Gothmog

Again, how about a little evidence? Hallstrom states that it's going to happen? Really, when did he say that? Perhaps, I missed something. I read his comments, at least those of which I am aware, as a put-down of the delusional attitude at UND. Akin to "They either know something or they're ON something", to borrow a phrase from Dan Cole. My question is - if you really think UND is a shoe-in for the BSC, why do feel the compulsion to ram it down people's throats? Confident people rarely act that way.

Why? Because star2city says so! Never mind the complete lack of evidence.

Obviously, I was explaining why it would be impossible for me to provide the link you asked for. Sorry if you misunderstood. On second thought, if you're referring to point 3, it's a statement of fact not an opinion. I'm inviting you to disprove it by providing a link.

Wow! Star2City must have a crystal ball. How else would he have figured out the the BSC would prefer schools in large media markets within its existing footprint. I never said that the FSSN would not help UND at all, only that any benefit that UND gets out of the FSSN would not be significant enough to overcome the geography and perception problems faced by all the Dakota schools. In my biased opinion, there are a few members of the Big Sky conference that are just too arrogant and image-conscious to ever swallow their pride and vote to expand to the flat wind-blown plains of North Dakota. It's a pity, NDSU, SDSU and (gasp) UND could be excellent members. It just ain't gonna happen.

Certainly the "elaborate fictiticious rationale" comment is an opinion, that's why I prefaced it with "as I see it". My contention is that: 1) Grand Forks, and for that matter the whole state of ND, is a relatively small market; 2) Big Sky has shown a clear preference for large metropolitan areas in the past, for instance Portland, Sacramento and Denver; 3) I'm unware of any official of the Big Sky Conference or a member institution ever making a comment regarding the FSSN, or any direct comment that UND is being seriously considered for membership. Points 1 & 2 are true on their face and don't require a link, no link is possible for point 3. If you have a link to disprove point 3, please provide it. Given all the facts available, is it possible that UND will be admitted to Big Sky without major changes to the conference's current membership? SURE. Is it likely? NO.

Let's see, Grand Forks area population ~95,000, Denver area population ~2.5 million. Is Denver apples and Grand Forks oranges, or the other way around?

You have offered no evidence whatsoever to support your argument - none. No quotes from BSC officials or anyone else in a position to know. You're fond of pointing out that "it's all about the dollars", and yet I see no estimate of the TV revenue that will actually flow to BSC member institutions from the FSSN should UND be granted membership. Your argument is based entirely on the speculation, jealousy and wishful thinking of a clearly biased observer. As I see it, you couldn't stand the obvious fact that NDSU is ahead of UND in its transition to DI by a large margin, so you invented this elaborate fictitious rationale to prove that, despite all evidence to the contrary, UND is really ahead of NDSU. Arguments simply don't get any more fallacious than that.

Are you suggesting that a Montana-UND match-up would generate a significant audience in SOUTH Dakota? BTW - The notion that FSSN will significantly ease UND's acceptance into a DI conference, or that posessing such a system would have significantly aided NDSU's transition is exactly what I am disputing. Your argument assumes the point at issue, and is therefore fallacious.

Again, you manage to completely miss the point. It is not about distribution systems - they can be created. UND has no proven ability to deliver viewers for any sport other than hockey, and the Big Sky doesn't sponsor hockey. Without viewers tuned in, it simply doesn't matter how many cities the FSSN theoretically reaches. Do you really think that people in Mobridge, SD are ever going to tune in the FSSN network? The Sioux don't even have the undivided loyalty of their home state.

Bottom line - UND can't deliver any TV market large enough to influence the Big Sky's decision making process. BTW - UND may "share" the Fargo market, but NDSU controls the market. UND cannot deliver the Fargo market, or the rest of North Dakota, to anyone.

A television market exists independent of the production facilities to reach that market. You can always build new production facilities, generating population growth is another matter. Because it is positioned in a larger city NDSU's potential TV market is larger than UND's, at least in all sports except hockey. But then the Big Sky doesn't sponsor hockey.

You understand the point. The FSSN is small potatoes. It will not make much of a difference. The same things that worked against NDSU and SDSU will work against UND. Barring an unexpected change in the status of current BSC membership, there will be no bid for UND. Wishful thinking and fanciful tales won't change that.

You do understand how foolish you will appear when none of this nonsense turns out to be true. You actually expect us to believe that the FSSN is apple of the Big Sky's eye??? As you said it all does come down to money - any school with a few bucks could duplicate the FSSN in short order. Where the money comes from is the MARKET not the facilities. UND's potential TV market is tiny, folks in Sacramento and Portland will laugh at it.

There's the rub. Until UND has completed its transition, or NDSU is in an auto-bid conference, NDSU will not play a non-conference game at Alerus, or pay UND a dime to come to the FargoDome.

You're under the mistaken impression that I was referring to UND's refusal to play NDSU.

I don't think so. NDSU fans have a legitmate right to be indignant towards UND for its official behavior. The actions of a few fans does not change that.

Really??? I don't believe that NDSU has called any press conferences to denounce UND's move to DI. There's an enormous difference between the statements of a few delusional fans and those of the officials of a university. UND's official behavior towards NDSU in this matter has been nothing short of deplorable. You should expect a little blowback.

Oh, NDSU fans are being silly 5 year-olds when they treat UND exactly the same way UND fans treated NDSU just a couple years ago. Hmmm.....

What goes around comes around.

Couldn't disagree more about ND being a "Western" state. North Dakota, at least the Eastern part - where most of its residents live, has very, very strong ties to the city of Minneapolis/St Paul and the state of Minnesota. Stronger beyond compare than its ties to any other state or city.

You get the point. The Great West is a conference of convenience not of choice, none of its members would choose to be members if any real alternative existed. It is very likely that the GWFC will not exist in 10 years, perhaps not even in 5 years.

NDSU is a founding member of the Great West Football Conference - it is their conference as much as it is anyone's. The GWFC is little more than a scheduling convenience to its members. There really isn't one member that wouldn't leave in a flash if an opportunity presented itself.

The sky is blue on THIS planet. What planet do you live on?

I doubt if even you believe that nonsense!

I see no reason why two long-time rivals should "hate" each other. If you take a step back from your own biases and short-comings, you might find that it is possible to have a intense and spirited athletic rivalry without all the negative garbage. If you're wondering why the two schools don't play each other anymore just look in the mirror!