UNDhockey22
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Posts posted by UNDhockey22
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South is just a bunch of individuals. They don't play as a team at all. If they want to win games against good teams they need to rely on their teammates instead of trying to do it all by themselves. I think that is why it seems as if they are getting worse. Every other team is just learning to play with eachother as a team.
Agreed. South has some very good individuals, but not so good that they can play the game 1 vs. 5. Hockey is a team game, and you cannot accomplish much without using the other four guys on the ice. If South keeps this up, I don't see any team but Grafton that has a shot at stopping Red River from running away with another title. Maybe Dean needs to take a page out of the coach for the Boston Bruins book. He put five players in the d-zone, and one player on the red line. Gave the player on the red line the puck and said go score.
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Who will win the 2nd meeting of these two teams?
I doubt South will play as poorly as they did last time, but I think Red River will play as good if not better than there first meeting, because they are at home. Also, some people may still consider Red River the underdogs and I'm sure that will have them fired up. As far as a winner, I have no idea.
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Very interesting.
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Consequences of blurring the line between coach and friend can be as innocent as no discipline of the team/player all the way to providing alcohol for team/player on up to sexual misconduct. All of these have happened in ND within the past 5 years.
Wow. Like I said, the object is to a friend and coach at all times. During games and practices it is most effecient to be just a coach. But besides that you want to be both. There are some people who are so sick and twisted that would take advantage of a player and do something like sexual misconduct. Every once and a while there may be one so corrupt that he would buy his players alcohol. However, that is going to happen whether the person is coaching hockey or not. I do not believe no matter how good of friends Jay Erickson, Dean Wilson, Matt Malm, Brett Stockert, Bina, the list goes on they would purchuse alcohol for or sexually abuse one of their players. If that's what you believe, we should have had stricter background checks on these guys, because they are ticking timebombs around our kids...
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Yes it was a big road win for the team. It should help them carry some momentum into the West Region turnament. They are realy clicking on all cylinders right now. Also, they are good in the defensive zone. Like I said, the JV game's reffing was worse than the Varsity game's. But for instance in the Varsity game, one of the Minot players fell down in front of the net. The puck was no where to be seen and there was a scrum. But the reffs would not blow the whistle. When they finaly did, it turned out that the Minot player was on top of the puck (out of the crease) and they gave him a delay of game penalty. You can not give a kid a delay of game penalty for just not getting up when there is a scrum going on.
But you can give him a penalty if he is intentionally covering the puck to prevent a goal from being scored.
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This is another unrelated note but I was looking at the roster for the Buffalo Sabres and forward Paul Gaustad was listed as being from Fargo, ND. Does anyone have any information on this?
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U must be one who like little boys because you are thinking Boner. I hope I don't see you on Dateline. And as far as the Gophers not wanting him you are wrong because I know from really close source to Chad. Not saying they are pushing hard for him just simply stateing they are looking at him. MAYBE YOU ARE JUST SPOILER HATER.....
Come on guys lets be civil. It is not uncommon for players to get looked at by division one colleges early in their high school years. (This is not intended to be a knock on Demers, or any of the following players named.) Trevor Anderson of the Fargo South Bruins was sent a letter from the NTDP when he was in either ninth grade or his sophomore year in high school, telling him that they would be scouting him. Elliot Okland of Fargo North had an abundance of letters from division one schools after his impressive campaign at the Select 17 festival. What it comes down to is that these teams look at everyone that has the slightest chance of developing into something big. Looking, and recruiting are two different things entirely. If such a statement is true, good for Chad Demers and that should be all the more incentive to work harder in the off-season. If it is not true, it should not have been stated on this board in the first place.
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On an unrelated note- Todd Rudasill (Alpena-NAHL) has commited to division one Ohio State.
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Once again, your words hint at Bina not being there for his player. Bina not being a good enough friend or outlet for his player. If Bina is such as a harda** how come more players haven't quit? With the way their season is going this year, you would think that it would happen. Bina didn't get a whole lot of playing time going through high school because he was stuck behind Moreland, yet he did not quit, he stuck it out. Perhaps kids are just different these days as being a quitter doesn't seem to have the stigma that it once did.
