FargoBison

bincity, I think your right in saying that a successful mid-major basketball program at NDSU probably won't draw that many fans away from UND hockey but I do think UND hockey would take hit in the media. Just imagine for a second if NDSU made a run in the big dance like Bradley or Wichita State has made this year and just imagine all of the media attention NDSU would be getting both nationally and regionally. You are right in saying NDSU will never be a Gonzaga but I don't see why NDSU couldn't be a Creighton or Northen Iowa. What Miles has done so far is amazing and I really can't wait to see what happens when he is given a better facitlity and more funding.

UND hockey has always had the niche in the local sports market as being the only DI team and I think it would be interesting to see what would happen if NDSU was to become a mid-major basketball power and if it would impact UND hockey in anyway. Basketball is quite popular in this area and I think it would draw alot of media exposure and fans.

Well, Dave I have lived in Fargo my entire life and I graduated from South High just a few years ago and I never once dreamed of playing hockey for Fargo South High but I did dream of playing basketball and football. Fargo South is not a hockey school but hockey is popular. I went there and I still attend a few games every now and I have never seen a packed colusium but I have seen a packed Fargo Civic to watch Norh and South play in hoops. I also wouldn't call South a basketball school either but I think basketball popularity is bigger then hockey, the gap is closing though. Dave you may claim to know first hand but I actually do and unlike you I have no bias on this topic.

Fargo is not a hockey town all but one of the high schools favors basketball over hockey. North is a basketball school so are Shanely and West Fargo. Oak Grove has no hockey and I doubt it will ever have a team. That leaves just South and hockey is popular there but it is at the very most level with basketball. The only schools that is purely a hockey school is Moorhead.

I have watched both Digger and Mays play and I have seen both dominate games. Digger has a legit NFL shot and Joe will have a legit shot in a few years as well. I don't know if I could call one better then the other or how anyone possibly could.

I don't see how Ralph loses all credibility, he is probably one the biggest supporters of IAA in the nation and is pretty unbiased. If you didn't know Ralph runs Anygivensaturday.com(IAA messageboard) and IAA.org.

I will admit that NDSU has some blame in causing the "unhealthy relationship" but UND has just as much blame. Do you remember UND Fargo, UND trying taking over NDSU Pharmacy Project, fight over whether NDSU should add more grad programs, UND Admins making NDSU's move to DI as hard as they could, and even back in the day UND fought NDSU over whether NDSU had the right to call themselves NDSU and not NDAC. As for the flagship sport at NDSU it is still football and even though basketball is doing good NDSU hoops still has away to go until reaches football status among the Bison fathful. I also put NDSU football and UND hockey as being the flagships sports of ND both have similar status and popularity.

Dave do you really believe in what you are posting? I mean come on you may hate basketball but to say the sport has no following around here is just absurd. I suppose when you said "most of us" you were refering to Sioux fans and not the rest of people in this great state, if that is what you meant then your post makes alot more sense.

I don't think UW overlooked NDSU at all, just look at some of these quotes. from the Forum- "Krabbenhoft, Taylor, Tucker and head coach Bo Ryan all said the Badgers didn

I don't know. What rating did the DII title game get this year?

If you had the direct tv sports pack you got 18 of those networks listed above, I'm not sure about cableone though because I have direct tv. I have only never heard of three of those networks listed above but the person who put this list togather said this, "GAMES LISTED ARE THOSE AVAILABLE NATIONALLY OR REGIONALLY VIA CABLE AND / OR SATELLITE PROVIDERS.. WE HAVE ONLY LISTED REGIONALLY BROADCAST GAMES THAT ARE EITHER AVAILABLE NATIONALLY VIA SATELLTE OR HAVE A BROAD CABLE AVAILABILITY OUTSIDE OF JUST ONE STATE OR LOCAL AREA." Real DI team? What in the heck does that mean. NDSU is a real DI team, UNI is a real DI team, all of IAA contains real DI teams. I can't say the same about hockey which contains a division of half DI teams and half non-DI. And those "real DI's" you talk about for some of them hockey is consider a minor sport and is in the shadow of both basketball and football. I'm not going to say hockey isn't DI even though half of the division is not D1 and I don't understand how IAA isn't DI because all of the teams are DI.

