a different lower bowl design that could accomodate a large block of people standing all the time without blocking anyone else's view. But it simply doesn't. There is no place in the lower bowl where standing won't block someone's view, because the suites ring the entire arena. If the first row of seats at ice level were 15 feet from the playing surface (like a basketball court), it would be less of a problem. But they aren't. So quit crying about it. The arena is what it is, and what it is - is pretty freaking nice. I bet most college hockey teams would love to have our "problems". While everyone agrees that the students are essential to the college game experience, nobody is going to show much sympathy if you keep making demands and calling for everyone else to compromise so that you can continue a behavior which is not necessary, and so then seems; well, obnoxious (drunk or not).

The songs are on this website - link on the main page. Lyrics and real audio files. But here are the lyrics anyway: Fight on Sioux (Lyrics) Fight on Sioux, we're all for you We're thousands of strong and loyal souls We know you'll win every game you're in No matter how distant the goals As we go, we'll show each foe that We're the toughest team between the poles We're rough and tough it's true But we're sportsmen through and through We're the fighting Sioux from North Dakota U Stand Up & Cheer (Lyrics) Stand up and cheer Stand up and cheer for North Dakota Pledge your loyalty For she's your Alma Mater true. Our team is fighting And we will help them see it thru We've got the team We've got the steam So North Dakota here's to you These are great college songs and it takes about 2 minutes to memorize them. Maybe some student group or the cheerleaders can print them out and put a copy on every student seat. Once the students get this going, then move on getting the words on the scoreboard for the rest of the crowd.

Major props to the student section tonight. The Drunk but not Disorderly sign was very good humor. Most clever cheer was "We Want Shep-ard!" My 11 year old daughter got that one and thought it was really funny. Do not get discouraged if the old foggies are not joining in right away. It will take time. It will take alot of repetition until everyone begins to understand that in situation x, the cheer is y. I would like to hear the students sing the school songs. 2500 students singing "Fight on Sioux" - slowly at first and then building speed to a deafening cresiendo (along with the band) as the Sioux are going to take the ice would be impressive. The whole student section should be singing "Stand up and Cheer" after a goal, once the initial crowd yell has subsided. Eventually the rest of the people in the arena will get it. Tradition building for cheers has to start sometime. Keep up the great work.

This is a copy of a post I made last April: My recommendations to the students: Give up the standing all the time crap. You cannot win on this one. It is just plain stupid. Stand when the play calls for it and sit down otherwise. To continue to whine about this is a monumental waste of everyone

You are an embarassment to the concept of logic. The tuition you pay is for an education. The fact that your title of enrolled student allows you a discount on the market price of UND athletic tickets is a bonus to you. Get a grip. I have said it over and over and over, the students will never win on this line of reasoning. It is juvenile. It is silly. It is laughable. Grow the hell up. What is it about the fact that continually blocking someone else's view may cause them to get upset that escapes you? Why is this so freaking hard to understand? It is not about compromise, because one side is clearly in the wrong. There is no way to sugarcoat it. The students are stupid to argue that there should be some sort of concession in order to get them to practice common decency to those situated beside and behind them. Stand when it is appropriate, and otherwise sit down. If you need to be given a list of of circumstances that qualify as appropriate, then you are either an idiot; or you know better, but enjoy the role of the renegade ass. Yes, the students are an integral part of the hockey experience. But you people are lazy. Get of your high horses, or your lazy asses, and be productive. Learn the school songs. Develop some traditional cheers that the whole crowd can join in on. The M-I-N-N-E... cheer the gophers do is silly, but when done in unison by 10,000 people, it is kind of cool. Everyone young and old can do it. St. Cloud had the "Seive" chant, Wisco, does their take on the Budwieser song. All of their fans know it. The only thing UND students do in unison is bitch. So for the last time, suck it up. Go to the meeting with some ideas to better your cause but quit crying for the other side to give. You are not on a two way street. You are on a one way road to upperdecksville, and I implore you to take the next exit off.

I'm not saying the students should "bend over and grab their ankles". But they should stop shoving their own foots in their own rear-ends. The argument boils down to this: Students want to stand all the time, and the season tickets holders want to be able to see. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. So all of the other stuff you mention is meaningless unless it is used for justification for the ability to stand and block someone else's view. I am student so I can stand. I pay activity fees so I can stand. I have to pay for hockey tickets now when I used to get in free so I deserve the right to stand. You can't have a university without students, so we will stand if we want. Blah, blah blah. It makes no sense. You are arguing that the student's right to be disrespectful trumps all other rights. That is a loser argument on so many levels, the easiest one being the economics of the situation. So the students need to relieve themselves of their disdain for "the man" and go the meeting with the attitude of making a positive. If they don't, they will lose, plain and simple. I personally think that part of the problem is the method of ticketing for the students. (And ticketing is a UND athletic department issue, not an REA issue.) Anyway, I think the lower bowl seats should go to the die hard student fans. Let 'em camp out for 3 days to get the tickets if they want. Those are the students who are more apt to understand the situation and be cognizant of the stakes.

