aff
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Posts posted by aff
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I think most people have just the basic cable where you get espn and espn2 and FSN. You can watch a college hockey game every week on fsn and you can watch a high school hockey game on that channel during the week. So with my basic cable I will have watched about 10 high school hockey games on FSN and had the opportunity to watch 5 or 6 aa football games, what does that tell you? This weekend UND will play at UM in hockey which will also be on FSN. Someone mentioned how UND plays michigan and it's not a big deal because they are known for there football. Well, it is still exciting and it fills the place up with avid hockey fans. That is ironic because I heard Amy Ruley say how exciting it was to play the big names in women's BB such as Alabama, Georgtown and Ball St. Now tell me which one of those is known for their women's BB. Hect, I guess the Ball St. game was exciting that the bison played in, they had 400 people watching it. I did a quick poll and asked 100 people if they knew which state that aa football champs appalachain St. was located in. 99% had no clue, 1% said somewhere with mountains around. I then asked 200 people which state Denver was located in. The first 100 people I asked were from all over the country and 99% of them said colorado, and that they remember watching them against UND on ESPN. The next 100 that I asked were from ndsu. 99% percent of them had heard about Denver as they watched them on ESPN against UND in the HOCKEY CHAMPIONSHIP, but they didn't know what state they were loctaed in. Damn geography classes at ndsu. It's funny, nobody knows where apple st. is including myself. Seriously, what state is it in?
What that tells me is that you are watching T.V. in Grand Forks ND. Remember there are other places in the nation that have different channels. There are other people besides north dakotan's. Nice poll by the way. Why didn't you ask who the last D-I hockey champ was. I bet you get the same number of correct answers as that D-IAA champ. Oh wait, that great proof, people know where Denver is? I guess hockey is most popular. I mean thats why Denver is popular right? Hockey? Oh wait, most people have never even heard of the University of Denver, and just know where the city is. Why didn't you ask who the last hockey champion was? And where is this poll. I'm sure it is completly objective, coming from a Sioux Fan.
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It's fairly common knowledge that the most popular sport on the campus of the University of Minnesota is in fact hockey. It's pretty easy to get tickets to a Golden Gopher football or bouncey-ball game, not so easy to get tickets to a Golden Gopher hockey game.
Wow, I thought for sure that there were around 40,000 people per game for the gophers football, around 10-15000 for basketball, and 5000-12000 for hockey. Check the U of M site, its not hard. I guess all of those people don't know that gophers hockey is the most popular sport on campus. In fact, out of the three hockey looks to be the least popular. I can't believe I found evidence refuting your post, especially considering you had the proof of saying "its fairly common knowledge". It's probably fairly common knowledge in North Dakota that the U of M's most popular sport is hockey, but people actually in Minneapolis have different ideas I guess. Nice try though.
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No, it's only about as big as D-2 football... and that isn't as big as NCAA hockey. Sorry if that hurts your feelings, but it's the truth. On a level of national recognition, UND and NDSU are both somewhat known for their football teams. UND's hockey team gets more recognition than the Sioux and Bison football teams combined. I wonder why ESPNU would fail to show a couple of D-1AA football playoff games if it's so huge? They showed each and every game of the NCAA hockey tournament. If D-1AA football was just as big if not bigger than they wouldn't have deprived the viewers of that extra game or two after showing every game of the hockey tournament.
I'm not really sure how you are managing to equate D-II football with D-IAA football? Average attendance? Number of T.V. games? Average attendance of schools and alumni from each division? National recognition? All of these catagories point to D-IAA being much more popular than D-II. How many D-II schools have 23,000 fans per game? If you want an easy comparison just look at the number of members on any given saturday vs. D-II football.com. There is no comparison. Sure thats not scientific research, but I think you can get the general idea from it. Maybe in the future when you make claims like DI-AA football is only as big as D-II football you could actually come up with some sort of evidence to back it up. Remember that just say "sorry if that hurts your feelings, but it's the truth" doesn't make it the truth. In fact before I even read the whole post, I knew that was a lie or incorrect because that sentence was in there.