The following is a compilation of games available throughout MOST of the country via either Satellite or Cable.. This schedule does not include every local or regional broadcast that is limited to a state or local affiliate broadcast.. 2005 I-AA FOOTBALL TV SCHEDULE WEEK 1 THURSDAY, SEPT 1st FURMAN at JACKSONVILLE STATE CSTV 8:00 PM NORTHWESTERN STATE at LOUISIANA - MONROE COX 8:00 PM SATURDAY, SEPT 3rd HAMPTON vs. JACKSON STATE BET (D) 7:30 PM GEORGIA SOUTHERN at NORTHEASTERN CSS / CN8 (D) 3:30 PM ALABAMA STATE at SOUTH CAROLINA STATE ESPN 2 3:30 PM COLORADO SCHOOL OF MINES at NORTHERN COLORADO ALT 5:00 PM SACRAMENTO STATE at CALIFORNIA COM-W 5:00 PM DELAWARE STATE at FLORIDA A&M ESPN U 7:00 PM ALABAMA A&M at TENNESSEE STATE CSS 7:00 PM WEEK 2 NORTHERN COLORADO at WESTERN ILLINOIS CSTV 8:00 PM ALCORN STATE at SOUTHEASTERN LOUISIANA ESPN U 7:30 PM MASSACHUSETTS at COLGATE CN8 12:00 PM THE CITADEL at FLORIDA STATE ESPN U 6:45 PM TENNESSEE STATE vs. JACKSON STATE BET 7:00 PM LEHIGH at DELAWARE CN8 7:00 PM NORTHERN ARIZONA at ARIZONA FOXAZ / FCS - A 10:00 PM WEBER STATE at FRESNO STATE ESPN U 10:00 PM WEEK 3 HAMPTON at NORTH CAROLINA A&T ESPN U 7:30 PM BUTLER at ROBERT MORRIS FOXP / FCS - A 12:00 PM PRINCETON at LAFAYETTE CSTV 1:30 PM MORGAN STATE vs. SAVANNAH STATE BET (D) 7:00 PM NORTHERN IOWA at IOWA COX / ALT / ESPN G 3:30 PM TENNESSEE TECH at NORTHERN ILLINOIS COM - C / CSS 4:00 PM SOUTHEASTERN LOUISIANA at NORTHERN COLORADO FOXRM / FCS - C 4:00 PM WILLIAM & MARY at RHODE ISLAND CSTV 4:30 PM NORTHEASTERN at VILLANOVA CN8 7:00 PM GEORGIA SOUTHERN at WOFFORD CSS 7:00 PM SACRAMENTO STATE at PORTLAND STATE COM-W 9:00 PM WEEK 4 ALBANY at CENTRAL CONNECTICUT STATE FOXNY 1:00 PM BROWN at HARVARD CN8 1:00 PM TENNESSEE STATE vs. FLORIDA A&M TNS 4:00 PM NORFOLK STATE at HAMPTON BET (D) 9:00 PM MISSOURI STATE at SAM HOUSTON STATE FOXSW / FOXMW / FCS -C 7:00 PM CHATTANOOGA at GEORGIA SOUTHERN CSS 7:00 PM PENN at VILLANOVA CN8 7:00 PM WEEK 5 SOUTHEAST MISSOURI STATE at SAMFORD ESPN U 7:30 PM VMI at LIBERTY COM- MA 12:00 PM VILLANOVA at NEW HAMPSHIRE CN8 12:30 PM LEHIGH at HARVARD CSTV 12:30 PM ST. FRANCIS at ROBERT MORRIS FOXP / FCS -A 1:00 PM JAMES MADISON at HOFSTRA MSG 3:30 PM IDAHO STATE at MONTANA STATE ALT 3:30 PM TENNESSEE STATE vs. NORTH CAROLINA A&T BET (D) 7:00 PM CAL - POLY at NORTHERN COLORADO FOXRM / FCS - C 4:00 PM NORTHERN ARIZONA at SACRAMENTO STATE COM-W 9:00 PM WEEK 6 SOUTH CAROLINA STATE at NORFOLK STATE ESPN U 7:30 PM HOFSTRA at DELAWARE FSNY / CSTV (D) 12:00 PM WESTERN CAROLINA at GEORGIA SOUTHERN CSS 12:00 PM MONTANA STATE at WEBER STATE ALT 3:30 PM APPALACHIAN STATE at FURMAN CSS 3:30 PM BUCKNELL at PENN CN8 3:30 PM ALABAMA STATE at JACKSON STATE ESPN U 6:45 PM WEEK 7 JAMES MADISON AT MASSACHUSETTS CN8 12:00 PM YALE at LEHIGH FOXP 1:00 PM RICHMOND at DELAWARE CN8 3:00 PM GEORGIA SOUTHERN at APPALACHIAN STATE FOXS 3:30 PM GARDNER - WEBB at COASTAL CAROLINA CSS / FCS - A 3:30 PM ILLINOIS STATE at SOUTHERN ILLINOIS COM-C / FCS - C / FOXMW(D) 7:00 PM HAMPTON at NORFOLK STATE ESPN U 7:00 PM GRAMBLING at ARKANSAS - PINE BLUFF CSTWEEK 8 Week 8 STEPHEN F. AUSTIN at SAM HOUSTON STATE FOXSW 8:00 PM NORTHEASTERN at NEW HAMPSHIRE CN8 12:00 PM GARDNER-WEBB at VMI COM-MA / FCS-A 12:00 PM JAMES MADISON at DELAWARE CSTV 12:00 PM COLUMBIA at