I am in no way, shape, or form trying to convey the message that Bina is a poor coach. My previous post was in reply to a post that coach's should not be friend to their players. It is very possible however, that Alex Simonson felt he was being mistreated and could no longer handle the situation. Was Coach Bina treating Alex poorly? I don't know. And many of us do not. My intentions are to simply provide logical reasons as to why Simonson chose to quit the team in the attempt to take some of the heat off his back that many people are putting on him on this message board.
Maybe you can clarify something for you in my post. You make the point that hardly any players quit from centrals team (true statement), and that you would think more players would with the rough season central is having, but then you go on to say that being a quitter these days does not hold the stigma that it once did (implying that more kids are quitting). Does that make sense?
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I could not disagree more. High School coaches are to be respected and trusted, but are not friends to their players (at least not while they are still players). As a coach, at this level, becoming the players friend could have devastating consequences. Friends, while trust and respect are good attributes to have, must also on some level be peers. Coaches, by their very nature, are not peers.
For instance, discipline: coaches need to, and in fact are expected to, handle player and team discipline. Friends do not. Friends may advise and be a sounding board or even suggest what to do. But they do not handle the discipline. Coaches, teachers and parents do, and while they are doing so they are not friends in that sense, though they may be liked. When parents, coaches and teachers become HS students friends, bad things happen.
I have my level 4 coaching certification. I know what is expected of coach's at youth and high school levels. From my level 3 three coaching manual (you need a level three to coach high school) it says- "Be a good friend. Sometimes players do not know how to be friends with coach's or even adults. As their friend, they look for someone to share expierances with, someone to laugh with, someone to work with, someone to trust, someone to turn to, and someone who cares." Obviously, coach's will not be friends in the sense to where you will call them and ask the to come over and play playstation. However, like you would call a friend when you are having trouble at home, coach's are supposed to provide a similar outlet. At the high school level a good coach can relate to the player on various levels. Respect is a very important part of being an effective coach. However, if you are not available for a kid when he needs an outlet, you will lose that respect and the odds of maintaining discipline throughout the team will decrease greatly. The object of coaching at the high school level is not only to win. It is to win, but not to do so at the cost of a students emotional and physical well being. Such practices as neglecting the feelings and problems of a high school student will only further the distance between a coach and his players, which will in turn reduce the chance the players will respond to the coaches systems, desires, motivational speeches and so forth. So in that respect, without maintaining a relationship with your players at a personal level, the opportunity of success in your program reduces greatly.
I am curious what the devastating consequences may be of being a friend of a player and coach. Because the object is not to only be a friend, or to only be a coach. So in that respect, being a friend to the player should not affect the ability to coach the player because you are relating to him on more than one level.
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No Diechert on there? I think that if South goes deep into State, which they most likely will do, I have to think that Diechert or Wurden will be Mr. Hockey. You have to give McDougall credit for getting points, but I don't see him winning Mr. Hockey. He should be getting points like that with all of the other good players around him. Miller is also having a good year, and he has had a very successful High School career. Sorry if this is a dumb question, but when they vote for Mr. Hockey, do they just base it off the most recent season, or over the seasons the players have played at the High School Level?
Although the voting is based on the season at hand, I believe previous years sometimes sway a coach's vote. I used to joke Paul Weisgarber had Mr. Hockey won before his senior season even began. Just my two cents.
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Wheeler's not signing suprised me a lot. I have to believe he was not offered. I believe he is now subjected to the new CBA bonus limitations, but he may get a better chunk via a grandfather clause. No one is going to get rich playing hockey anymore unless they earn it at the NHL level. Doesn't matter who you are or where you were drafted if you can't stick with the big club.
That depends on what you're definition of "get rich" is I suppose. If you're comparing them to other professional sports, then no, they won't get rich. But there are players in the AHL making more than 100,000 a year. Thats not too shabby in my book.
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To quote UNDhockey22, "that is life". There will always be people expecting more and quitting is not always an option.