As for hockey's popularity, I think most UND fans are making an incorrect assumption. Everyone talks about being "D-I" and playing the big schools like minnesota etc., but when they say that they don't really talk about why that school is considered a big school. It's because of their D-IA football team, D-I basketball team, and Big 10 conference exposure. Those things are the reason you get excited about playing them, and being mentioned in the same breath as them. Think about it. Why are you more excited to play minnesota than Duluth in Hockey. A conference game maybe. More tradition maybe. But mostly because everyone has heard of minnesota, and nobody has really heard of Duluth. And why have people heard of michigan? Because of football, and basketball and Big 10 play. But Sioux Fans usually try and translate that popularity to hockey, which is incorrect. Hockey isn't a reason that minnesota has national notoriety, major sports are. Just because you play minnesota doesn't put you on the same level as them, although most schools are able to sell it off to their fans that way. Just because you play a big 10 school in hockey doesn't mean that hockey is popular around the country.
I don't know how you could even come to the conclusion that hockey is more popular from the simple numbers. How many hockey schools are their in the country? 60 or 70? How many DI-AA football schools are in the country? Over 100. What geographical area is hockey located in? The north of the country. What geographical area is D-IAA football located in? The entire nation. From just fans of the universities, D-IAA should be more popular. If you are talking about casual fan interest than I think that both of you are wrong. There is hardly any interest from so called casual fans of either sport. If you go most places in the country and ask them who has a D-I hockey team, I bet you money they can't come with much, or know almost anything about hockey. Go to Kansas and ask a person if they know what "icing" is in hockey. They will have no idea. But you're telling me that their is this great interest in hockey? Sorry, but most of the country doesn't have any idea. Same with D-IAA football. Ask a casual fan what teams are in D-IAA football, and the look you're going to get is WTF is D-IAA football. Even most fans in the dakotas still have no idea what the difference is. Just look at Argus leader articles in SDSU's move up. They were still talking about DI-AA basketball in the move up after SDSU had moved. And these are sports editors. But thats casual fans. If you're talking about hardcore, fans that will actually follow hockey and D-IAA football, then D-IAA has got to win simply from having more schools and more alumni following the events.
While I'm writing things that are going to get me ripped, can someone even tell me how hockey is considered a D-I sport? Correct me if I'm wrong, but their are more D-II schools than D-I schools in Hockey, aren't there? Shouldn't that mean that hockey is classified as D-II, and minnesota etc are playing down a level? I suppose that would never be allowed to happen by the bigger schools playing, but still, it doesn't seem right to me. It also seems rediculous that schools in the NSIC are capable of fielding a team in anything that is considered D-I. These schools aren't even able to fully fund D-II football, D-II basketball etc., but somehow they can be D-I in a sport? I'm sorry if it offends anyone, but Duluth and mankato are not on the same level as U of M, and shouldn't ever be considered in the same sentence. I understand that you have to have these schools to get a full division, but there has to be a better way. Maybe have more interdivisional games, and then keep teams in their respective divisions for championships. I don't know, it just doesn't seem right to me.
P.S. In a response, some please quote the part that says "I don't know" and write thats right, you don't, as if its the most clever response ever. Why respond with in-for-mat-ion when you can just attack the messenger. So much easier right?
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Thanks for the advice.
Sorry PCM, I don't know how I could be so rediculous. Is there going to be a meeting soon about how this defamation money is going to be spent? My idea is to use it to use it lure Phil Jackson away from the Lakers, then use UND's basketball success to join either the Big 10 or Big 12. We can decide between the two by seeing which one wants to give UND the most money for the honor of joining their conference. I heard from a reliable source that the big 12 has already agreed to give UND all of the basketball tournament revenues for the next 10 years, and half the BCS bid money that comes into the school. And to think that awhile ago people were woried about keeping our mascot. What a bunch of idiots. I mean it was so blatantly obvious that we would win a defamation suit against the NCAA over that. Just look at all of the newspaper articles discussing how the defamation suits would play out in court. Apparently some people in "the main stream" have never heard of such a law suit and think that we probably are going to lose alumni dollars based on what happens with our naming issues, but here in fighting sioux land we know that we are going to make millions off of this. I credit the foward thinking of the new AD for this move, obviously planned ahead of time to get us into the Big 12.