DARTMOUTH YES 12:00 PM APPALACHIAN STATE at WOFFORD CSS 12:00 PM SOUTHERN ILLINOIS at ILLINOIS STATE FOXMW / FCS-C 3:00 PM YALE at PENN CN8 3:30 PM THE CITADEL at GEORGIA SOUTHERN CSS 3:30 PM McNEESE STATE at SOUTHEASTERN LOUISIANA COX 7:00 PM NORTHERN ARIZONA at PORTLAND STATE ESPN U 10:30 PM WEEK 9 CORNELL at PRINCETON YES 12:00 PM NEW HAMPSHIRE at MASSACHUSETTS CN8 (NE) 12:00 PM DELAWARE at MAINE CN8 (M-A) 12:00 PM LEHIGH at COLGATE FOXP 1:00 PM ALABAMA STATE at ALABAMA A&M ESPN U 3:30 PM CHATTANOOGA at APPALACHIAN STATE CSS 3:30 PM YOUNGSTOWN STATE at NORTHERN IOWA FOXMW / FCS - C 4:00 PM BETHUNE - COOKMAN at NORTH CAROLINA A&T ESPN U 7:00 PM WEEK 10 SOUTHERN at TEXAS SOUTHERN ESPN U 7:30 PM BROWN at YALE YES 12:00 PM MASSACHUSETTS AT DELAWARE CN8 1:00 PM FURMAN at GEORGIA SOUTHERN FOXS 4:00 PM NORTHERN IOWA at WESTERN KENTUCKY FOXMW / FCS-C (D) 5:00 PM SOUTHEASTERN LOUISIANA at SAM HOUSTON STATE CSTV 5:00 PM SOUTH CAROLINA STATE at HOWARD ESPN U 7:00 PM EASTERN ILLINOIS at TENNESSEE STATE CSS 7:00 PM WEEK 11 MORGAN STATE at SOUTH CAROLINA STATE ESPN U 7:30 PM PENN at HARVARD YES 12:00 PM RICHMOND at TOWSON COM-MA 12:00 PM WOFFORD at FURMAN CSTV 12:30 PM MASSACHUSETTS at ARMY ESPN NET? 1:00 PM MISSOURI STATE at WESTERN ILLINOIS FOXMW / COM - C / FCS -C 2:00 PM TEXAS STATE at STEPHEN F. AUSTIN FOXSW 2:00 PM SAM HOUSTON STATE at NORTHERN COLORADO ALT 2:00 PM WESTERN CAROLINA at APPALACHIAN STATE CSS 3:30 PM NORTHWESTERN STATE at McNEESE STATE COX 8:00 PM WEEK 12 STEPHEN F. AUSTIN at NORTHWESTERN STATE ESPN U 7:30 PM ARKANSAS PINE-BLUFF at TEXAS SOUTHERN ESPN U 8:00 PM IVY LEAGUE GAME YES 12:00 PM LAFAYETTE at LEHIGH FOXP / FCS-A 12:30 PM COASTAL CAROLINA at CHARLESTON SOUTHERN FCS-A 12:30 PM DELAWARE at VILLANOVA CN8 1:00 PM MONTANA at MONTANA STATE ALT 2:00 PM FURMAN at CHATTANOOGA CSS 3:30 PM ALCORN STATE at JACKSON STATE CSTV 5:00 PM ALABAMA A&M at PRAIRIE VIEW A&M ESPN U 7:00 PM BETHUNE - COOKMAN at FLORIDA A&M ESPN U TBD WEEK 13 TUSKEGEE at ALABAMA STATE ESPN U 2:00 PM GRAMBLING vs. SOUTHERN NBC 1:00 PM NETWORKS / STATIONS ALT - ALTITUDE FOXP - FOX SPORTS PITTSBURGH FOXMW - FOX SPORTS MIDWEST FOXS - FOX SPORTS SOUTH FOXSW - FOX SPORTS SOUTHWEST FOXRM - FOX SPORTS ROCKY MOUNTAIN FOXNY - FOX SPORTS NEW YORK FOXAZ - FOX SPORTS ARIZONA CSS - CHARTER SPORTS SOUTHEAST COX - COX SPORTS COM-C - COMCAST SPORTS CHICAGO COM-W - COMCAST SPORTS WEST COM-MA - COMCAST SPORTS MID-ATLANTIC ESPN U - ESPN UNIVERSITY ESPN C - ESPN CLASSIC ESPN G - ESPN GAMEPLAN CSTV - COLLEGE SPORTS TV FCS-C - FOX COLLEGE SPORTS CENTRAL FCS-A - FOX COLLEGE SPORTS ATLANTIC CN8 YES - YANKEE ENTERTAINMENT SPORTS TNS - TURNER SOUTH BET - BLACK ENTERTAINMENT TV MSG - MADISON SQUARE GARDEN ALL TIMES ARE EASTERN STANDARD TIME AND TIME SHOWN MAY REFLECT AIR TIME AND NOT NECESSARILY THE GAME TIME AS SOME GAMES JOINED IN PROGRESS OR SAME DAY TAPE DELAYED. GAMES LISTED ARE THOSE AVAILABLE NATIONALLY OR REGIONALLY VIA CABLE AND / OR SATELLITE PROVIDERS.. WE HAVE ONLY LISTED REGIONALLY BROADCAST GAMES THAT ARE EITHER AVAILABLE NATIONALLY VIA SATELLTE OR HAVE A BROAD CABLE AVAILABILITY OUTSIDE OF JUST ONE STATE OR LOCAL AREA. V 8:30 PM Ok Now tell me that I am a wacko and way off base I also didn't mention the five IAA playoff games on ESPN2, and the others on ESPNU and ESPN Gamplan