My quote "that is life" reffered to things you cannot control and how unfair those things can be. I think that was fairly apparent, but you interpreted it how you felt it was best support your own opinions. If there is a negative situation that you can control anyone in the right mind would do their best to change the situation. To be frank, the only person Alex Simonson needs to please is himself. If the situation was so negative that it affected his play and enjoyment of the game I'm not about to criticize the kid for getting out of a bad situation. Obviously, quitting in many cases is seen as a cope out. The last resort. But when I think of quitting in a negative way it is when someone is unsuccessful at first attempt of something and decides to give up on ones self and move on. I do not think many of us know how Alex Simonson was treated, or how that affected the enjoyment of the game. Because when all is said and done, isn't that what high school hockey is about? These kids are not paid, and get to play in their hometown with all of there buddies. Right now, it's about playing for the love of the game (as it always should be, in my mind).
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If Alex can't handle a high school coach, what makes him think he can go on and play in the USHL. Tony is the coach. Period. If the kids have no respect for their coach they have no business being on a team. I take it Alex never played football, because if he thinks Bina is a hard coach he should have played for Berg. Tony is not there to be Alex's friend, he is the coach. Suck it up Alex, it only gets harder from here. Good thing Blais doesn't coach for the Sioux, Alex would have been crying the first day.
Unless you know the situation I'd avoid ripping into Simonson. Truth be told, high school coachs are supposed to be a players friend. This is not college hockey or pro hockey or Herb Brooks 1980 Olympic team (where you probably got the idea to say such a thing, "I will be your coach, I won't be your friend."). At every youth level the players are frequently told by their coachs that if they ever need anything or anyone to talk to about problems they are having in life, school, or with their girlfriend that they can talk to their coach.
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The kid obviously has talent and I probably am wrong about RR cutting players better than him, but...
Tony Bina is also a very nice and decent person so why not play for him? I guess I'm from the school of thought where you either don't start the season with Central, or else you start and finish the season with Central. Don't quit halfway through. It is not like this is Bina's first year, so kids coming in know what to expect out of him. Hypothetically, what would you say to the last kid that got cut from Central who truly wanted to play but couldn't because someone beat him out only to quit a couple of games into the year? The only reason I label this as hypothetical, is because with Central's low numbers I don't know how many if any kids got cut.
Life is unfair. If a player was left of the team and then a spot was opened when Simonson quit the team, it is truely unfortunate. But, that's life. And it's better kids learn these lessons now then when they are out of college looking for a job. Maybe Simonson knew what to expect, but maybe he and Bina were not on good terms to begin with. It only takes a coach humiliating a player in front of the team once (just an example, I don't have any evidence to say this happend) to make a player want to leave the team. Just a thought.
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More woes for Minot High School Hockey & Athletics overall. Our favorite Minot hockey player Dillon Kraft and Goalie Guy Weber were kicked off the hockey team by the school because pictures of them drinking alcohol at a party were found by school authorities on a girls MySpace blog. A basketball player and wrestler were also in photos of drinking alcohol during the party and were also removed from there team rosters. This is still developing and I'm not sure whether the parents are going to even try to fight this decision and try and get there kids back on there team.
Why not say the photos were digitally enhanced because they two hockey players had an altercation with the girl and she had it out for them. Haha, maybe not very realistic, but an interesting claim if it were to be tried.
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I'm not sure that success in the Elite league is necessarily a fair reflection of ability. There are typically no tryouts for the team, and players are often placed upon the team based upon reputation of past selection on Select teams. There were a few Elite 1 players that did not make the Team North Dakota for Chicago, and a few more that did not make Junior A teams. In other words, they no longer made the team based upon past performance or reputation. There were also several players from Minnesota who played Elite 1 who were outperformed on Junior A teams by players that were not as fortunate to be selected. Furthermore, success on an Elite 1 team is often directly proportionate to who that person is playing with and the amount of playing time. Jordy Christian and Aaron Marvin are great players, but they also logged more than their fair share of playing time.