HAPPY?
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What makes the finances all the more interesting is that damages get tripled in the case of an antritrust violation. What would be UND's compensation from the NCAA for 3 times the negative publicity value in the New York Times, Washington Post, and on Nightline for falsely representing UND as hostile and abusive?
UND Shopping list:
1. Trust fund for DI scholarships
2. Indoor practice facility
3. American Indian Museum / Student center
4. Biolab
5. other ?
You guys haven't even beat the name issue yet, and you're already discussing uses for $100 million worth of projects that are going to be funded by the NCAA. Incredible. You would NEVER win an antitrust / liable suit against the NCAA, unless you know something that the Marquette law students / teachers along with the other scores of teams that have changed their names couldn't figure out, but I guess I shouldn't intrude with reality for you guys. My advice: Work on winning the name issue. If UND can get out of that unscathed they should thank their lucky stars.
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I was wondering which of the four choices are in the best shape after a couple of years of change. I would say that UNC is in the best shape since they found a good league and seem to be in a desireable location to at least be fairly successful at a low level of d1. NOt sure about the level of support they have but at least they have a league.
As for the other 3 choices thus far I would put NDSU in 2nd place bc while they don't have a league they seem to have more funding and better facilities in place to be successful and have nice support. No league though and really don't look like they are that close to league membership either.
I would put sdsu and the ncc as tied with both having lots of issues to work thru.
Sdsu has to find a league and improve facilites and while their fanatics think the mid continent is on the horizon I am not sure of that at all. They don't really fit the mid cont profile and that league could just as easily decide to expand (if they expand at all) southward instead of north. If the ncc can get an 8th school (which isn't assured) and get the 2 washington schools then I would move them ahead of sdsu. For now a tie and maybe the ncc a little behind sdsu in terms of outlook but I will call it a tie.
1. UNC 2. NDSU 3. sdsu and ncc
What? Why are you comparing a league of schools to three individual schools? What comparison is there to make? This has to be the most idiotic post I've read in a long time. If you want to say the other schools are doing bad, just come out and say, don't try to incorporate it into some retarded question.
Hey rank these in order by how their doing... University of Sioux Falls, The NFL, The chicago Bulls, and the U.S. olympic basketball team.
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No offense guys, but the general feeling I get from this board is that everyone wants a new president because they feel that the President would take UND to D-I athletics.
Looking at UND's current financial situation that I know of:
1. Revenue sounds pretty maxed out
2. Running a deficit
3. Using tuition waivers instead of actual scholarships at D-II levels
How is it possible for UND to go D-I in the next 10 years. Do you think this president is going to show up with a truckload of money to pour into D-I athletics? I think its more likely that he's going to show up, look at whats going on with your athletic programs and make USD like cuts to get the athletic program budgeted, and then work on eliminating tuition waivers for all programs. I would pray that a president doesn't show up and just go full steam ahead into D-I athletics, and I'm sure the ND board of regents (or your equivalent) wouldn't appreciate the new president immediately running UND into a million dollar deficit in athletics, to be paid for by the academic side of the university. More likely they will attempt to compete like USD has, by raising standards academically, except UND will have an advantage, already being the largest University in the state. Just my thoughts, please don't reply with a bunch of garbage about NDSU (that I don't even care about).
