dlsiouxfan
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Posts posted by dlsiouxfan
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Well, the only logical conclusion one could come to is that at the very least, USF is better than USD.
If USD or any of the other SD schools feel they need a chance to prove otherwise, schedule them.
USD would handle USF for by four plus scores. For all their faults USD takes care of their cupcakes. We used to but this past Saturday we choked on ours.
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They are both good Coaches and personal friends, I will not choose between the two of them on a message board, besides It's not my place, Coach Mussman gets that fun job. The team on Saturday for some reason lacked fire and heart on both sides of the footbal and special teams, hopefully is was just a bad day at work.
Both the 4-3 and 3-4 take talented kids to run, some on here have said it's harder to find the Athletic DL or DE that is why the 3-4 is better, It was also hard to find guys like Challahan, Blue, Dixon, Brennan, Enger, Halvorson, but this same group of Coaches found them and we won, my bet is we will again....
With the exception of Enger not a single one of those players was recruited by anyone on our current coaching staff. For the most part we haven't recruited athletes like that on Defense since Schweigert left.
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Which is why playing this game was so foolish in the first place. I knew USF would be good, as did you and many other posters on this board.
But the problem is that most people want to compartmentalize every team based on the division they play in and since USF was NAIA that equates to Mayville State or Valley City State which in turn equates to no good. In actuality, USF transcends its level of play and would at minimum be a D-II playoff team but no one will look past the NAIA label. It was a no win situation.
There are people calling this the worst loss in UND history... just based upon the actual talent on the field, I don't even think it's the worst loss in the last 5 years. The 2005 loss to a far inferior UNO team when UND blew a 19 point lead and a national championship season was much worse if you ask me.
Every kid on USF's sideline would have jumped at the chance to play for the Sioux. Their roster is made up of guys who weren't good enought to get shots at the four Division I universities in the Dakota's. That's what makes this loss so damn bad. We lost to a team of players who weren't even good enough to be on our roster. That's far worse than losing to UNO when we were Division II or to another FCS team now that we are Division I. We now have to go into recruits homes this offseason knowing full well that whoever we recruit against is reminding the players that we're a program that doesn't have the talent level to beat an NAIA program. Any future player we target will remember this and somehow you don't think that will hurt us? The performance this Saturday basically destroyed any eminence the program has established over the last 15 years and set us back immensely.
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Lots of internet message board tough guys on here, you guys know where the Football offices are located.....?
Their are expectations that come with every position. The last four years none of those expectations have been met. If a player is underperforming he should be replaced and the same thing should be done if a coach is underperforming. If we want to get where we want to be we can't tolerate underperformance and losing in this program.
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While it's all water under the bridge now, and I certainly don't begrudge Lennon for taking a big raise, the timing of the whole thing in retrospect is unfortunate. Buning was already gone when Lennon left, and Kupchella's impending retirement was roughly a month away. Looking back in time, I can only wonder what might have been had Lennon demanded a big raise (hey, it worked for Chapman
) , and coaxed Bubba back for the dI move. Lennon as head coach...Bubba running the defense...Mussman running the offense..sign some juco's to fill in the holes from all the early departures, and oh, what may have been...UND had their shot to keep Lennon and opted not to do it since apparently it's blasphemy at this institution if anyone ever makes more than the hockey coach. This attitude will pretty much ensure a lack of success for both the men's basketball teams and the football team until it's changes. Whatever coaches are good will leave for higher paying jobs and the ones who aren't any good will be left behind.
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UND should fire both Mannaussau and Kelling and then bring in a new defensive coordinator who can run the system of his choosing whether it is a 3-4 or a 4-3. The personnell we have currently is a non-factor as I expect true freshmen and redshirt freshmen playing at most positions next year since the talent level of a lot of our upper classmen isn't even close to the Division I level.
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Babich recruited following players in one class after going 2-8
Craig Dahl S 6' 3 206 Madison Lake, MN
Justin Frick DE 6' 4 255 Yankton, SD
John Majeski S 6' 0 180 Hastings, MN
Joe Mays LB 6' 0 230 Chicago, IL
Nate Safe OT 6' 4 280 Cannon Falls, MN
Steve Walker QB 6' 1 195 Lockport, IL
Mike Dragosavich WR 6' 6 200 Oak Lawn, IL
Cinque Chapman-Pratt RB 5' 1 188 Chicago, IL
maybe Bohl is tanking this season and hoping for a higher draft pick
I'm proposing a truce on all Sioux-Bison smack talk for the remainder of the season. At this point it's a lot like arguing with your buddy about who brought home the prettier fat chick the night before. No matter who wins in a way you both lost big time.
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While we're throwing around old Lennon quotes to try to rationalize getting schooled by an NAIA team, I recall that the other reason he cited for wanting to move the team to D-I was that he had started losing every head-to-head recruiting battle with the regional I-AA teams. The weaknesses today were the same we've seen all year; the disappointing aspect was the apparent lack of intensity, relative to some previous games. No fan left that game feeling that UND played their hearts out but that USF was just a superior team (e.g. at Texas Tech); instead we all feel like USF was probably good but it's tough to say how good because UND's performance was so lackluster.