Just some thoughts on the discussion. The nickname, in my opinion, has nothing to do with this issue. It is simply about the standing. Go ahead and jump up and cheer when the situation calls for it: a breakaway, a big hit, a possible fight, an important face-off, etc. Nobody cares about that. What is driving this whole situation is the Student's desire to stand all the time. It is standing just for standings sake, because you know it is pissing people off. Most of the time, the student section isn't even cheering. Many of them are just standing with their hands in their pockets and looking around with a kind of a smug satisfied look because they know they are irritating the season ticketholders around them. The "they should stay home and watch it on TV" arguement is just simply not a winner for the students. Simple economics will dictate that the students will lose this issue. When person x is paying $1,500 for his seat and student y is paying $60, ... well, I think you can figure that one out. Look, sure it is a hockey game. People that go should, and do, expect that there will be some unruly behavor and rough language. But when they pay good money to go and see the game, they expect to be able to see the game, not some student's ass. They also don't expect to be told to F*** themselves if they ask the said student to stop blocking their view. Would those same students tell their own parents or grandparents to go and F*** themselves if they asked them to sit down. Well, most all of those season ticket holders are someone's parents or grandparents, and so the disrespect is pretty hard for them to take.

I think some of this may well stem from the Denver series. I am aware of a couple instances. In the first, a season ticket holder asked some students to please sit down because they were blocking his view of the opposite corner. He was promptly told to go f*** himself. This did not sit well. In the second instance, students in the lower bowl were not just standing, but standing on their seats, thus obstructing the view of the suiteholders behind them even more than usual. They were also asked to sit down, and again the reply was similar - Go F*** Yourself! This really, really did not sit well. In the case of both instances, nothing particularly exciting was happening on the ice at the time. So the students were pretty much just standing to be belligerent. Now I don't care if student behavior may or may not have been worse before, but the students are not going win a battle against the season ticket holders by telling them to exercise practices of self-fornication. Like it or not, Sioux athletics are big business, and the bill is footed by the season ticket holders. All of whom are required to donate to the Fighting Sioux Club for the right to purchase tickets. Also, most of the Suiteholders are long-time Sioux Supporters who donate large bucks to the University, notwithstanding the hefty annual fee they pay for their suite. You can complain all you want about the "corpies", but they foot the bills. Practicality suggests then, that it is not in the best interests of UND or REA to dismiss their complaints in favor of the students' right to stand just for the sake of standing. I would bet that almost all of the other behavior that has been mentioned (drinking, swearing, etc) would be more or less overlooked if the people on the sides of, and directly behind the students were allowed to watch the game without being subjected to an obstructed view for extended periods of time. It is not rocket science.

I am in complete agreement with the above statement. You don't punish the whole for the sins of a few. Yet, I would have a hard time labeling myself as a liberal.

I find this to be quite interesting and something of a disconnect for me. I enjoy reading your posts and if it were not for you proclaiming your liberalness, I wouldn't think to put you in that category. With having never met you, my opinion from your posts is that you are an advocate for personal responsibility, you feel that respect is to be earned by ones actions towards themselves and others, you put your family first, are God-fearing, love your country, and can form a coherent and well-reasoned argument based upon facts and logic rather than emotion. Those are not traits that I connect with liberalism. Maybe because in my mind, the word "liberal" has been hijacked by the very far left extremists and doesn't mean what it used to anymore. Anyway, I'm not trying to be a smart-ass or anything, I'm just kind of scratching my head.

PWEEBOO: People Who are Effectively Empowered by Being Outraged or Offended Official Motto: The Right to be Outraged or Offended is Effectively Necessary to our Ability to have any Power. Official Rules: Rule #1: The intentions of users of words, phrases, or symbols, shall not be relevant to their usage. Rule #2: Use of words, phrases, or symbols, shall be construed to mean the worst possible thing that they could possibly mean by those with the incentive to take the greatest offense, provided that they are members of an officially protected class, or claim to be a representative thereof. Rule #3: Rule # 2 does not apply to the officially protected class itself. Rule #4: White Christians are not an officially protected class. Rule #5: Others who disagree with the position of the Officially Protected Class shall be considered to have voluntarily relinquished membership in that or any other Officially Protected Class. Rule #6: PWEEBOO reserves the right to reverse itself on the meaning of words, phrases, or symbols at any time, without prior notification. (In the interests of full disclosure, credit for this idea came from a poster with the username