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I have never once said that UND is in a better financial situation to go DI than NDSU as well as most people on this site have never said that. It has been made known to everyone that MONEY is the biggest hurdle to UND going to DI. UND has stated this from day one. The only thing I can think of that people may have said is that NDSU won't have the money to renovate the BSA for quite some time because they will be too busy trying to raise money just to cover the scholarships. If UND were to go DI we would not have to worry about money for facilities. That does not mean we are in better shape financially. If someone has said things to you otherwise take it up with them personally. BTW, women's hockey is going fine.
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I'm sure that women's hockey is fine, I was just wondering if that was fully funded yet? Last I heard it wasn't. If thats true you guys have to admit you have a Sh*t load of financial problems to solve if your going to be D-I.
Also, dakotaboy, if your representitive of sioux fans about the funding issue for D-I (Saying that you think its your major hurdle) it sure is funny how the thread for financial info. on the move is one page, and the thread on conferences and how UND would compete is 11 pages. To an outside of observer it looks alot like you guys aren't worried about the financial part, despite not having a Carr report, or anyway that I can think of to increase your revenue.
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I have a question for sioux fans how can some of you say you are in a better financial postion then ndsu when according to the numbers from 03-mid04 you are 400,000 in the red and ndsu is 40,000 in the red. i am just wondering because i have heard that alot not so much on here but in talking to sioux fans face to face
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HAHA, funny how nobody wants to address this question. I would also ask about how funding womens hockey is going. Don't worry Sioux Fans, just keep going on other forums and saying how you are more prepared for the transition though. If you say it enough maybe it will come true.
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"It's not a pretty picture," he said. "I don't think we could all of the sudden shift $3 or $4 million into athletics, so we'd probably either cut sports or play as poor competitors in some.
Man, with quotes like that I'm sure the big sky presidents are calling around trying to make sure that UND is in the sky. Whats your president thinking saying stuff like that in an NCAA magazine that I'm sure the big sky presidents all read?
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Keeping with the theme of the last few posts (UND vs. SDSU in appeal to BSC), I am not real sure you can say that SDSU has a big edge over UND, relating to basketball.
We must be on a UND site to read that. You lost to Mary by 30 last season. SDSU has an arena almost double your size, newly remodled inside, 4th most appearances all time post season, the most NCC championships of any school, the only national championship, and thats just for the men.
Not that any of that matters. Do you really think the big sky is going to pick schools based on this season, or the past 5, or past 10? No, there going to pick according to the financial ability of the schools to compete, how the school fits in academically with the other schools, and the geography (Amazing how those are the three criteria they already laid out). I didn't ever hear them say the criteria were 1. # football national championships 2. Basketball Championships 3. Overall conference football record last 10 seasons, yet some of you think that those are the criteria. What advantage does UND have over SDSU that would make the big sky throw SDSU, a school already commited to D-I away, and go after UND, a D-II school? UND is screwed for funding with womens hockey, plus adding other sports to sponsor all big sky sports, plus adding scholarships. Thats why they didn't go D-I with SDSU and NDSU, and thats why the big sky isn't "recruiting" UND.
And Starcity, Davis and Poly have already been offered a big sky invite, and both turned it down. That isn't going to change any time soon. The four schools that will/ might be added are UNC, SDSU, NDSU, SUU. UND isn't in there no matter how many times you guys say it is on this board.
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Aff:
Maybe you need to take your argument to Kolpack and the Fargo Forum. They're the ones putting out the "crap" that you find distasteful. Here's Kolpack's quote from yesterday:
I don't have any problem with Kolpack (Even though hes an idiot) and the forum, beucase the quote was refered to under "Rumors flying around the northern plains". I have no problem admitting that it is a rumor, as you can read on this forum. I do have a problem when people start refering to this rumor as a fact as several people have on this forum.
This whole rumor was started by someone in North Dakota, maybe Kolpack himself, that wants desperately to see the UND/NDSU rivalry reinstated, and doesn't have any problem coming up with an number illogical ways that it could occur.