I can agree with that and I was never trying to say otherwise. I don't understand why it is such a big deal to some becuase if UND does go DI they will be very competitive in two sports that get decent media coverage. This on the other hand I can't agree with because it is simply not true. IAA has way more state flagships schools were there football team is really the only game in town, that means more coverage. IAA also has schools that are very well known across the country and also have great football traditions, DII does not. Comparing DIAA to DII in terms of media coverage and popularity is crazy because the two are miles apart. Like I said before IAA had 126 games on tv this year and had 6 games televised on networks that almost everybody in the country gets. DII had one game on such a network and I doubt if there were even 26 DII games on tv. Please tell me how IAA doesn't capture more interest then DII. IAA schools also play with IA schools all the time and that gives IAA great exposure. DII teams for the most part only play other DII's and they also play only a regionalized schedule. Besides for a few teams DII is closer to D3 then it is to IAA.

Dave, again don't compare IAA football and D2 in this discussion becuase the two don't belong in the same sentence. I am pretty sure D2 didn't have anywhere near 126 games on tv this year and also only one DII game is on ESPN2. The two are miles apart in terms of media coverage. Dave I still see nothing that is going to change my mind. IAA football=Hockey.

Dave please tell me if no one cares about IAA football why were there 126 IAA games on TV this year, yes Dave 126. I have no idea how many hockey games were/are on tv this season but I am sure the numbers will be close. Montana, Deleware, Georgia Southern, the Ivies, and SWAC schools all have pretty good national recognition. Southern and Grambling State play a game on NBC every year(in front of a sold out SuperDome). ESPN college gameday was even live at the site of the game. And you know few may know that Denver won the hockey title last year, Denver is about as obscure a school as App St is. I didn't even know about Denver U until NDSU played them last year in hoops. And I don't know why you mention IAA and D2 in the same sentence because they are ways apart when it comes to media recognition and overall popularity. Also I never said IAA football was big time, just that it is just as big as DI hockey is.