Edit -- sorry my post is after dlsiouxfan's reply, I was trying to make a change to it, but wasn't quick enough
No problem... I kind of felt like I was losing it for a second there.
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While we're throwing around old Lennon quotes to try to rationalize getting schooled by an NAIA team, I recall that the other reason he cited for wanting to move the team to D-I was that he had started losing every head-to-head recruiting battle with the regional I-AA teams. The weaknesses today were the same we've seen all year; the disappointing aspect was the apparent lack of intensity, relative to some previous games. No fan left that game feeling that UND played their hearts out but that USF was just a superior team (e.g. at Texas Tech); instead we all feel like USF was probably good but it's tough to say how good because UND's performance was so lackluster.
Jim, we're in agreement. The lack of talent on this squad is a direct result of not moving the program to Division I sooner. Kupchella and Thomas never pushed for the Division I move because the REA didn't want it. This damaged the football program more than any other program on campus and now we're seeing the results. Lennon left because he fought harder than anyone to keep this program competive and all he ever got was a cold shoulder from the administration. This all seems to be a moot point now with Faison and Kelly in charge but it should serve as a stark reminder to the fans of UND's other sports of what can happen when the hockey only crowd get's everything they want for an extended period of time.
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Just to clarify the co-defensive coordinator idea was Dale Lennon's...
Roger never srewed the program, his lack of success for the program was directly tied to the brand new REA...short memories Roger was AD in 2000 National Champ team...
Roger never intentionally screwed the program but he let REA run the athletic department when he was in charge and nobody over at REA was a friend of the football program. Thomas could have had some balls and stood up to them but he never did and so it continued. Tough place to be as it probably would have cost him his job if he had stood up to them on a few things but sometimes the right thing to do and what's in someones own self interest are two different things.
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A DIII loss didn't destroy SDSU's recruiting.
A lot of factors go into recruiting. If a recruit in Wisconsin is choosing between UND, NDSU, SDSU, and USD, would UND losing to USF be a major factor in the decision? Doubtful.
Not entirely but if you start losing regulary that's a difficult trend to break out of. That's where we're heading as I really don't see another winnable game on our schedule this season if we're going to play like we did today. Losing will continue unless a message is sent that it will not be tolerated.
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This is a point that is not talked about enough. Lennon claims it isn't true, but I think he got sick and tired of 5,000 people for home playoff games. I think he got sick and tired of the total lack of marketing for this program. Until this year, there was no marketing of the football team until the week of the first game (Oh, by the way, our first football game is this weekend. Tickets are available! Come on out unless you have better things to do!). I think Lennon was fed up with the "hunting season" excuse used to explain away bad attendance at home games. I also think Lennon was fed up with the "Co-Acting Athletic Directors" three-ring circus that we had in the Athletic Department before Faison was hired. I think this is why Lennon was going to "Stand Pat" in recruiting the same traditional areas after we moved up because he knew the old Athletic Department regime wouldn't make the financial commitment that would be needed to recruit more nationally. In sharp contrast, Southern Illinois offered him a 100% increase in his salary and promises of a 15,000 seat stadium and all the facilities to go with it. No wonder he left.
Having said all that, I think we have solid leadership (President Kelley and Faison) in place now and I think they will turn things around. But the program is still in need of some serious overhaul. This Co-Defensive Coordinator experiment has failed and needs to be changed NOW (I don't think we should wait until the season is over). And I haven't been thrilled with the play calling on offense, either.
Bottom line, I don't care HOW good USF is, losing to an NAIA team is just inexcusable. Are you listening and watching, Mr. Faison?
If you ever talk to Lennon in private he'll tell you that this is pretty much true. He had to fight the AD tooth and nail for every dollar that was spent on UND football during his tenure here. It's a shame that it never saw the light of day how much guys like Buning, Thomas, and Kupchella put the screws to the football program when they were in charge.
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In a strange wasy, wasn't really all that shocked by this result. There were only two positives from this loss:
It serves as a notice to Sioux fans of how far Sioux football has to climb to be a factor for FCS playoffs.
It happened during the transition. SDSU lost to DIII UW-LaCrosse during their transition and, with the same coaching staff, moved into the MVFC with a more than respectable team.
USF was better coached, more disciplined, their defense tackled and seemed quicker, the offensive line could pass and run block, the QB was multi-faceted etc. etc. DeBoer, like USF's Leavitt showed at Morningside, might just have the talent to become a BCS coach.
Again, two years ago when Lennon left, he knew there was wasn't sufficient talent left after Dressler & Co. The cupboard's only being restocked with the last couple of classes.
It's painful, but hopefully the wait will be worth it.
2012
That's all well and good but if we don't win some games between now and then we'll be screwed in 2012 as well. If you don't win then you can't recruit. We're heading a bad direction right now unless something changes.