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So basically what you're saying is that the first school to go dI must necessarily be the most financially capable? I think you'd have a hard time convincing anybody other than SDSU fans that SDSU is more financially capable than UND to make the jump. I guess that means UNC was the most financially capable of all since they went a year earlier than NDSU and SDSU.
So, what your saying is that SDSU isn't going to get into the big sky because they aren't financially ready, but UND, who is less prepared because of lack of planning, women's hockey etc. is going to get in? Genius. I can't believe the crap I read on this site.
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Wow, SDSU is in Sioux Falls? When did this happen? There's a lot of UND fans in Fargo, too. So what? UND is in Grand Forks. SDSU is in Brookings. End of story. The only thing that saved Brookings from being the worst town in the NCC was Vermillion.
The only thing that the big sky cares about for cities is population in a proximity to the area, so they know that there will be a decent population base, and business base, so that there is the ability of the school to sell tickets. I think that Sioux Falls more than provides this to SDSU. If you don't believe me, look at last weeks argus leader where they are using SDSU bringing bball games to sioux falls as a reason they need a new convention center. To say that "SDSU is in brookings, and thats not as good as X, so they won't get into the big sky" is stupid.
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Realisitically, UND and NDSU are also much more comparable academically than NDSU and SDSU, at least as I see things
What? SDSU and NDSU are practically the same school, as they are the "State" universities, and so they have similar majors. The only difference between the two is that SDSU was Tier 3 with UND in the report you guys like to cite, and NDSU was Tier 4 (Not that the ratings matter much).
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Realistically, if it came down to SDSU vs UND, Brookings vs Grand Forks for the Big Sky, it has to be a no-brainer even given the "head start" that SDSU has on UND. Facilities wise it is not even close. Their football stadium is an eyesore at best. With football being the Big Sky's big thing, that has got to go against them, not to mention the fact that their football program has been stuck in the lower tier of the NCC for 20+ years and hasn't progressed at all in nearly that entire period. Frost Arena is getting old, it has be about 30 years old right now, and everytime I have left there I have had to pick wooden splinters out of my butt because that is about all the seaters there are, high school style wood bleachers. At this point their funding has to be seriously in question based on their scholarship "increases" they put into effect for this year. Are they going to make a big leap and bump up the football scholarships by 3 next year to get them at 43?? And call me crazy, but I have to think that their AD's recent legal troubles cannot help them out as an athletic department either. The town of Brookings, well, you get the point. If, for a spot in the Big Sky, it came down to UND vs SDSU, UND would be sitting pretty well IMO.
Are you guys actually saying that the school that didn't originally want to go D-I (UND) is better off financially to make a move than the school that wanted to immediately jump to D-I (SDSU). Thats an interesting theory. So you know, SDSU already has a plan to be at 63 in 2009. The scholarships are going to go up much faster after this year, because this year they used money to make sure they were title 9 complient. If heard that the scholarships are probably going to go up faster than originally anticipated also, because the endowment is already half finished. What makes you guys think that UND has the money to make 60 scholarshps in 3 years? If they did, why didn't they move with NDSU?
Second, should you be comparing UND grand forks, and SDSU brookings, or SDSU Sioux Falls. Its forty minutes away, guys, I'm a student at SDSU and I go there at least once a week. I think everyone here already knows that sioux falls makes grand forks look like a dump. Besides that, Brookings definetly wouldn't be the worst in the big sky as cities go...
Just so you know, the inside of frost was remodeled this summer, the wood "highschool" bleaches are gone now. Go to the website and take a look.
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Not smack here, I'm really curious. I haven't seen any updates on the UND athletic site about new recruits this year. Have you guys signed anybody yet? I read the above post and I was curious as to who the JUCO guard is.