I'm not saying that is necessarily the case with Jake McDougall, but I would not measure his ability by whether he made Elite 1 or how well he performed (e.g. points scored).
I'm not sure what you mean by there are typically no tryouts for the team. By saying that you are implying that some years there are tryouts and some years there are not. In any sense, the Elite league does hold tryouts (that is how Grant Larson made the team). If you are reffering to players that played Elite one in the 2005 season and then tried out for team ND, all of which who tried out made the team. A fact that is 100% contrary to your previous statement. Marc Mihulka, Andy Peterson, Andy Dittus, Ross Monson, Jake Delisle, and Nick Klenow all made Team ND. With that information 100% opposite of what you stated, I am not going to take the time to search if Elite one players from MN were outperfomed by players that did make Elite one.
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So then who is?
According to some in this message board, it may be Eric Herbel. I have yet to see Michael Hillman play this year but I would have to think he's a favorite to be a Mr. Hockey candidate from the West. As of right now Hillman is the top senior goalie in the west with a 90% save percentage.
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I completely agree with you on how he should move the puck when someone has a better opportunity to score, but their whole first line has the same problem. I've seen him set up goals with some great passes but he would be even more of a threat if he used his linemates a little bit more. There's no doubt in my mind that the kid can flat out play and i think he deserves more recognition. He's one hell of a penalty killer too. Plus he's one of the best at winning faceoffs i've seen in awhile.
South obviously has a problem with holding on the the puck, which was proven when Coach Wilson split the first line up. I agree Souths entire first line holds on to the puck too long, but more often than not its McDougall I see taking a low percentage shot on 3 on 2's and 2 on 1's. I'd like to give McDougall some credit on the nice pass he made to Hooey instead of only saying negative things. He executed the pass perfectly, but that pass doesn't really tell me he is not a selfish player. What other option did have other than passing? It doesn't matter how selfish you are, if you have a player who is clearly on a breakaway if you get them the puck, the pass will be made. Maybe the way I rate a players perfomance and skill level is not 100% reliable, but I like to measure a players success on how they do outside of high school hockey where the competition is generally higher. Obviously, some conclusions can be drawn from how a player performs in high school hockey. In most cases, good players will be successful, and poor players will not be successful. But in some cases, opposite players expierance opposite results. What I mean by that is if they play selects, elite league, exposure camps, etc. Now I'm aware there are some flaws in this because some players choose not to play in the summer months and unable to play in these tournements. In most cases, I try not to evaluate such players unless I am comparing them to a player who is obviously significantly better by means of the intensity the player the other player is recruited. My point is, outside of high school hockey, McDougall has not been very impressive. And I believe that, if you are not a truely good player, the odds of you seeing success outside of high school hockey is very low. And if you are a special player, you will see success. If my memory serves me correctly McDougal did not make the Elite 1 team, and had to play with the Elite 2 league (a league that is actually not affialiated with Elite 1, I believe there was some controversy over the league being named Elite 2). He was then made an alternate for the Elite 1 team behind other Fargo South players Kris Graalum and Ian Powers (Graalum is listed as a forward). Jake is having a great senior season, and I expect him to continue succeeding throughout the season.
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This is a great thread with a lot of great analysis. Probably some of the more thoughtful and analytical stuff I have seen on high school hockey issues, juniors, etc.
Here is a thought that I am tossing out with no particular intention - in terms of this debate - just a fact I discovered.
Last year when Holy Cross beat the Gophers in hockey I went to the Holy Cross website to take a look at where their players had done their "developmental" work in juniors. As we know, the Gophers, like many WCHA teams, pick up kids from NTDP in Michigan, the USHL, etc. Holy Cross had three players from the NAHL (Helena, Bismarck, and Witchita Falls). Again, I am not forwarding a particular point but simply indicating that a team who accomplished a major upset had three players from a Tier II Junior "A" Level League (USHL is Tier I).
Interesting I found preliminary rankings for the NHL central scouting. Not in numerical order but players listed as "A" prospects (first three rounds) and "B" prospects. Nine players from the NAHL were listed as "B" prospects, none were listed as "A".