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I'm a Dale Lennon fan, also, and you essentially said what I was thinking, that Coach Mussman has only had one recruiting class. Give the man a chance; this year's team is not his team and, really, next year's won't be, either. Today's debacle notwithstanding, he has done a decent job with the talent that he inherited; let's see if we don't start to see real improvement by the 2011 season, just in time for being playoff eligible in 2012.
The thing is he was promoted to head coach when Lennon left. Lennon cherry picked the best of the coaching staff and left Mussman with the leftovers. That should have been a strong hint to Mussman that other changes needed to be made. Those changes weren't made and now here we are.
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There's plenty of blame to go around for the state of the program. For example, although there's probably not a bigger Dale Lennon fan than me, let's remember he was in charge for the recruiting classes of 2005, 2006 and 2007 (all sub-par), and he made the decision on the replacement(s) for Tim Tibesar. The defense has gotten progressively worse every year since about 2005. The numbers don't lie.
There is plenty of blame to go around. We can't forget though about an administration (Kupchella, Buning, Brekke, Thomas) that nickel and dimed the program to the point that Lennon couldn't recruit and more or less couldn't stand to be around anymore. It's been a long slow descent to this point and it's truly sad to watch.
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I have been waiting to hear someone say this and it's simply not true. Most of the established FCS programs would not lose to this team. I don't think even UC-Davis or Cal-Poly would lose to this team. Our DII powerhouse teams would not lose to this team. They would beat the Bison this year (soon to be 1-6) and all of the FCS non-scholarship teams, but there is a big difference between 63 scholarships and 24. This loss sets the program back three huge steps and it could take all of this season and next to get those steps back. Absolutely the worst loss in program history. I think practice next week should start with the simple sentence "Gentlemen, this is a football."
This is the lowest point in Sioux football history that I can remember. I wasn't old enough to remember most of the 1980's but I can't imagine it was worse than this. This Sioux Falls team would have lost by 50 plus to most of our Division II teams and wouldn't have a prayer against anyone else in our conference. Some of the players on this squad (especially some of the seniors) should never see another down of football with a Sioux jersey on. If you don't even bother to show up for a game like this and disgrace the program then you should find something else to do with your time.
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Mussman's interview just now almost made me puke. Enough excuses. Every week it's another piss poor excuse.
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If the hockey team sweeps there's gonna be fights at the Univ Ave and Dyke Ave parties like you wouldn't believe, at least if it's like the old days.
Probably not.... this Sioux football team doesn't have the heart to fight anyone.
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dont thinkhes to problem
mannasea and kellig are in my opinion
They've been a big part of the problem for the last four years. If Mussman doesn't have the guts to fire them then he's part of the problem too and should go as well. The players on this squad need to take a long hard look in the mirror after this one. They didn't show up for this game and were an absolute disgrace to the jersey today.
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I'm absolutely embarrassed to be a fan of this team right now. I'm in astonishment at how far this program has fallen. Most of the players on the field today wouldn't have been ball boys on some of our Division II teams. At this point I think we may need to clean house and start over because we are definitely not on the right track. I Mussman, Kelling, Mannaussau all should be gone after this season and I sincerely hope that the new coach cleans out the locker room. We need to get some talent on this roster and right now it's pretty much nonexistent. Those running things at this university need to take a long hard look at what happened to this program. We've let what was once a great program absolutely rot.
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Can he still smack Chapman as long as he leave Lakesbison out of it? This is just too good to not allow...
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Consider yourself very lucky that you don't know much about him/her. He posts on numerous sports and newspaper sites. He has some "unique" ideas and tries to pound them down everyone's throats. You don't have to ask him what his opinion is twice! And if you are REALLY looking for some fun, ask him how he feels about UND!
In an essence, he is the poster boy for NDSU's new admission standards.
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They are in rough shape. That ship is sinking fast.
Watched the game on television. Not only is NDSU a bad team but they are a chippy, dirty bad team as well. Paschall should sit a game for starting that melee on the sidelines by throwing a punch, but without him the Bison wouldn't stand a chance against anyone. As for the fans throwing stuff on the field I'd have to say that seems almost par for the course for some of their fans who lurk here and on other sites all over the internet.
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NDSU will be back, but not sure they will be able to do it with Bohl. Over the past few years, NDSU has had some great assistants and it's becoming more and more apparent that they had much to do with NDSU's great transition. Character questions have seemingly always surrounded Bohl, and it seems those issues have seeped into the program as evidences by all the off-field issues. Off field issues almost always have on-field conterparts that affect desire and teamwork.
Bohl is completely overmatched as a head coach and I fully agree that the Bison will never again experience any kind of success with him at the helm. With that being said I sincerely hope that Gene Taylor continues to keep Craig Bohl as their head coach
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BTHC - Alvarez and OSU want to make it happen?
in Men's Hockey
Posted
As an outsider to the hockey forum I think this type of cooperation would be what's best for both sports and is something that should be strongly considered to keep both sports viable. The BTHC is almost a sure thing as Wisconsin, Ohio State, and Michigan will bully Minnesota into going along with it in only a matter of time. People may think otherwise but UND hockey would suffer with a schedule filled with Division II and Division III schools. If you don't think so just ask the fans of the other sports on campus.