Well your a UND zealot and I don't think you have any objectivity to this topic as well. As for ESPN playoff games IAA football 5, NCAA hockey 3. And I think all but one or two of the IAA playoff games not on ESPN2 were on ESPNU. Also from what I have seen there are as many IAA football games on FSN, CSTV, and Comcast as there are NCAA hockey games. And really if nobody cares about IAA football why does NBC even bother showing the Bayou Classic every year? What makes hockey mid-level and IAA not? Only a handful of IA schools play it and the sport is really only popular in select parts of the country, football is popular everywhere. IAA football is made up entirely of DI teams while hockey is what half DI half non DI. I think it is hard to call NCAA hockey mid level and IAA football not when hockey needs lower level schools to survive. I know it is hard for you to admit but IAA football=NCAA hockey.

Do you really want to get into this debate? If NCAA hockey is so much more popular why are more IAA football playoff games on ESPN? Why aren't there any NCAA hockey games on national network tv? Give me a valid reason why what I said was so funny to you?

Please, IAA football=NCAA hockey in terms of media coverage and popularity. Fight it all you want but it is true.

First of all I said give the 1st year IAA NDSU and UNC teams this past years NDSU schedule and both would not have gotten their top 25 records they recieved in their first year. UNC was barely a IAA team since they only had maybe 4 more scholarships then they did in their last year of D2. Also according to the Sioux fans here the lack of scholarships doesn't matter UND would be top 25 their first year regardless. And what I'm trying to say is play a real IAA schedule like NDSU had this year or UNC had last year and you won't be top 25 you might not even be .500. If UND(DII elite) can't take on NDSU's schedule and finish better then top 30 it kind of proves that the gap is bigger then a small one. The gap may not be huge for UND(and a select other few D2's) but it is not small by any means.

Yes, NDSU did finish in the top 25 in their first year of IAA play but some of that had to do with a favorable schedule. NDSU played three cupcakes(Valpo, Montana Tech, Carson Newman) and if you give NDSU a schedule like they had this year I doubt they would be top 25. And also UNC's first year schedule was joke they did beat a decent Montana St team but 7 out of their 9 wins were against lower division teams or weak IAA schools. You give UNC the same type of schedule NDSU had this year and they wouldn't be top 25 as well. And I think if you give UND NDSU's schedule you will see a 6-5 season at best and no top 25 finish. Every team the Bison played besides Arkansas Monticello could beat UND and most would probably be favored over UND. I find it odd that all of Sioux fans think they can waltz right into IAA and be a top 25 team when currenlty your team didn't even beat a fully funded DII team all year long. How do expect to compete when your faced with a schedule with about 5 or more fully funded IAA schools in your first year right out of DII?

And you basing these comparision off of what? The two schools played very different schedule and no common opponets. I think NDSU has the better team and is also better on both sides of the ball but special team are about even. I know UND fans will have a tough time saying NDSU has a better defense but SU's defense was 7th in total defense and 2nd in scoring defense. And NDSU shut down some very good teams and really only had one bad game.

UNC's schedule in their first year was very weak and they definately didn't deserve to be ranked and also they were pretty good over their last year of DII. I think UNC lost to GVSU in the semifinals in their last year of DII play. SDSU has never been ranked and they have only beaten one fully funded IAA team. I think the highest they have gotten is 35th. It is hard to say exactly how well UND would do in IAA because UND refuses to play IAA teams and using NDSU as a model of comparision isn't exactly the best model to use. Playing a schedule filled with IAA teams is a big step up from playing a schedule full of DII's.

SDSU is much improved over their old DII days and they started the season off playing well but eventually not being fully funded took it's toll on their team and they weren't as good at the end of the year. I think IowaBison is right in saying give UND NDSU's schedule and the result will probably be a 6-5 season. I don't think UND or any DII team could handle that type of schedule because DII teams rarely play fully funded teams week in and week out. UND only played two and ended up losing to both of them. If you can't beat fully funded DII teams why do you think you guys can march right into IAA beat up on fully funded IAA schools? I know many here are a bit upset with Bison fans putting down DII but the division is really down and most of it is a result of the lack of fully funded teams and these teams don't do anything to better themselves they would rather wait and have the scholarship limit lowered. Besides maybe a handful of DII teams the gap between the two division is huge.

I don't have any numbers but that is definately the case. South is a football school and a lot of the best athletes end up playing football or basketball. GF is hockey central so I assume most of the athletes play hockey. So not only are more kids going out for hockey but most of the best athletes are probably playing hockey as well. I think that pretty much neutralizes the advantage that is South having a bigger base to draw players from. As for who is the best GF or Fargo who really cares all three high schools have had great teams in the past few years and all three have been pretty equal. Really I don't think anyone school is going to dominate the next decade, I think they will all stay pretty equal.