The players are: Brenden Brickley of Texas, Cody Ikkala of Marquette, Doug Leaverton of Mahoning Valley, Patrick Maroon of St. Louis, Brad Mccabe of Alaska, Steve Sperry of Marquette, Scooter Vaughn of St. Louis, Austin Lee of Fargo, and Stephan Dacosta of Texas.
The USHL right now has 9 players listed as "A" prospects. They also have 35 players listed as "B" prospects. I would list them all but you get the point. Jordan Willert was on the list however.
Although there is a much larger number of players from the USHL on this watch list, the 9 players listed from the NAHL is still very impressive. I believe last year there was only 1 or 2 players from the NAHL listed.
Also noted- Jordy Christian and Jeff Foss were both listed as "B" prospects. While John Lee was listed as an "A" prospect. Kai Kantola who played with Fargo last years is listed again as a "B" prospect. Brian Shack who played for Southern Minnesota is listed as a "B" prospect aswell.
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I thought Fargo South was very unimpressive tonight. Danny Wurden is a solid player but he and his other D mates looked like they just threw the puck around sloppily instead of making crisp passes...maybe Red River's forecheck was too much for them. I also noticed that Fargo South's lines were different in the third period; if anyone has any reasoning for that I would be very interested to find out.
I'll try and answer your question to why South switched up the lines. If Coach Wilsons statement in the Fargo Forum and the way South played last night (selfish) had anything to do with it, I'd say it was because they were not moving the puck. It looked like South held on to the puck to long and by the time they decided to shoot they were in so tight on the defender that the shot would either miss the net completely or the Red River defenseman would deflect the puck into the corner. Even when the obvious play was to make a pass, South did not execute. Agreed, for the most part Red Rivers defenseman in general were far more composed with the puck in the defensive zone and broke the puck out much smoother. Red Rivers intensity in the offensive zone could be some of the reason for that urgency by South, however. Maybe too much credit is being given to South and especially there first line. I for one was an advocate that they maybe had the best line in the state. After watching them play sluggish last night, I'm starting to second guess myself. McDougall looked uninterested in playing physical at times, and Ian Powers looked like he was skating with ankle weights. Again, that all could be a product of playing against guys that kept there feet moving for 17 minutes a period. Right now, even though South may not have played there top game, I'm going to have to say that if Grand Forks Red River can continue play at the level they did last night, they are going to be very difficult to beat come state tournement time.
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Which one does not play?
Will Aide
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Great game from the Coliseum tonight, both teams played pretty well but you all can see that RR is the better team. All three goals for RR were scored by sophomores. RR also had the better goaltender in Arnason. I have seen Deichert play in 5 games now and he hasn't been as impressive as people have talked him up to be. RR clearly had a lot of better scoring chances aswell. Good win for GFRR as they improve to 11-0 and FS drops to 8-4.
To me it did not look like either team brought their "A" game tonight. The game was intense down to the final few seconds, with South pulling its goalie. At times the game looked choppy, with players throwing the puck blindly and dumping the puck or icing the puck for no apparent reason. However, there were times when I was very impressed. I liked Russel Crary. He worked very hard, and looked like he was a pretty solid skater, with good knee bend. Eric Meland made some nice passes but other than that he did not really stand out to me. Ladouceaur (spelling?) and Galbreath both played solid games at the point and were very beneficial to the Red River breakout. I love the way they wait patiently for an opening rather than throwing the puck up the wings a$$. Danny Wurden had another solid perfomance, it looked like he was on the ice every other shift. South frequently wanted to take the big slap shot and it rarely worked in their favor. I think the big difference tonight was desire. Red River wanted it more than South and it showed.
2006-2007 ND High School Hockey
in Non-collegiate sports
Posted
I'd play #11 almost the whole game too if he was on my team. Providing he moved the puck and wasn't taking dumb penalties. As a matter of fact, I bet Wurden is the only player on the ice he can trust every minute of every game. I have heard from numerous sources that many players on Souths team are loose cannons. Although that's probably not new information to anyone on this message board.