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To illustrate, if NDSU and SDSU combo are added for the 2006 season, and Sac State and Portland State later decide to join the WAC for 2007, the Big Sky loses its autobid. Not only that, but since they wouldn
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The Big Sky also faces the difficulty that there are so few expansion options near or within its region beyond 2008. Face it: SDSU politically needs to show its legislature and Board of Regents that some conference is interested in it, now, as a conference member. The Big Sky is more than happy to oblige, as it might truly need more Div I members in 2008 and beyond. The whole media display about expansion (highly unusual for a conference to publicly air its expansion intentions) is all about helping Miller, Oien, Taylor, & Chapman maintain a charade that the Big Sky
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A couple of further comments from yesterday:
From the Big Sky press release, there was one especially curious statement:
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If both of these leave, you have to take SDSU/NDSU or fb will be screwed up.Because Sac State or Portland State could leave, the Big Sky is practically forced to add schools within a year.The Great West gets a potentially mortal blow, certainly to their auto bid. (Sac State would like this, as it would damage Cal-Davis -
Yeah, and if the Big Sky is moving into the eastern Dakota's, Altitude's coverage area certainly doesn't anticipate it:
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DISH Network will broadcast Altitude to customers in Colorado, Wyoming, Utah, Montana, Idaho, Nebraska, Kansas, western South Dakota, northeastern Nevada and northern New Mexico.
I hate to be the one that tells you, but the Eastern south/north dakota media markets, huge as the are
, aren't that hard to break into. The company is already broadcasting in western south dakota, its not that hard to go over the missouri. If I was using your logic I would have posted a thread that said that SDSU is in the sky for sure, because theres a broadcast deal for south dakota. As for broadcasting in colorado, I don't understand why you think thats such a big deal. Where do you think all of the graduates of big sky schools work when they graduate? Podunk, Montana, or Denver, Colorado. I don't have proof, but I would think that most college graduates in the denver area have graduated from the big sky schools. Anyway, I doubt that a network is hoping that its going to produce enough ratings by broadcasting bball games from a school that averages around 1000 fans per game in a major media market. How about you reply to this list star city, and than i'll believe you about denver:1. Why is the big sky going to allow a school that doesn't sponsor football, track, cross country etc. into its all sports conference?
2. Why would denver show interest in a conference that doesn't sponsor its swimming events, which already have a home.
3. Why would UNC have a change of heart about its baseball teams getting into the midcon, when the midcon is discussing expansion. After the last meeting of the midcon, I think that UNC is less likely than ever to go to the big sky.
4. The big sky is worried about portland and sacstate leaving. If denvers in the conference there going to be in a mess if these two leave (dropping to 7 for fball). Why wouldn't they just take SDSU, NDSU, and call it good, since they'll be safe if both schools leave then.
I have several more reasons, but I'm tired of typing, and this message is getting too long, so I'll post more later.
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Sure, being in a conference takes care of a bit over half of the schedule, but the hard part would be to secure the rest of the 8 or so mandatory D1 games
From the grand forks paper:
"The lack of home games won't be as big of a problem in two seasons. Manhattan, Butler, Denver, Missouri-Kansas City, Tennessee State, Southeast Missouri State and Wisconsin-Milwaukee will play SDSU in Brookings in the 2005-06 season."
Thats 7 home games, I'd be willing to be that SDSU could find an additional 4 or 5 away D-I games over the next two years to give it an RPI rating. This may already be what Nagy is planning.
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That is the very effect it would have to Mid-Con teams. Why would the conference risk, in the NCAA's eyes, cutting each team in the league's schedule by at the least 2 games, and in some cases 4 games by bringing in 2 teams to an established conference when they are in NCAA and RPI pergatory
I was under the impression that after the 04-05 season SDSU and NDSU would count for RPI just like any other school. I have read comments from Coach Nagy that SDSU would be eligible for the NIT the season after this (doubtful that they would be invited though). I think that the only punishment a school has after the first year is that it can't go to the NCAA's. After next season they should count just like any other D-I basketball school for the RPI.
Women's BB
in Women's Basketball
Posted
How does D III Mcmurry get ranked above Tennesse, Ohio St., Purdue etc.? I know it is just a ranking, but something needs to be adjusted for SOS if a DIII school is ranked higer than Connecticut.