First of all, the media was too busy spewing reports of sensationalistic claims of murders, rapes, and canablism - THAT NEVER HAPPENED, to worry about the economic impact of the hurricane. Politics first, especially if it is good, juicy, race baiting politics. Secondly, Americans are more than happy to provide assistance to those who need short-term help to get an education, have good child care, medical needs, etc, as they work to better themselves. Americans also feel a duty to provide long-term assistance, even life-long, to those who are absolutely incapable, because of significant physical or mental handicaps, of caring for themselves. That is what is great about America. What the average American is getting quite sick of, is being told they are not doing enough to take care of the people who are able, but not willing, to take care of themselves. We see the whiner, in yet another situation that is terrible, but avoidable, and we feel some pity. We open our hearts and wallets once again, because we are Americans. But we see and hear the whiner apologist and we get disgusted and pissed. A great number of those people were still there precisely because they are so used to being told, as you put it, "we'll take care of you." That is what they expect, someone will take care of them. That is precisely the point you are missing. They have been continually failed by those who are constantly telling them, "we'll take care of you." And when they are not taken care of, those same blowhards that make the promises in the first place are the very people who shift the blame to someone else. The cycle of dependency is a spiral to despair. And since when did armfuls of shoes, TV's, DVD players, etc, etc, become such necessary staples of subsistence, that a natural disaster gives anyone the right to go and take them.

Hey, Gk: The original Su-FI discussion was in this thread http://siouxsports.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=4554&st=40 and meant as a gesture to the NCAA. You are touchy. Also, how do you like my new avatar? Can you guess what it is?

That was awesome.

Racist. Is there a term that creates more righteous indignation? I think not. It is always the supposed sufferer of the alleged racism that so cavalierly tosses the word about. Yet, despite all of the alleged abuse and injustice, there seems to be a certain smugness and satisfaction in being able to play the aggrieved party. Certainly, there have been injustices heaped upon different peoples. That has always been the case throughout history when civilizations clash. The more technologically advanced civilization always came out on top, regardless of race. That has been human nature since the dawn of man. There is nothing any of us can do about it. It happened here in the United States, but it is not happening now, and none of us, or our parents, or probably even our grandparents had anything to do with it. So that argument is pointless. Now, I am not suggesting that there are not individuals today who are true bigots, because I will allow that there are. But it is my belief that people like this are rare in the United States, and becoming more rare all the time. I am also not suggesting that there are not clear cut instances of racial injustices even today, because there are. But I believe that these instances are addressed in a serious and thoughtful manner, by serious and thoughtful people. What seems to be the biggest modus operandi in this country, is the rush to label every problem suffered by any minority as a de facto result of racism on the part of the majority. It is always the claim. The majority is getting sick of the label. The majority is not racist. I do believe, however, that there is a deep resentment between the majority and the minority in this country. I will even admit that I harbor this resentment. But it has nothing to do with race. It has also nothing to do with color, sex, sexual orientation, or religion. It has to do with who makes up the majority and who makes up the minority. So who are they? They are who I will label the worker class and the whiner class. If a person belongs to the worker class, the majority, then generally, the rest of the majority has respect for them. Oh, they may have differences of opinion, but they are able to settle those differences in a civilized and respectful manner. Many times they must resolve to agree to disagree, but most always the respect is maintained. The other class is the do nothing whiner. The interclass relationship is highly strained because there is no mutual respect. (There is also some overlap between the classes, as some people who are good hard working individuals, are also tragically entrenched whiners. In addition, I am completely excluding the elitist class from this discussion because that requires an entirely more lengthy commentary.) Those of us who get up everyday and go to work to support our families, perform volunteer service for our communities, and do what we can to be good citizens for our great country, have no respect for those who do not. It is that simple. (And notice I said those who do not, not those who cannot). And so we are unwilling to really listen to their constant whining with any degree of sympathy. Our immediate reaction is, why don

Dear Mr. GrahamKracker: A man, not of particularly handsome features or pleasant odiferous qualities, walked into a fine establishment and approached a genuinely attractive and nubile young lady. "Why Miss," he proffered, "would you be willing to perform the horizontal bop with me for the sum of $1 million US dollars?" Somewhat amused, she answered back, "Sure honey, I'd sleep with you for that kind of money." "Well how about for ten bucks we go out back and you can spit shine the old polish?" he inquired. Indignant, she shot back, "What is this? You think I am some kind of whore?" "That," he replied, "we just most recently established as fact. Now comes the haggling over price!" Anyway, I am quite fond of the Nabisco Honey Grahams myself. Mahalo.

Ouch! Why must you hurt me so, great Taz. Anyway, I have the perfect new nickname should the University decide that the cost of keeping the Fighting Sioux name outweighs the benefits. (bigmrg74 alluded to it in his post promoting the "middle finger, but this goes one better). There is the benefit of keeping the "soo" phonetic, as well as having the perfect of twist of sticking it to the N$AA. It is call the Su-fi. Developed by the legendary comedic talent of Dane Cook. It even has it's own logo. Fo a complete explanation, see the following link: (Warning! By clicking on this link you agree not to be offended by spectacularly offensive language. If you are under 18, stay clear. If you are over 50, consult a physician. If your login name is "grahamkracker", develop a sense of humor.) Dane Cook's Su-Fi Go Sioux! Taz Sucks.